I'm fairly new to skiing, I've done about 5 weeks total since 2019, but I love it and want to do a lot more. Friends recommended that I buy my own boots, which would be better fitting and more comfortable (and give better performance) than rental boots.
So back in March, I went to a shop I've seen recommended on this forum, and was fitted for a pair of boots. However, I'm a bit sceptical about whether they sold me a suitable pair of boots, or whether they just fobbed me off with their end-of-season stock.
I'm male, around 80kg, 5'10", and an inexperiened skiier (I can get down most reds, and some easy blacks, but I'm slow and fall over when it gets tricky, I still get lessons because I'm trying to improve). The fitter sold me a pair of Nordica Speedmachine 3 boots with 110 flex. First question - is that a suitable boot for someone of my ability?
Second issue - I paid for a full boot-fitting service with custom insoles. I wear orthotics in my running shoes (weak arches), and I figured that if I'm paying a lot of money for ski boots, I might as well get it all done properly. After my first fitting in March, I wore the boots around the house a bit, and discovered that they pinch too much over the top of the foot, so I went back for an adjustment appointment. The fitter punched the boot out a bit, but that didn't do enough to fix it, so she then suggested removing the heel lifts that had been inserted at my initial appointment. This got me thinking - if the heel lifts were required to correct my foot position at the first appointment, is removing them a just bit of a bodged response to the boot not fitting quite right?
Third issue - linked to the above, I normally buy a wide fit running shoe (Brooks width 2E) but the boots I've been sold are a regular width (100mm last). Even allowing for the fact that ski boots are meant to be tight, these are still very right around the widest part of the foot, and even if I'm wearing them just sitting down, after a few minutes I get aching arches.
In short, should I go back to the bootfitter and question what they've done, or do I just need to persevere (and maybe do some stretches on my feet) to try and work through it?
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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The only real solution to this is to go back and discuss your concerns with the bootfitter. She's the one who knows your feet and how to get your boots to fit you correctly.
And wearing boots around the house or sitting in them isn't a good test for fit. There's a whole thread recently with some help and advice here that's worth reading. https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=162158
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@olderscot, I guess my concern is that the bootfitter might just be fobbing me off, and I'm too inexperienced to question her judgment.
She's unlikely to admit "yeah, I sold you a pair of unsuitable boots because that's all we had in stock in March, and I then did a bit of a bodge on your follow-up appointment because the boots don't fit you properly and that's the best I could manage". If people on here with more boot-fitting experience than me tell me that my experience is normal and I just need to get used to the boots, then fine, I won't waste the time doing a 2-hour round trip back to see the fitter. Equally, if I have just been sold an inappropriate boot, I would like to go back with the confidence to question what the fitter is telling me.
You have done a lot right - ie. Go to a recommended Bootfitter and get a custom insole.
Am I right in assuming that you have not skied in them yet?....If so, can you get to a snowdome - as it is only when skiing that you will really know what is going on?
Some thoughts:
- When being fitted, they should have measured length/width/instep and done a shell check
- Ski in them and take note of any pinch points
- They will loosen out after a few days skiing
- Go back to the Bootfitter with any concerns
- Make sure you are putting them on correctly....see linked thread
- Walking around the house is likely to be counter productive
- If you need a heel lift, the chances are you need to do stretches and use a foam roller. You should be able to flex your ankle so your knee moves 4" past the end of your toes (without the heel lifting off the floor)
- Generally, how a ski boot fits, has little to do with how a shoe fits
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Tue 13-12-22 14:03; edited 1 time in total
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
My only bootfitting experience was an astonishing 13 years ago (new footbeds since then, but boots and Zipfit liners still going strong - albeit with a bit more tightening - and I've skied 4 weeks pa on average) and was entirely satisfactory. Thus I'm not really in a position to advise. But I was just wondering whether it's common amongst bootfitters to offer a consultation service, a bit like a second opinion from a doctor. In your circumstances, @PowSkiPow, I think I'd fancy a second opinion if possible.
Welcome to snowHeads, by the way. I hope you get your boots sorted, the difference I felt 13 years ago from my first pair of properly fitted boots was simply astonishing and I was lucky to experience no significant discomfort.
I think Old Fartbag's advice is the best first step - try to get to a snowdome for an hour or two and actually ski in them before you change anything else as just wearing them around the house can often hinder, rather than help wit fitting. I mean when you're wearing them around the house are you just sitting down/standing normally or are you actually spending your time standing in the knee bent ski stance? The former will push your feet forwards in the boot and tend to push the top of your foot into contact with the 'turn' of the boot tongue while the latter will (should) have your heals right back, pulling the top of your feet away from the turn of the tongue.
And of couse make sure you aren't over tightening the foot buckles - they are not there to clamp the boot to your foot, just to stop the split opening up while skiing and letting snow in. You should be able to flip them open/closed with one finger - I only tightent mine to the point they aren't actually loose and rattling!
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
PowSkiPow wrote:
I'm male, around 80kg, 5'10", and an inexperiened skiier (I can get down most reds, and some easy blacks, but I'm slow and fall over when it gets tricky, I still get lessons because I'm trying to improve). The fitter sold me a pair of Nordica Speedmachine 3 boots with 110 flex. First question - is that a suitable boot for someone of my ability?
it's not a bad shout. An 80kg male who ski's reds you wouldn't go any lower on flex (although flex is a guide an not entirely uniform across manufacturers). As you improve the boot should hold up and not hold you back.
PowSkiPow wrote:
Second issue - I paid for a full boot-fitting service with custom insoles. I wear orthotics in my running shoes (weak arches), and I figured that if I'm paying a lot of money for ski boots, I might as well get it all done properly. After my first fitting in March, I wore the boots around the house a bit, and discovered that they pinch too much over the top of the foot, so I went back for an adjustment appointment. The fitter punched the boot out a bit, but that didn't do enough to fix it, so she then suggested removing the heel lifts that had been inserted at my initial appointment. This got me thinking - if the heel lifts were required to correct my foot position at the first appointment, is removing them a just bit of a bodged response to the boot not fitting quite right?
As others mentioned wearing at home won't tell you much. Pinching on the top of the foot could be overbuckling (there are videos that show you how to buckle to avoid this). If the heel lifts were present through the fitting I am not sure why they would later be removed, unless the idea was to allow the boots to pack down a little (maybe a weeks skiing) before inserting again.
PowSkiPow wrote:
Third issue - linked to the above, I normally buy a wide fit running shoe (Brooks width 2E) but the boots I've been sold are a regular width (100mm last). Even allowing for the fact that ski boots are meant to be tight, these are still very right around the widest part of the foot, and even if I'm wearing them just sitting down, after a few minutes I get aching arches.
I would have thought they would have measured your foot and taken this into account, either through the last or perhaps by shell adjustment.
PowSkiPow wrote:
In short, should I go back to the bootfitter and question what they've done, or do I just need to persevere (and maybe do some stretches on my feet) to try and work through it?
A bit of tightness is something that could be relieved through use. Pinching or pain points won't.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@PowSkiPow, in terms of flex, i wouldn't want to go softer, in fact i might go to the 120 but that is a perspective thing and can't be assessed on the internet there are numerous factors that affect flex selection, body weight, height, level length, skier level and biomechanics all come into play. oh and 11om is a marketing department number, it simply denotes that it is stiffer than the 100 and softer than the 120 in the range
last selection is another myth of skiing, if the boot is 26.5 then the 100mm is as listed but this goes up and down by around 2mm per size, so unless we know the size ie 28.5 (boot will be to accept a foot of 104mm) and the width of the foot measured in the same way as the boot manufacturer measured it, and your compression to tolerance then it is impossible to say what is correct... some people can tolerate 5-6mm of compression across their feet, some people don't tolerate the boot even touching them.... it should also be remembered that a boot fitter can vastly change the width of a ski boot very easily, so getting the heel and ankle correct is the first goal
so, you had a heel lift put ion, this is (or should be) used if you have a limitation in ankle joint biomechanics, if that is the case simply removing it probably won't help, if it was put ion for some other pseudo reason then removing it might help...... if you have a limitation of flexion then the elastic of the vamp of the tongue of the liner is most likely the area that needs adjustment, the shell can also be pushed up in that area if needed, but too much space is as bad as not enough. the other thing that could be causing this pinch on top of the foot is if the shell needs a little width, this could be squeezing the foot and pushing it up into the top of the boot
all in all impossible to say where the problem is without seeing the foot and the boot together
hope this helps, fee free to pm me if you have any more specific questions
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@PowSkiPow, I’m similar stats to you and am on my 4th pair of Speedmachine 130’s. It’s a really nice flexing boot so I wouldn’t have thought you’d need to go lower on flex. I don’t run but need wide cycling shoes and on all my old Speedmachines got the widest part of the boot that touches the 5th metatarsal blown out. I haven’t done it yet on this pair as it seems less of an issue but that might be a solution for you. Best of luck!
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It often takes a bit of skiing use for the liners to pack out, after which they won’t be so tight. One thing I find really helpful is to get some Sidas ultra thin ski socks. I usually wear them for a couple of days’ skiing before reverting to my normal ski socks.
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