 Poster: A snowHead
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I see all these questions about boots, helmets etc not being allowed in airline hand luggage. Luckily I don't often have to fly to my ski resort, however, having seen it written, once again, about Grenoble I'm now thinking: "why?"
I get the bit about the hand luggage having to fit in the bag sizer so it goes in the overhead locker, but if your boots, helmet happen to conform with this (I perhaps wonder if they would, but for the purposes of argument lets assume they do) then why on earth do the airlines not permit their carrriage in hand baggage. I get the bit about no guns, knives etc, but what on earth do they expect you would do with a ski helmet? It's seem so ridiculous, when if you were to push the issue I can't see that they could object if you wanted to wear them on the 'plane. Does anyone know why there is a presumption against their carriage in many cases?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think it's because in extreme turbulence the overhead lockers have been known to open and deposit their contents on top of those in the seats below. A pair of ski boots falling on your head could end your holiday before it's begun!
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I always take my boots as hand luggage. I did have one objection from Aer Lingus (no problem on the way out, but they objected on the way home.) The wanted me to put them in the hold and pay 20 quid for an extra bag so I took of my trainers, put them in the bag and started to put the boots on. The girl realised how silly this was making us both look, so she gave in a let me carry them  - Not sure about a helmet though, but I would guess that they couldn't really object if you were wearing it - Just tell them you are a nervous flier and you need it in case you crash
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Jumper, I can understand that but the airlines don't seem to mind if you've got a load of heavy books in your hand luggage, they could do just as much damage 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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It is not the airlines who object to ski-boots in hand luggage it is the air-ports for reasons they say of security ie a ski-boot can be used as a weapon
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I carry my helmet in my back pack as hand luggage. Not had a problem. The backpack probably weighs more than the helmet.
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When I went to EoSB-08 from EMids I had boots in hand luggage. I asked Easyjet and they told me it was fine by them, but it wasn't up to them. They said it's the ground agents at each airport that make the decisions locally about such things. So I emailed (Servisair I think) and got a response telling me it would be fine. On departing, the security guy pulled me over and asked which airline and which destination - Easyjet-Geneva he said was fine. Last year though we were warned on the way out of Birmingham, and on the Ryanair flight to pack boots/helmets in hold baggage before getting to Grenoble on our way home. There were dirty great signs everywhere in Grenoble airport warning that if you got to security with either helmets or boots in hand luggage they'd be confiscated and destroyed . At check in they asked everyone if they had either in hand luggage and gave the opportunity to repack to put boots in hold luggage, so the queues were very slow moving.
Nobody seemed to have an official reason for the policy the consensus being "Dunno - security innit"!
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Megamum, because airport security are scum, would be my guess. IMO they are only a rung up from traffic wardens. The rules they apply bear scant relation to any laws (in some airports it's laptops out, leave liquids in, in others it's exactly the reverse), and their grasp of logistics and efficiency must be either nil or total, in that they know how to totally p1ss off passengers.
...er, is it just me? 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Megamum, The answer to your question ( and you would be right if you assumed the problem originated in '`the USA') is related to the airline's responsibility for safe carriage and the potential damage caused to folks by 'luggage' being so heavy as to cause damage to folks when it falls out of overhead lockers. That baseline has become distorted and vague over the last few years and why you get so many different interpretations .. but that basically is the background.
Edit - I frequently carry boots on board ... when I have ( a couple of times ) threatened to wear them, the problem disappears.
Edit of Edit ... it has nothing to do with security other than when, mistakenly, ( and that is 99% of the BAA employees ) they believe they have some responsibility for safe carriage. Ski Boots have NEVER been on the banned lists.
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Sat 21-11-09 18:14; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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primoz, Exactly .. the hypothesis is Bollox ! 
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It's the most ridiculous argument to say it's a "security" issue. Nowhere in the rules are "heavy items" banned. If they were there'd be a huge long list of items they'd have to ban...
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You know it makes sense.
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primoz, don't forget the danger of being stabbed with that freshly sharpened pencil Granny's doing her crossword with.... 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Agenterre, I know you have experience in airport management etc - and that might be how things started - but the "airline's responsibility" for safety in lockers idea would surely only make sense as the excuse if riverman and others were wrong. The problems are specific to airports rather than airlines. eg Heathrow fine - Bristol (I recall) not allowed.
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Poster: A snowHead
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the weight argument is specious, Easyjet for example specifically and clearly advertise that there is no weight limit on handluggage.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Quote: |
because airport security are scum,
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wtf? I doubt airport security is a career choice for those that do it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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stoatsbrother, Hence the nonsense .. I just looked at the Current AIRPORT security rules and I can not see how or where Ski Boots would be considered 'dangerous'.
Having said that there is no doubt that airport security staff at certain airports (Stansted, Bristol and Luton to name three that I have seen do it) enforce airline's hand-baggage rules ( that now appear to heave little to do with on-board safety but a lot to do with making money!) as if they were security rules. No denying it happens, and when you have a flight to make it's hardly the best time to start arguing the rights-and-wrongs of the situation!
PS .. I have never worked in airport management, I need a life too
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| under a new name wrote: |
| the weight argument is specious, Easyjet for example specifically and clearly advertise that there is no weight limit on handluggage. |
as long as you can lift it by yourself into the locker...
OMG - I'm off.... 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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So it would seem there is no real reason that anyone can think of that applies across the board for the items to be banned. It just seems to be at the whim of the airports and airlines. Why on earth doesn't someone (one of the big ski groups for example) knock some sense into these folks and get them to come up with a predictable and unchanging policy. I'm sure folks wouldn't mind complying it just knowing what to comply with. The airlines and airports don't seem to realise how awkward being inconsistent makes things for travellers.
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Michelle,
Colin Matthews
British Airports Authority
The Compass Centre,
Nelson Road,
London Heathrow Airport,
Hounslow
TW6 2GW
then only the independents to knock off 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Agenterre, we seem not to have a problem with BAA - Megamum needs the European and American details
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Michelle, oops .. my language skills not up to it !
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Butterfly wrote: |
| primoz, don't forget the danger of being stabbed with that freshly sharpened pencil Granny's doing her crossword with.... |
Oh yeah... another rule. No sharp pencils... especially not for Grannys and their crssword puzzles. They can use only dull ones from now on 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I'd put my money on:
1) these rules are made up by folks who are just control freaks and the more upset they can cause the better they feel.
2) boots and, especially, helmets can be considered as body armour and could be worn for protection while committing an attack.
Solution: put boots and helmets in your hold luggage and forget about them.
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altis, the problem with carriers such as Ryanair is that you have only 15Kg hold baggage allowance. Have you weighed ski boots - you're talking about 6Kg. A holdall or suitacase comes to another 3-4Kg leaving something like 5-6Kg for everything else.
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You know it makes sense.
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| altis wrote: |
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Solution: put boots and helmets in your hold luggage and forget about them. |
It would be no problem putting them in the hold if you thought the airline would get them out of the hold in the correct country at the other end. The amount of time and effort required to find boots and have them fitted, I would rather put my wife and kids in the hold and keep the boots on a seat beside me. I dont really care if they lose all my clothes. I can go to a shop and replace them in half an hour, but this isn't the case for a comfy pair of boots
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thornyhill, indeed - that as well!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Until we had our apartment, and left the skis, boots and now helmets there, I never had any difficulty in keeping the luggage under 15kg. If you are taking skis, put the ski clothes in there as protective packing and you will be fine.
As a matter of interest, how many of us have actually had our skis and boots lost by an airline? Have we had a poll on this?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I was kind of thinking about one of the big 'paid for' ski groups, how big are SCGB, or is there an international ski federation with any clout? It seems that there is lot of work, aggrevation and messing round being caused by something that seems to have no rhyme or reason to it. I wonder if one of the TV consumer programmes would take up the cause? Do other sports have similar problems?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The people with power are the tour operators. Who would prefer you to hire, as they make more money that way.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Helen Beaumont,
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As a matter of interest, how many of us have actually had our skis and boots lost by an airline? Have we had a poll on this?
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An excellent point. This arguement of airlines losing luggage is spurious in my view. Having taken at least 2 return flights per year for the last 25 years or so (skiing an dnon-skiing), I've never lost luggage on any leg of any flight to most of the major european airports and a few further-flung ones too.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Having done 50+ flights for the last couple of years, I've at least had my luggage lost 4 times. This is usually on multi-legged flights. Once, I saw my bag being offloaded before the last leg (as it should have been) only to have gone missing at my final destination. Frustrating, yes! But usually, they bring your bags to your end destination within 24hrs. So could be remedied by just renting skis/boots for a day.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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April (can't remember her SH name) had her skis in a SportTube lost by the airline on her way home to the US from EOSB-08. Don't know if they ever turned up but I am pretty sure she reported they were still missing a few weeks on.
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So is the lost gear problem the results of failures on multi-legged flights?. Certainly for skiing in europe most travellers will fly direct with no breaks/change of planes etc..
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Baggage does go missing, regularly, look up the stats, it's all published.
Touch wood, I've never had bags go permanently missing, but I have had luggage go missing for 3-4 days (on a direct flight within Europe), and know several other friends/colleagues who have had the same.
It's more the annoyance factor if you are on the way out. If all your ski/board wear and boots are in the hold and it goes missing, it's all very easy to say yeah its the airlines problem, but you're going to be the one fannying around trying to hire kit or buy new kit in the hope of reclaiming the costs (boots, goggles, base layers, trousers, etc etc), and as everyone knows if you only ever own one piece of kit it should be your boots - the last thing you want on your ski holiday is to find yourself back in a pair of crap hire boots for 2,3,4,5 days of your valuable holiday.
I always fly with everthing (including boots) I need to ride in my hand luggage/pockets. If my hold luggage board goes misssing all I need to do is rent a board.
On the way home I tend to pack it all in the hold
The security thing is utter BS - last year we had our 18 month old's "safety" knife and fork confiscated by the pillocks on gatwick security. Despite the fact they are so blunt that they are designed so an 18 month old can't damage themselves with them they were considered a greater security risk than the cutlery available in the airside restaraunts, or for that matter the heavy litre glass bottles of spirits- but for some reason they aren't security risks. Apparently, you cant smash a litre bottle of spirits and use it as an offensive weapons, but you might do a great deal of damage with a kiddy safety fork. ?!?!?!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ojilles, I once turned up in Canada whilst my ice climbing gear was in Chicago They did get it to me by the next morning though, but that could have proved very, very expensive as we were heading out into the Rockies with no forwarding address.
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Scarpa, Nice! Those moments makes you realize how dependent we are 
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FAQ
(I have no idea, btw, what the answer is to your question.)
