 Poster: A snowHead
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
The thing to note is in the UK contactless is contactless because the amount is the amount. If you tip anyone in the UK you leave coins at the end on the table. No need to press any buttons at all on card machines (unless it’s over £100). Last month when I was in Banff etc if you buy anything in a restaurant or bar the machine asks you first if you want to add a tip or not, and if so how much in $ or % so before you do the ‘contactless’ with card or phone you have no option but to press buttons on the card machine to sort the tip bit out.
Didn’t matter to me but for people expecting pure contactless it might do. |
Is it the same at the states regarding tipping..... am I going to get shot if I don't!?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Bones wrote: |
VolklAttivaS5, Sounds great - something to aim for - just the waiting game now then, for the flights  |
Yeah I thought I’d go for that as it was excellent value for money, only 5% booking deposit with free cancellation up to 2 weeks before. I do enjoy the Ski Big 3 area (even Norquay) and I enjoyed it even without loads of fresh snow last month. Banff is a nice town. Whilst I’m waiting for the flights to come out for late Feb onwards I can have a look at going up to Revelstoke (can use the Rider Express for £55 each way to and from Banff which even with the transfer to Banff to/from Calgary Airport on top is still miles cheaper than car rental for 4 weeks) for a week. Interestingly a 6 day lift pass at Revelstoke on the short notice winter sale rate is £345 approx which is more akin to European lift pass prices so there would be no need to pay a lot of that.
As far as I can tell 3rd week of March in Revelstoke is still very snowy and it’s open until middle of April. |
Plenty of options, you could always rent a vehicle in Banff, for a short time - would allow you to visit Revelstoke, skiing Kicking Horse on the way, return via Panorama if the day trip isnt on .Snow wise you should be fine, evwen its its warm in town in Revelstoke the mtn will be ok - if a tad soft, but icy on the lower slopes.
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Take two days at Kicking Horse and another two at Revelstoke, (that should be enough) dont forget to take advantage of the free guiding at all those Canadian resorts, at Revelstoke and Kicking Horse they used to offer the free guiding at the early afternoon.
Enjoy!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Bones, yes, true, car hire for a short time from Banff to get to Revelstoke could be a cost effective and flexible option.
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Quick point of clarification. It isn't "guiding" in the ACMG sense... They're resort hosts. Much like in Europe it's a bit of a minefield but if you ask for a Guide at Lake Louise you'll very quickly be looking at $$$ but also some potentially epic skiing.....
The hosts are fantastic and well worth using as well especially on busy days where they'll know the good options.
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And yes to being like the states with respect to tipping.
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If you leave no tip, don’t go back during that trip. The card thing is normal for them (I saw it in DC in 2015) even if it’s controversial for us Europeans (and Mr Pink).
Hosts are awesome but IIRC only go up to a certain skill level, single black I think from LL.
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You have to get into the mindset that the tip is part of the cost. It’s what pays the server. It’s not a nice little extra like here - it is pretty much compulsory. Just accept that prices are 15-20% more than advertised
Being Canadians they’ll be very polite and pretend you’ve accidentally forgotten - but if you don’t tip they will chase you down as you leave.
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| Quote: |
Just accept that prices are 15-20% more than advertised
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You have to add tax also!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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What sort of hourly wage would be typical then (excluding the tips) if they need the tips to make it up to something reasonable?
I noticed that about the tax, I bought a new ski helmet when I was in Banff and the price on the label didn’t include the tax.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| What sort of hourly wage would be typical then (excluding the tips) if they need the tips to make it up to something reasonable? |
Varies, but $15 - 20 an hour in general. kitchen staff earn more per hour, but don't tend to get as much in tips from the share.
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@VolklAttivaS5, minimum wage in bc is $15.65 per hour. That includes "servers" as they are called out there. So it's not like USA where they are on a tiny wage and need to make it up in tips. In fact a good server at a nice restaurant can be making pretty good money out there.
Some of my Canadian friends are particularly put out by this fact! I personally agree, there is no reason the servers "need" to be tipped. However it's certainly expected. My least favourite is the expectation I should tip a bartender, when I've walked up to the bar myself and they've literally just picked up a glass and poured a pint.
I don't think I've seen tax included in prices on anything out there. It can get a bit complicated. In BC there is 7% Provincial Sales Tax (PST) and 5% federal Goods and Services Tax (GST). However, alcohol is 10% PST and 5% GST. And some foods are excluded from GST. Also often with alcohol there is some kind of deposit you get back when you return the bottles/cans.
Cross the border into another province and the taxes can change.
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You know it makes sense.
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You have to tip in Canada. Its not like the UK.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@boarder2020, oh I see well that explains it all.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Just over two weeks and we will be Banff bound. Can't wait
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| @boarder2020, oh I see well that explains it all. |
Well I'm glad it helped you, bur still don't really know exactly what I'll be paying whenever I buy something there. I can understand why it is the way it is, but it's certainly very complicated. Would much rather just see what price I was actually going to have to pay up front.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@boarder2020, agreed it’s much easier here where the price on the label is what it costs with tax included and it’s the same throughout the whole country. At least fuel is cheaper in Canada though by a long way.
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Tax is always additional and its because it varies by province, that way retailers can set a fixed price for everything across the country and then the actual paid price varies. It actually could be viewed as more transparent than the UK as the price of the goods is obvious. Most non-Canadians under estimate the province-dependency of a lot of things
Either way, its way less sales tax than I pay in UK when I visit, its just hidden in UK.
Regarding the tipping, its just a fact of life here. Sure some servers make good money, but , so what? It doesn't mean you shouldn't tip. Some of their tips are taxed at an assumed rate, so if everyone didn't tip they would be significantly out of pocket. Servers share their tips with pretty much everyone behind the scenes, so what you tip the server goes to a whole host of workers. 15.65 is not a living wage somewhere like Banff or even Canmore , unless accommodation is provided and included at a good rate.
So, quit wingeing, suck it up, as they say here, and just pay a 15-20 percent minimum tip in restaurants. 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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15.65 may seem OK when translated to pounds, but basics, like food can be a lot more expensive here. Supermarket food is I think around double what it is in the UK and more for some items like dairy and eggs. There is no free prescription system here etc., which means most people pay out for insurance and there is a paltry welfare state compared with the UK. Even to send your kid to state school and it has a small fee.
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| gryphea wrote: |
Regarding the tipping, its just a fact of life here. Sure some servers make good money, but , so what? It doesn't mean you shouldn't tip. Some of their tips are taxed at an assumed rate, so if everyone didn't tip they would be significantly out of pocket. Servers share their tips with pretty much everyone behind the scenes, so what you tip the server goes to a whole host of workers. 15.65 is not a living wage somewhere like Banff or even Canmore , unless accommodation is provided and included at a good rate.
So, quit wingeing, suck it up, as they say here, and just pay a 15-20 percent minimum tip in restaurants. |
My son sent me this last year. Worked in Banff last winter, now in Whistler, but yes tip servers they need it. Most Banff workers get some form of accommodation, but in Whistler it's nigh on impossible if you are a server. Stories I've heard of 4 to a room for $2k each per month!!! Slightly easier if you are a chef/cook
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| knackered knees wrote: |
| gryphea wrote: |
Regarding the tipping, its just a fact of life here. Sure some servers make good money, but , so what? It doesn't mean you shouldn't tip. Some of their tips are taxed at an assumed rate, so if everyone didn't tip they would be significantly out of pocket. Servers share their tips with pretty much everyone behind the scenes, so what you tip the server goes to a whole host of workers. 15.65 is not a living wage somewhere like Banff or even Canmore , unless accommodation is provided and included at a good rate.
So, quit wingeing, suck it up, as they say here, and just pay a 15-20 percent minimum tip in restaurants. |
My son sent me this last year. Worked in Banff last winter, now in Whistler, but yes tip servers they need it. Most Banff workers get some form of accommodation, but in Whistler it's nigh on impossible if you are a server. Stories I've heard of 4 to a room for $2k each per month!!! Slightly easier if you are a chef/cook
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Interesting that Canmore is double the cost of living of the major cities and outstrips even Fort McMurray where oil patch wages used to rule the roost. Guess I'm lucky that I lived in Banff way back when on a BUNAC visa when wages and tips did cover the lifestyle.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I grew up in North America so it seems really straightforward to me. In the UK, the price is inclusive (although there is often a service charge, and if there isn't I always tip anyway). In North America, the price of a meal is what it says on the menu plus tax and tip. It's a package - nothing underhand, not that complicated, just a different way to price goods and services. We are guests in another culture, we spend huge amounts of money on North American ski trips. Just tip the restaurant staff and do it with a glad heart.
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| lynnecha wrote: |
| I grew up in North America so it seems really straightforward to me. In the UK, the price is inclusive (although there is often a service charge, and if there isn't I always tip anyway). In North America, the price of a meal is what it says on the menu plus tax and tip. It's a package - nothing underhand, not that complicated, just a different way to price goods and services. We are guests in another culture, we spend huge amounts of money on North American ski trips. Just tip the restaurant staff and do it with a glad heart. |
But don't get guilted into tipping ski instructors if you have a mediocre lesson or have paid exhorbitantly for a private. Their inability to effectively (as professionals) bargain with their employers shouldn't really be loaded on tourists. And yes Rob Katz when he was CEO of Vail Resorts did once suggest that their solution to cost of living issues for staff was to post signs in ski school offices reminding guests they should tip (while charging over $1000 for a day private).
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| lynnecha wrote: |
| I grew up in North America so it seems really straightforward to me. In the UK, the price is inclusive (although there is often a service charge, and if there isn't I always tip anyway). In North America, the price of a meal is what it says on the menu plus tax and tip. It's a package - nothing underhand, not that complicated, just a different way to price goods and services. We are guests in another culture, we spend huge amounts of money on North American ski trips. Just tip the restaurant staff and do it with a glad heart. |
Not entirely sure that North America (particularly parts of the US) can exactly be held up as a shining beacon of employee relations and fair remuneration?
What exactly is the logic behind it - apart from paying employees as little as possible and potentially avoiding tax and benefit/wage liabilities?
Why if someone makes you a $6 coffee or pulls a $9 pint do you expect to pay a tip, yet at a shop someone may spend loads of time helping you out, run your purchase through the till, etc, but you do not pay a tip?
Why do you tip the instructor, but not the lifties, or patrollers, or...?
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 7-02-23 20:42; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| stuarth wrote: |
Not entirely sure that North America (particularly parts of the US) can exactly be held up as a shining beacon of employee relations and fair remuneration? |
I’m not justifying the entire approach to employment regulations, I’m simply saying it’s not complicated as stated earlier. We’re guests in another culture. I am not trying to wage a campaign about the rights and wrongs. It’s just how food service works. I do what is expected without getting worked up about it. Then I go skiing.
BTW- tips are fully taxed. There is a %age assumption-added to the taxable income- regardless of whether or not the individual receives the tip.
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| lynnecha wrote: |
I’m not justifying the entire approach to employment regulations...
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Hmmm, not trying to justify it? Except you are
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You know it makes sense.
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| lynnecha wrote: |
BTW- tips are fully taxed. There is a %age assumption-added to the taxable income- regardless of whether or not the individual receives the tip. |
Is that actually true? How could the CRA/IRS possibly enforce that?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Yup. It’s true. See comments above. That is why servers are out of pocket if they don’t get tips. You live in Canada- ask next time you’re in a restaurant. See what they say.
It’s the same in many US states. I lived in Denver in 1973 and it was exactly the same then all those years ago. I worked in food service. I lived on tips. I got paid $2/hour. Tips were my wage.
Also, please don’t project things on to me which are untrue. I am not justifying anything- I’m just not of the opinion that I can have a meaningful effect on a system whilst I am visiting a foreign country so I do what benefits the people working in that system. You know nothing about me, so please don’t make assumptions.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Tue 7-02-23 20:59; edited 1 time in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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@lynnecha,
Or alternatively take a look at Canadian (federal) tax rules. Tips are taxed for the employee but not the employer - and then only if declared (which they legally should be), unless they are pooled in which case I believe the employer is liable for tax and CPP etc .
oh, and look left to my location 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I did
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Read what I said.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I am not making assumptions, just going on what you wrote...
| lynnecha wrote: |
| I grew up in North America so it seems really straightforward to me. In the UK, the price is inclusive (although there is often a service charge, and if there isn't I always tip anyway). In North America, the price of a meal is what it says on the menu plus tax and tip. It's a package - nothing underhand, not that complicated, just a different way to price goods and services. We are guests in another culture, we spend huge amounts of money on North American ski trips. Just tip the restaurant staff and do it with a glad heart. |
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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It’s an explanation not a justification. I am entreating people to respect another culture rather than rail against it and potentially disadvantage fairly low paid workers without fully understanding the ramifications. I try to be á responsible guest in another country. That’s all.
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| lynnecha wrote: |
| It’s an explanation not a justification. I am entreating people to respect another culture rather than rail against it and potentially disadvantage fairly low paid workers without fully understanding the ramifications. I try to be á responsible guest in another country. That’s all. |
I get where you are coming from, but I'm not sure it really helps long term. I think it just ensures that bad practices are perpetuated.
But, you are also right that it can't be fixed by making the low paid workers suffer. Instead people like me and @gryphea should not blindly accept it but be pressuring those who can fix it to do something about it (MPs, MLAs, hotel/cafe/restaurant/ski hill management, etc).
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Apologies for derailing this into a social justice thread!!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I don’t mind the thread drift, it’s all helpful information to know.
I have just finished the base repairs on my skis from last month.
Out of interest for those here that ski what skis do you use? Do you have a general pair and a wider pair you get out on big powder days?
I only use the one pair, Scott Slight 100
Seems to do the job in all conditions
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@VolklAttivaS5,
Whitedot Ragnarok mostly.
I have some Rangers that I also use - they are getting old so those were the ones that got the Kicking Horse beating!
Various assorted other skis, but they don't get used all that often
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FAQ
If you pay in cash they ask you how much change you want back therefore telling them how much you are tipping them.
