 Poster: A snowHead
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Is a tachograph required for driving a 17 seater minibus across France to resort?
Anyone have any supporting links rather than just opinion
Thank you
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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holidayloverxx, Thank you not what I wanted to read tho our school mini buses haven't tachographs
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I think if a vehicle is legal in the country of registration then it is legal in all EU countries.
So if you havn't got one and you're legal here then you're legal in france
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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marcellus, the vehicle may be legal but the driver not? I believe that under the DLVA regualtions you have to have a different class of license for minibuses carrying more than 8 passengers.
1969jma, if you are who I think you are, try contacting your local authority transport depot for information. I remember talking to someone on this topic a while back and they were based in Bristol. The Bristol Transport depot (at Arnos Court) does have buses that meet all the legal requirements for continental driving.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Samerberg Sue, mmmm doesn't it carry to the driver too.... A 17year old can legally drive anywhere/everywhere in the UK but in France iirc you need to be older, yet a UK driver can still drive in France can they not?
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1969jma, if it is Nationally then it depends on the owner and the useage. If it is EU then tacho. One option is to take the seats out to take less passengers!
Providing you have 2 drivers then it should not be a problem but you will need tacho charts, or more probably, a digicard (about £40 each). They minibus will be limited to 100kmh by law (even without a tacho) so if you have 2 drivers and 2 digicards then it will make little difference. Digicard lasts 5 years so may come in handy. There are other documents you would regarding the trip Waybill), permission to drive etc
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marcellus, not quite as straightforward as that. When the legislation about seats and seat belts, number of passengers, etc changed I had to take a PSV driver's coursre and pass the practical driving test before I was allowed to use one of the authorities minibuses. All drivers of the school minibus had to pass the driving test but not necessarily take the course. We went from having all teachers who wanted to as drivers to just 4 of us, which a pain in the proverbials for the 4 of us who were the approved drivers.
I believe that 1969jma works (or worked) for the same authority, and I imagine that the regulations have got stricter since I left the UK. I was sure that the 2 drivers was also included. When we had to take groups up to Scotland they insisted on us having 2 authorised and trained drivers. It was why I contracted out of using the authority minibuses and used contracted coach companies in the end for the DIY school trips I organised.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Permission has been granted to drive the school minibus
3 drivers over 25 and D1 on their licence
The vehicle is quite old with no tachograph fitted
Frosty the Snowman, you certainly can't take seats out to make it acceptable, i tried that crossing from England to Wales failing miserably.
Anybody here work for the DVLA whom I shall be calling tomorrow
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It quite simple. To drive a something with more than 9 seats you need to take a few tests.
1 Theory test - Large Vehicle Hazard perception.
2 Theory test - Large Vehicle Driving.
3 Theory test - Passenger Carry Vehicle driving.
4 Practical exam - Passenger Carry Vehicle driving.
5 Theory exam - Certificate of Professional Competence.
6 Practical test - Certificate of Professional Competence.
You also need to take a medical
BUT there are exceptions for local authorities, charities, etc, so you would need to ask your work place as they will understand the rules and if you do or don't need to take all the tests. Having said that, from a parent’s point of view, would you really want someone driving a school minibus that couldn’t pass the easy tests ?
As you can see from the dates, the test are not hard - I passed the whole lot last year in 3 weeks as I bought 7 new 17 seaters.
The main reason people fail (so PRACTICE before you turn up ??) is the reversing section of the practical exam. You need to reverse around a bendy course and stop with the rear-overhang of the vehicle directly over a 1m wide strip on the floor. This is a pass or fail mark - so you really should do it loads of times "before" the test as it's a little tricky.
For the (many) theory exams, just get the DVLA book and learn it - all of it
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| 1969jma wrote: |
Permission has been granted to drive the school minibus
3 drivers over 25 and D1 on their licence
The vehicle is quite old with no tachograph fitted
Frosty the Snowman, you certainly can't take seats out to make it acceptable, i tried that crossing from England to Wales failing miserably.
Anybody here work for the DVLA whom I shall be calling tomorrow |
Then you are screwed.
The journey comes under EU/AETR rules and no tacho = No drivey
Wayne, is rigt on the ball but as far as I am aware most of the stuff he has done is not obligatory until Sept 2014...but is for new drivers that dont have the required licence classification.
If you want some light reading then http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/Transport_Theme_files/Passengercarrying_vehicles_tachograph_hours_0511.pdf explains it quite comprehensively... but is 52 pages long.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Frosty the Snowman,
The way it was explained to me by DVLA is that you need to pass all the tests and get the cards (4 of em) if the passengers have a right to board the vehicle.
So if someone pays for a trip that includes transport they have a right to board. If they pay for a trip without transport and you just give em a lift from the airport then they don’t.
This said; try arguing with a bored Italian cop at the side of the motorway at 3am. Hmmmm. Best bet is just to pass the tests. They really are easy.
I don’t have a clue what the rules are for schools but I think if you call DVLA they will give you the regs.
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Over 8 seats = tachograph required in france even if not for hire or reward. I have a friend who was given a severe warning by Le Rozzers in Brittany which was a good result really it could have been a large fine and vehicle going nowhere.
DO NOT ASSUME THAT BECAUSE ITS OK IN BRITAIN ITS OK IN FRANCE. The European Regs often lose or gain in translation.
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You know it makes sense.
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Hi
I am the Managing Director of BusyBus (www.busybus.co.uk) who specialise in minibus's and are VOSA regulated. Legislation regarding tachographs, CPC and special D1 or D driving licences are only applicable if you are using a minibus with more than 8 passenger (+1 driver) seats for HIRE AND/OR REWARD. If this is the case the vehicle will have either a GREEN (restricted) or BLUE (National) Operator Licence disc in the windscreen and you will need a professional driver who will be legislated to Eurpoean Driving Hour Regulations along with an International Operator Licence, a vehicle mainteneance shedule and lots and lots of insurance and legislation.
However, if you are using a minibus with upto 16 passenger (+1 driver) seats that is NOT for hire and/or reward, then none of the above applies and your driver can drive it on his domestic UK car licence as long as they passed thier driving test BEFORE 1996. They will have a "D1" permission with a "22" exception that means "not for hire or reward". This "D1" permission was removed for anyone who passed their test after 1996 and an additional driving test is required for those younger drivers.
Silly as it sounds, DO NOT try to manipulate of fiddle the "hire and/or reward" excemption. In other words, your driver must genuinally not be paid for driving (including tips) and the minibus must be hired on a transparent invoice where the group chips in equally (and can be proven). It is unlikely you'll be road-side checked but in the event of an incident or accident they will go through this with a fine tooth-comb and the penalties are certain prison.
Hope this helps.
Pete
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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But do they need s tacho 
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Poster: A snowHead
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This is confusing, as I was told this morning
If you have a D1 driving licence and not driving for hire or reward, you may drive across France on a UK Licence WITHOUT a tachograph
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I spent a LOT of time looking into this last year as we were driving out with a minibus. We were ok as we had 9 seats (allowed in France, 8 and under in UK) but you DO NEED A TACHO in France for your SIZE of vehicle.
The DVLA are next to useless for this kind of info.
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FAQ
