Foot cramps - I've tried all tips, so please help!

A snowHead

JackAbroad, there are enormous numbers of places - in Austria, Switzerland, France and Italy - where you can enjoy some uncrowded, gentle skiing, plenty of nice red runs, etc etc without paying a fortune on lift passes etc. Lech is an expensive resort to visit - no cheap package deals there. But lots of cheaper places in Austria.

Sounds as though your best bet would be to go somewhere with a good ski school. If you're not on too tight a budget have a look at Simon Butler Skiing in Megeve, where lessons are all included and arranged, and you'd also probably find others to ski with. Megeve is a cruisy intermediate paradise with beautiful views of Mont Blanc. Best go after the French school hols (ie not before 13 March).

A snowHead

Good to hear that all went much better for you. I found that a custom made SIDAS Conform'able (fully foamed option, not cheap) helped considerably with these sorts of problems I had years ago. Together with a less aggressively moulded footbed and DD blocks to stabilise the heel helped too.

It's quite tricky, but getting the correct shell for your feet (a boot fitter in the league of Jamie Neill would get this right) is essentially the key. Get this right and you wont need to 'crank' the boots up and distort your feet to a contorted nightmare. Sometimes it seems more of an art than a science.........

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I've had lessons for 80% of the time I've skied before I went to Selva - blame the instructors, maybe, but I've spent a lot of money to learn how to ski the right way.

I didn't want to be one of those out of control idiots who think being able to go 100mph down a black slope out of control means that you can ski. I have taken an instructor for every holiday I've had.

The problem has been that my foot pain stopped me from skiing too much, so I didn't or couldn't practice what I learnt.

This was the first skiing holiday without an instructor as I wanted to practice, practice and practice. In my last day, I spent a long time on the slopes (previously not possible because of ice and my inability to ski on it) and even got down from the top of the slope to the car before my missus, who is a far better skier than I am. The reason? I skied the slope for a long time that day and felt confident. If I had another week, I would have been ready to take on an instructor again to help me to the next level.

I'm not stupid - I feel a certain obligation towards the proper skiers to learn how to ski the right way and it's probably set me back in the short run, but hopefully helped me in the long run. I also play football once a week "back home" and don't want to injure myself, which is a huge part in my attitude towards how I ski. I don't take many risks as I don't want to fall at high speed. I know that I'm not ready to ski fast as when I do, I don't feel that I'm good enough to control myself. This will change with experience and practice. I love playing football but at 41, I won't be able to play for much longer at this level, so possibly I'm ultra-cautious and over-cautious. I'm concentrating on being a bit better each holiday that I ski and eventually, I will be a good skier. Maybe it will take me 5 or 10 years, but I'm happy with that as long as I don't have the foot pain that I previously had.

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Pam, that sound like a great idea. I don't live in UK anymore so package tours from there are out of the question. Do you know if Simon Butler's places accommodate those who don't fly from UK please?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

JackAbroad, Simon Butler ski packages don't include travel, I think - so would be ideal for you. Megeve is quite close to Geneva airport. Not much more than an hour's drive. Have a look at their website http://www.simonbutlerskiing.com

I've not stayed with them, and have no connection, but have heard good things.

Your dead right about skiing in control - me too. I'm a great deal older than you. I don't play football but intend to continue skiing for a long while yet.

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And thinking about it, many of the UK tour operators will happily sell you an "accommodation only" package, leaving you to arrange your own travel.

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JackAbroad, I really hope more comfortable boots helps you get sorted ( and I know that pain and how it really f*cks things up), but I genuinely believe you are deluding your self - hw many weeks skiing did you have before this trip - around 3?

After all it is free

Why do you think I'm deluding myself? I've only skied about 5 weeks in total but surely you improve at a fast rate when you're a beginner. From the first day to the second day to the third etc. I've notice huge jumps in my skiing when I'm able to spend a whole day on the slope, but because of my foot pain, I was rarely able to do that. In Selva, I had far less foot pain, but the ice screwed things up.

I really felt like a total beginner on some of the slopes in Val Gardena as I was certainly one of the slowest out there. I wasn't the worst skier, but certainly slow! Only in the last day or so was I comfortable enough to "overtake" the beginners!!! I'm sure it will come with more time on the slopes and more patience.

JackAbroad, yes you can improve at a fast rate when you are a beginner, but you are past that 1st day to 2nd day stage. At this point many poeple stop having lessons (I was one of them), and yes you manage to get round (some of) the resort and get down harder slopes but are easily put off by poor conditions (as you were) and tricky sections (as you were). I had lessons for the first few weeks that I skied then nothing for the next 10 years or so. Looking back I wasted so much money on fancy holidays (including 6 to Canada and the US because "conditions are better out there") because I was no better a skier there than anywhere else and I was limited by my own lack of skill. I couldn't ski the same runs as my husband. I had to keep stopping when things got a bit tricky. There were tears aplenty if there were suddenly hard or icy patches, or it it was a bit steep, or if it was a bit bumpy. I took my skis off in one place and went down on my backside is it was "so dangerous". I lost confidence and didn't ski the rest of the week. In Tremblant there was an ice storm one night, subsequent conditions were "really dangerous" I skied one run and said that's it no more, the truth is that conditions weren't great but after a day or two they would have been fine.

Like you, I felt like a total beginner many times and I was nearly always the slowest out there, but it's not about speed (I'm still usually the slowest in any group) it's about having the skill to ski safely anywhere you want on the mountain. Your confidence does improve over the course of a week as you get more slope time, but with lessons it can improve over the course of a couple of hours.

Four years ago I decided that I was going to either continue to scuba dive (having just done my PADI open water) or improve skiing, I couldn't afford both. I decided on skiing and discovered snowHeads. I booked onto the EoSB 2007 and took lessons; I improved. I then booked onto the PSB 2007 and took lessons; I improved. I went on my holiday with my husband (no lessons) and the difference was palpable. I could keep up and I did my first black run. Since then I have skied around 4 weeks a year. I take lessons at the start of the season and at the end. I have also had a couple at Hemel Hemstead and I did a week's skills clinique at Les Dex Alpes in July 2 years ago.

I don't go to ski-school, I have private lessons which I share with folk of a similar standard (ski buddies I have met through snowheads). Our last lessons have been moguls and off-piste. We choose what we want to work on and the intructor focusses on that. None of us could have done moguld and off piste safely or with any confidence if we hadn't had instruction. Now we ski pretty much where we want (within reason), we barely look at a piste map, if it's black we go down it (although I am a wuss on Trolles in Tignes but at least I don't cry at the top any more!), if it's mogulled we go down it - and we enjoy it. If the conditions are poor we either go higher/go to a different part of the mountain or we pack in and have a beer - it doesn't matter what we do because we do it through choice not through lack of skill or confidence.

I'm not saying that I don't have my moments, some will remember a right paddy the other year getting back to Les Boisses in Tignes - mojo well and truly lost - but I got over it and am a better skier now than I was then. I'm not a great skier, I'm an ok skier and will continue to improve as long as I take lessons.

You say you are happy for improvement to take "5 or 10 years", well I wish you luck and hope you enjoy skiing in the future - it's just that you could get so much more out of it so much more quickly with good lessons. By the way, I am 50 and my buddies are around your age - we mostly started skiing later in life so we are similar to you in that respect. See here for another snowHeads experience with only 1 lesson on an indoor slope http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?p=1688673#1688673 (BTW - the faller in the video further down the thread is one of my mogul lesson buddies - she is a very good skier, has skied for years, continues to take lessons and skills clinics and laughs her socks off when she falls over!)

It has taken me half an hour to write this, I hope you take in the spirit it is meant - to show that my last post was not a throw away remark, and to genuinely share experience that might help you enjoy your next ski trip if you do decide to have lessons.

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Thanks holidayloverxx for the detailed explanation - what you wrote really makes sense.

I didn't take an instructor this time as I wanted to really practice the things I had been taught on previous holidays - mainly bending my knees more and not turning my body so much. Once I'd worked that into my system and perfected it a little more, I was then going to take an instructor again so that I'm not learning the same things over and over. Unfortunately, I didn't get enough skiing time on the slopes to do what I wanted/needed until the last day or so. This is one of the reasons that I'm hoping to get away for at least another 10 days sometime again this season.

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought that having an instructor for a few days and then go away and practice what he's taught me would be the right way to do it. I've been a little unlucky with instructors as one was an alcoholic whose English wasn't good (in Meribel) and the other just wanted to stop every 5 minutes for a coffee (in Verbier) so I didn't feel that I was getting the right help. Next time I go somewhere, I will take your advice and get an instructor for a few days again or go on an organised tour with instructors included. I might also see if anyone here can recommend an instructor when we've decided where to go as that would make a huge difference too.

It's funny how confidence makes such a difference when skiing - there was one morning that I felt I could ski anything and was loving it. After lunch I was forced to take a hard, icy, but short black slope and then icy reds down to Sasslong and I never wanted to ski again! Mojo lost, as you said!

Anyway, thanks again for your time and advice. It is honestly really appreciated.

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holidayloverxx, aw, what a lovely and thoughtful post. Said faller is not a very good skier but, aside from that, endorses every single word. I hope JackAbroad takes heed.

Edit: oops, sorry, I see you've now posted.

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JackAbroad, you will find loads and loads of recommendations for good instructors on here. There's even a special sticky thread:
http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=5129
though people don't always remember to post their good experiences on it.

holidayloverxx, great post. I think a lot of us could relate to what you have written. I too have had a lot of good quality instruction in recent years - including the ski clinic in Les Deux Alpes, which was terrific, and despite being an OAP am now a much better skier as a result. As in many activities, the more you know, the more you know you don't know. I get discouraged sometimes by my skiing, watching an instructor from a chairlift, or watching Frenchmen in their early 20s doing the moguls, or skiing with one of my sons, who is terrific. I know how much my skiing lacks. Similarly with French - I have lessons, I read French novels (easy ones.....) and watch a bit of TV and realise how poor I am. But if I stop looking just at instructors and look at the ordinary punters I tell myself that I do ski better than the average Brit (or French for that matter) holiday maker and I speak French a lot better than the average Brit holiday maker - but when I was an average Brit holiday maker I didn't understand skiing at all, and didn't know how much I didn't know. wink

I have friends who stopped lessons after their first few holidays, and they ski no better now than they did 20 years ago, despite skiing every year. In fact, because they're older and less fit, they probably ski worse. Mind you, skiing with them is very good for my ego. wink

The suggestion I made about Simon Butler skiing should be helpful for JackAbroad because he would meet others keen to improve. I remember the buzz of that, when I did a course in Tignes yonks ago, with the predecessor company to "Inspired to Ski". It was a specialist ski week and I was in one of the lower groups (the top group already all had basic instructor qualifications) and it was great to be with people who were keen to improve, and also keen to share their knowledge (the woman I shared a room with was an instructor on a dry slope, and taught me how to wax skis). It was a revelation, compared to being in an ordinary chalet with folks who really wanted to do nothing more than cruise around and were not really interested.

Until you ski at a good level, pottering round on your own really does little or nothing to improve your skiing, unless you are strongly motivated to do focussed exercises. Even having lessons is of limited utility unless you practice the specific things you've been given to do, not just cruise around on easy slopes (or get yourself "somehow" down hard ones).

JackAbroad I noticed the Simon Butler ski site has some very good last minute offers on at the moment!

You know it makes sense.

Hurtle, holidayloverxx, another SHs clique; middle-aged ladies addicted to ski lessons? wink

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

But I'm not middle aged or a lady Wink

Ps - thanks Pam for your thoughts too!!!

A snowHead

JackAbroad, the rest of us are wink

A snowHead

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

You may need 'proper' footbeds (orthopaedic?) - footbeds moulded to your feet are fine if your feet are 'ok' but.....

I've had foot pain in my left foot (left only) both walking a golf course and skiing in several custom fit boots - both pairs with 'custom' footbeds.

Last ski trip we were in Davos - and as a last resort I splashed out on another pair of boots from Heierling.
Part of their fitting includes standing and making squatting moves on a balance/force plates (?) - anyway these measure where your pressure on your feet is, and how/where your centre of gravity moves etc. Found out I naturally stand with excess pressure towards the outside of my left foot.... he then made footbeds to CORRECT this (as well as mould to your foot shape etc) and was amazed to ski for the following days without any of the old pain/discomfort. I only regret not taking several other pairs of shoes and golf shoes along to get extra footbeds made!

The 'solutions 4 feet' sounds promising as they have a trained podiatrist by the sounds of it ("With a Certified Pedorthist (C.Ped) on staff") - so would be well worth getting a good professional checkup of your feet etc...

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coops1967,

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

JackAbroad, I understand 'time spent wanting to practice'. I started out with lessons, but it took an injection of confidence before I could actually see their benefit. Now I tend to have periods with little instruction where I up the confidence level by practice followed by periods where I learn as much as I can having obtained the confidence to do the lessons at a higher level. I'm in a learning phase at the moment. I had a day session at Hemel Hempstead indoor slope recently and have more lessons booked on holiday in a few weeks time. I may well spend my 2nd holiday in April putting the lessons into practice. That said I do believe in lessons and expect that I will continue to mix and match lessons with practice as my skiing continues. I am certain that if you post what you want from a resort that the SH's can find some suitable cost effective locations to suggest for you too.

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pam w, vs. taking lessons during the holiday - any other suggestions being unprintable wink

After all it is free

JackAbroad, Your initial post is a mirror image of my own experiences in the early days, in fact I had 3 pairs of ski-boots, all which I blamed, and in hindsight there was probably nothing wrong with any of them, it was the way I was setting them up.

I have a really high instep, and didnt realise that was the case. I was forever getting cramp underside both arches and was clamping my boots too tight, the front 2 clips being clamped down too tight. It got to a point where I was in so much pain I went into a brilliant ski shop in St Anton and they sold me Tecnica boots with a custom insole and after 2 hours and a lot of fine tuning all was fine, no more cramps for 4-5 years until last season and the cramps came back. What had happened is that the custom insoles had deadenned and were no longerbeing effective in supporting my arch. A new pair made and all OK again, much better in fact because they have a flat heel underside and they can't roll inside my boots, therefore much more effective.

I cant stress enough the benefit of properly fitted boots and custom insoles.

*Ski* the Net with snowHeads

pam w, you are right, my self discipline only goes so far, whether that's as far as my wallet goes I don't know yet. Maybe if I'm feeling flush at the time and there is something organised for the Fbash I might take advantage. I will have to see how things go. Mind you it's great the OP got something out of their thread and had a good holiday nonetheless.

snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

Thanks all.
I'm a long time skier. I would say advanced. I grew up next to the mountains in Canada and so it has been a part of my life almost since I could walk. I have, for my entire ski life, cringed through the first half of every ski day. The ride up the lift usually gives me some relief. The terrain I ski demands tight boots because the slightest movement must be translated to the skis. Anything less could be tragic.
After a few different boots, and custom fitting and insoles, I gave up and have just accepted the pain. The ski shops here are good and so I just assumed it had to be weak foot muscles or something. I never really thought that maybe the fitters didn't get it right.
You have all inspired me to give it another shot.
I cannot imagine that I might actually love skiing even more!
Thanks all!

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Used to get it myself.

It's nothing to do with the boots. It's because you are trying to hold on to the mountain with your feet, its a natural reflex when you are not confident with your balance. It can be worse first thing because you are less confident.

Let your feet relax and use your ankles and knees to balance and the cramps will stop.

I am sure somebody else must have said this in the last 3 pages.

Help!!

Foot cramps - I've tried all tips, so please help!

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