 Poster: A snowHead
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but I bet peeps take it a bit easier - like 'oh I forgot my helmet I think I will take it a bit easier today, just in case'
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yes, I am a little more cautious without a helmet - not about avoiding other people but if there are rocls/trees about
I think, on average, people do "risk compensate" (use up part of increased safety features by taking more risks). I think the question "would you drive differently if there was a six inch spike in the middle of your steering wheel" is a good though experiment...
J
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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rayscoops, I tend to ski with a helmet - but may pack it before the last day's skiing. I don't think it affects the way I ski. If I have that attitude, why do I wear a helmet at all? Don't know. Perhaps because helmets are the fashion with sHs. Wouldn't want to be thought a wierdo. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Just come back from an hour at Braehead.
Having read this thread I was less than surprised to see a guy skiing straight down as fast as he could 'buzzing' his pals and other people. He was not an experienced skier and was not in control as he could not turn and could not have hockey stopped had his life depended on it- never mind anyone elses!
I complained to the 'lifties' but nothing was done!
If they are gettin away with it in such an easy to control environment what hope do we have if he goes to a resort 
beeryletcher, You're probably right about stereotyping people but when I think about it I've noticed his type of character there before and they often seem to go skiing in denims which were inevitably tucked into his boots and wearing a jacket of such an awful design he must have scoured every bargain bin in the UK before he found it. You will not be surprised to hear he was wearing a helmet
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Many posts ago, on page 2 I think, I posted what I thought was something reasonably level headed about the tragedy which triggered this thread. Now I am cross. There have been some very sensible posts and there have been some moronic ones. I stick with my views expressed in my posts. Now folk are arguing about helmets. Each to his or her own. If I crashed into another human on the slopes or on the road, my moral responsibility is not lessened due to them not wearing a helmet or seat belt, although it may be so legally from a compensatory point, if not from a criminal one. Same for not stopping; if it was either of my children, yes I would bet my life they would stop and do what they could and I stated that in my initial post. Concussion does not lend itself to coming round, assessing the situation and skiing off. I have been sixteen and I would have acted no differently then to now, and as I also opined, to suggest otherwise is offensive in the extreme to teenagers. So, the fairly large proportion of the rest of you carry on backbiting and justifying the unjustifiable rather than suggesting what we can do to improve the motorway pistes skiing now consists of.
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Aneira, teenagers do stupid things. In most civilized countries, age is taken into account in sentencing. There are plenty of very good and caring parents who are left saying, 'oh where did I go wrong?' in every magistrates court on every day of the week!
Now, I have a little sympathy for this kid. My sympathy is mine to do what I like with. I'm not telling anyone how to feel, just honestly expressing my feelings.
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Aneira, Well said.
PJSki, Oh no? 'I'm not telling anyone how to feel,' 'small minded and mean spirited'?????
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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easiski, so to feel compassion is 'small minded and mean spirited' in your book?
Keep taking the tablets, Charlotte.
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PJSki, you'll be denying next that these
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But, at least in doing what he did and running away, he has allowed some small minded, vindictive and judgmental people to feel better about themselves.
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are your actual words (my italics.) 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hurtle, that's just what some here are like. If only this kid was the offspring of some of the contributors to this thread, he would never have run off - at least according to them:
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| if it was either of my children, yes I would bet my life they would stop and do what they could. |
You have to feel sympathy for the fact he's not one of Aneria's, in that case. What's a sixteen-year-old going to do a the scene of a fatal accident? Make everyone a nice cup of tea?
I'm not telling people to feel 'small minded and mean spirited', they're doing a real good job of that themselves already. Some of you might want to smell your own shiot every once in a while.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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PJSki, if I knew a bit more, I might have some sympathy. Or not. I simply don't know enough. I certainly do concede that we all make errors of judgment and a sixteen year old is arguably more likely than an adult to make such an error. And I also think that no parent can categorically state what his/her child would have done, least of all in a situation where most of the facts are unknown. It is more than likely that, whatever the facts turn out to be, that boy's life will be blighted by the experience: maybe some compassion for that is due. However, I think it's not right to call those who can't (assuming this was a simple, sentient, hit-and-run by someone old enough to exercise his own judgment) summon up such compassion, small-minded: that is itself over-judgmental IMV.
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Hurtle,
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| if I knew a bit more, I might have some sympathy |
There seems to have been an unsavory rush to judgment by a some people.
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You know it makes sense.
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Hurtle, Many are assuming this Youth (he's not a boy at 16 - not a child) will feel bad and will suffer as a result of his actions. that would seem to be assuming he has a certain level of morality which he did not demonstrate. What seems to be undisputed is that the youth in question skied into the victim, both fell, the youth got up put his skis back on and cluttered off. The victtim died in front of his 12 year old daughter. The police were already looking for the youth as a potential suspect when he surrendered.
There have been 3 fatal 'accidents' in this holiday period that I know of, and undoubtedly there have been many more that we have not heard about. + of course our own Jules B (who could easily have been paralysed below the neck or chest). I have been severely injured by an out of control skier and many of the instructors that I know personally and several local friends have also been badly injured in like manner. By badly injured I mean broken bones and considerable time off work (in one case the entire season). In nearly every case the offending skier/snowboarder ran off without staying to help.
There needs to be public outcry about out of control skiers, and skiers who hit and run - it's very common. One would hope that a forum such as this would lead the way. At the start of this thread there appeared to be more sympathy for the youth than for either the victim, his family and particularly his 12 year old daughter who had to watch her daddy die. However young the youth is, it must have been clear that the victim's daughter was still a child who was left to cope. Surely everyone knows that you call the ski patrol or ask someone else to do it. At least raise the alarm in some way. No-one is suggesting that he could/should have administered first aid.
PJSki, Perhaps you should come and do my job or at any rate spend some serious time on the mountain actually watching what goes on around you before you get so personal. While people do not take responibility for safety on the mountain seriously many more will be injured and/or killed - I hope it's not you or your wife next time.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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easiski,
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| both fell, the youth got up put his skis back on |
Was it reported that his skis came off?
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| At the start of this thread there appeared to be more sympathy for the youth than for either the victim, his family and particularly his 12 year old daughter who had to watch her daddy die. |
Rubbish.
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Poster: A snowHead
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PJSki once again reminds us that his default posting position is to be rude to people who have a different opinion to him. What a charming man you must be!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Aneira wrote: |
| Many posts ago, on page 2 I think, I posted what I thought was something reasonably level headed about the tragedy which triggered this thread. Now I am cross. There have been some very sensible posts and there have been some moronic ones. I stick with my views expressed in my posts. Now folk are arguing about helmets. Each to his or her own. If I crashed into another human on the slopes or on the road, my moral responsibility is not lessened due to them not wearing a helmet or seat belt, although it may be so legally from a compensatory point, if not from a criminal one. Same for not stopping; if it was either of my children, yes I would bet my life they would stop and do what they could and I stated that in my initial post. Concussion does not lend itself to coming round, assessing the situation and skiing off. I have been sixteen and I would have acted no differently then to now, and as I also opined, to suggest otherwise is offensive in the extreme to teenagers. So, the fairly large proportion of the rest of you carry on backbiting and justifying the unjustifiable rather than suggesting what we can do to improve the motorway pistes skiing now consists of. |
I haven't got a problem with your view on the issue but i do have a problem with your sentiment that just because you 'posted what I thought was something reasonably level headed about the tragedy' that you are cross ! every one has the right to post their own opinions and just because have a certain opinion does not mean we need to bow at your feet for posting such sage words.
With respect to helmets, well threads develop and do not linger on one element of a topic, or even one post within a topic - even yours , and i believe 'helmets' are a relevant sub-topic in the case of an on-piste death whereby a head injury seems to be a contributing factor, and I have no idea where your 'moral responsibility is not lessened due to them not wearing a helmet' idea has come from as this has not even been discussed?
If you have a view, well that is just fine, and for the record I agree with you in the main, but please do not be cross because others may have a different view and maybe, just maybe, others may well think your view is moronic too - each to their own
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Sat 3-01-09 10:39; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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easiski,
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Many are assuming this Youth (he's not a boy at 16 - not a child) will feel bad and will suffer as a result of his actions. that would seem to be assuming he has a certain level of morality which he did not demonstrate.
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My guess that he will suffer has nothing whatsoever to do with his 'level of morality', about which I am not making any assumptions at all.
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There needs to be public outcry about out of control skiers, and skiers who hit and run
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Of course, if this is a common problem, there should indeed be an outcry and action taken to improve piste safety. The law in most countries will deal with individual negligence.
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One would hope that a forum such as this would lead the way. At the start of this thread there appeared to be more sympathy for the youth than for either the victim, his family
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Yes, one would hope that all posters would condemn wilful and or negligent hitting and also wilful hit-and-run. As it happens, I think most - in fact, without going back, probably all - who have posted do condemn such things. Also, I haven't seen anyone displaying more sympathy for the youth than for the victim and his family, not even PJSki.
I am not condoning hit-and-run, but I don't like playing judge and jury in relation to an incident of which there have merely been brief newspaper reports. I also admire the Christian ideal of compassion for sinners, even if I wouldn't necessarily display it myself, if put to the test. I think your posts display, as well as justified opinions about dangerous skiing and 'hit-and-run', unsubstantiated assumptions about this accident itself and, a priori, no compassion at all. Happily, your views are more politely expressed than those of PJSki.
rayscoops,
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| being rude is what a lot of people do on this forum, some just do it a more blunt manner at times, PJSki is no different in this respect to many that you have had the pleasure to ski with at bashes |
My reluctance to attend bashes has been questioned by some - you've neatly expressed one of my reasons.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| easiski wrote: |
There needs to be public outcry about out of control skiers, and skiers who hit and run - it's very common. One would hope that a forum such as this would lead the way. |
I would hope that people on a forum like this would not rush to judgement before the facts are known. Unfortunately this has not been the case.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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rob@rar, I seem to remember reading a mods post that this PJSki fellow used to post under another name and had to change his username as he was either barred or threatened with being kicked off the forum. I would read his posts with that in mind... the few times i recall him posting on threads that i participated on it was the same name calling, baiting drival that added nothing to the debate so I now just ignore him. "Trolling" i understand is the polite term for this odd behavior.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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rayscoops, I most certainly can! I would never dream of 'unmasking' a snowHead who doesn't use his real name, or otherwise identify himself. Or at least not in open forum - the only reason I know is because other sHs have told me via PM!  Edit to add: actually, I don't think he's a troll, just very rude and with a weird and tiresome reverse snobbery. He does, however, make some quite valid points in his rude way, sometimes.
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Sat 3-01-09 13:07; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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rayscoops, nope, just don't like his manner. One little bit. (See my edit above.)
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Sat 3-01-09 13:09; edited 1 time in total
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Hurtle, oddly enough, being able to go on a FT holiday with him as a leader (assuming my guess is right) would be about the one thing that might draw me back to the SCGB. Unfortunately, I have been age-restricted from his holidays. I have seen very good reports about enjoyment on the slopes with his parties. He is certainly robust on forum - but he is not alone, and such posters make life interesting.
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You know it makes sense.
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achilles, I don't think robustness and rudeness are the same thing at all. But thanks for the info, assuming we are both on the correct track as to his identity. If you are age-restricted from his holidays, then so am I.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Hurtle, I understand what you are saying - seems like he can't help himself on forum - yet I quite like the guy - especially after meeting him once personally (though I have never skied with him). I can tolerate a bit of rudeness. We would miss Whitegold were he to disappear. And Lizzard can be acid - yet I wouldn't want to see her go, either.
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Poster: A snowHead
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achilles,
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We would miss Whitegold were he to disappear. And Lizzard can be acid - yet I wouldn't want to see her go, either.
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Absolutely agreed, but they are mostly hilarious fun, whereas PJSki often goes WAY off-boundary, without being funny at all. Also, I've heard it said about several people on this forum, that they are sweetness and light when you meet them face to face and, if so, I would be wary of the genuineness of that sweetness and light. Whitegold is, I think, a sock puppet, so special rules apply to his wind-ups. I am guessing that Lizzard is in the flesh as she is on the forum: I'd be delighted to meet her! But these things are very subjective, of course, and I could be wrong - Whitegold and Lizzard could be axe-murderers, indeed could be a single axe-murderer with a double identity! And PJSki could be a genuine, well-adjusted, courteous paragon.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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rayscoops, my 'way off-boundary' comment was not related to this thread - he has a reputation on the forum which has been well-earned. You will also, no doubt, have noticed my defending his viewpoint on here. I stand by my right not to like his tone - he more than likely doesn't like mine.
Masque,
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tapping your poles or giving a verbal call
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Aaarrgghhh, please don't start that one off again - there are lots of people who think that's quite the wrong thing to do, if not downright immoral.
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Skiing is sociological behaviour at variable speeds and enhanced stimuli with concomitant raised levels of aggression and apprehension. . . It's very easy to be perceived as anti-social . . . or even sociopathic. It might even be postulated that the adrenalin rush of skiing may even encourage sociopath behaviour. . . then add alcohol to the mix
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Good point, but I guess it's incumbent upon us to keep those possibilities in mind, and keep compensating for them. Luckily, you appear to be a paragon of virtue but, more to the point, you think about what you're doing. I'm sure a lot of these accidents happen because people leave their brains behind when they get on to the slopes.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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rayscoops, my answer to you is in the form of a further question: why are you, carefully and in exhaustive detail, enumerating and repeating all these points, if you think that making them is a bad idea? Perhaps in your post timed at 1201, rather than asking for PJSki's identity, you should simply have said that, in your view, his posts on this thread are completely inoffensive and that people should not be indulging in historical tittle-tattle. That would have been a legitimate viewpoint, and I might well have retired somewhat chastened (though I do think he has been offensive on this thread, despite agreeing with some of the points he has made). As it is, you are merely continuing to stir. Please desist. I have no further comment to make.
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Hurtle, why ask a question if you do not want my reply ? just being factual and I was simply intrigued as to what his previous snowhead name was but also why some one would bring up the issue of someone's past behaviour and history when it had no relevance to any point of discussion  it seemed quite odd if not a little sinister !
note - edited a couple of times
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Sat 3-01-09 16:59; edited 1 time in total
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rayscoops,
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why ask a question if you do not my reply ?
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Ah, sorry, I should perhaps have made it clearer that my question was a rhetorical one. Indeed, I supplied my own answer to it later in the post!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Hurtle, gottcha, I new you would want the last word
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rayscoops, If only to correct your execrable grammar
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FAQ
I am convinced that those with safety gear ski harder when wearing it in comparison to when not wearing it, or at least take it easier without the clobber on 
