 Poster: A snowHead
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With so many changes to the rules & regulations lately, I just can't work out exactly what are the likely complications of taking single-jabbed 16yo & 14yo skiing this winter.
Seems like they're stuck in the no man's land of the UK's single vax policy vs the EU double vax policy for over 12s.
Thinking of driving from UK to France or maybe flying to Italy, with the option of Xmas, Feb HT or Easter.
What's needed to enter each country?
Will they be able to use the lifts & other facilities?
What's needed on return to UK?
What's it going to cost extra (over and above the usual for travel, accommodation, food, liftpasses, hire, etc)?
Any help appreciated! 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Here’s what I managed to distill for Italy (from this thread)
https://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=156295#4825729
“ Ok, so from what I’ve managed to understand, it appears the Italian Green Pass (the ‘blue’ pass I see on the app for my son) is different and less restrictive than the full EU one - it is valid 15 days after the *first* jab.
It’s this that is now being made mandatory in Italy to access services such as dining etc.
If that’s the case, then it’s good news for those 12+ (Who’ve been jabbed in sufficient time). If I understand it right, adults will still need the full EU green pass (ie be double jabbed + 15 days) to enter the country and avoid quarantine, but the under 18s that accompany them won’t, and as long as they’ve been single jabbed they can go in restaurants etc and not need to keep getting a test every 48 hours.
So if I have this right:
Over 18:
- Enter the country without quarantine: 2 jabs + 15 days + PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant: covered by above
Under 18: if travelling with the above,
12-17:
- Enter the country without quarantine: PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant : 1 jab + 15 days, or a PCR test within 48 hours
6 - 11:
- Enter the country without quarantine: PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant : <none>
Under 6:
- <none>
“
So on this basis I booked for Italy, rather than France, where I believe I would need my under 18 to do regular Covid tests to qualify for the PS and be allowed in restaurants etc.
As I noted in the thread, I tested my 17 year old sons 1/2 Covid pass in the VerificaC19 app, and he got a blue ‘valid for Italy only’ pass (though curiously my 1/2 got a fail, however my 2/2 got a green ‘valid for eu and Italy’)
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Mon 4-10-21 19:02; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Can’t answer all your questions but as it’s stands today:
They won’t need the pass sanitaire for the lifts in France, but will need them for the restaurants ana cafes. If not double jabbed then this means PCR under 72 (I think) hours.
If you’re double jabbed, then they won’t need a lateral flow to go back to the U.K., but you all need a PCR 2 days after getting back.
Hopefully other will be able to fill in the gaps.
There’s a chance the 16yos will have a 2nd jab before Winter too
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Should have added that to enter France yoi need a LFT or PCR (where you get a certificate/QR code in both cases) to enter the country.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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The only thing you can be sure of, is that it will change.
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| Layne wrote: |
We are going to France at Christmas with children aged 14 and 16.
As I understand it currently they have to provide a negative test before going but don't need to isolate and therefore not restricted in using the lifts (not sure about restaurants but we won't be using any)
On return you have to complete a certificate https://www.interieur.gouv.fr/Actualites/L-actu-du-Ministere/Certificate-of-international-travel#from1
TBH I haven't double checked everything as there is a good 10 weeks or so to go. |
My biggest concern was access to hotel dining rooms and lunch places on the slopes, but as you say, a lot can happen in 10 weeks.
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| Pejoli wrote: |
Over 18:
- Enter the country without quarantine: 2 jabs + 15 days + PCR test within 48 hours
- Eat in a restaurant: covered by above |
I believe you can save yourself a few quid and take antigen tests instead of PCR, and the 48hr test is 48hr before you arrive, if that’s not clear. http://www.italia.it/en/useful-info/covid-19-updates-information-for-tourists.html
| Quote: |
Travellers from the United Kingdom must:
1. Fill in the Passenger Locator Form before entering Italy
2. Present COVID-19 green certification on arrival, issued by the health authority of their country certifying complete vaccination against COVID-19, performed at least 14 days beforehand, using a vaccine recognized by the European Medicines Agency (EMA)
3. Present a document certifying that they have performed a molecular or antigenic swab test in the 48 hours prior to arrival in Italy with negative results.
If, on entering Italy, travellers do not present green certification or the negative result of a swab test, they can nevertheless enter the country but will have to undergo fiduciary isolation for 5 days and inform the Prevention Department of the competent area health authority (see page: COVID-19 Toll-free numbers and regional information). After 5 days of isolation, they must perform an additional molecular or antigen test. |
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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We’re off to Austria, hopefully, at Christmas. Our youngest is 17 and hasn’t been jabbed yet. Reason being he had a positive pcr result the day before he was due it. So certainly by December we’ll be 3 x double jabbed and 1 x Covid-recovered + single jab. Hoping that’s enough. Nightmare!
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@Layne, Same here, but we are flying via Geneva where they don't need a test to travel to, but we are then driving through into France (where if we had flown direct, they would!). Make of that what you will!
As far as I know, they would not need a test result to drive through the Swiss/France border....but I would be delighted for confirmation of this-at least as things stand now!
We're self catering and quite happy to eat in the apartment. Not least to save the money which would have been spent on restaurant meals so we can pay for all the tests!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@ snowhound… so tricky isn’t it. We too are flying to Geneva then driving through to France with our single jabbed teen for October half term. Reading the French gov website… my understanding is that unvaccinated over 12s will still need a test despite arriving from a green country (Switzerland). We are doing a c19 home test the day before just in case!
Quotes from the relevant Page
https://www.diplomatie.gouv.fr/en/coming-to-france/coronavirus-advice-for-foreign-nationals-in-france/
‘ The measures applicable to vaccinated adults also apply to any minors accompanying them, whether they are vaccinated or not. You can therefore travel with your underage children, whether they are vaccinated or not, and they will not need to self-isolate. Unvaccinated children aged 12 and over will need to present a negative test result as described below.‘
Green country - ‘ Upon boarding, each traveller aged 12 and over must present a negative PCR or antigenic test taken less than 72 hours before the flight. . If you are travelling from Cyprus, Greece, Malta, Spain, the Netherlands or Portugal, your test must be taken less than 24 hours before the flight.’
Orange country - ‘ Each traveller aged 12 and over must present a negative PCR test taken less than 72 hours before departure or a negative antigenic test taken less than 48 hours before departure. If you are arriving from the United Kingdom, the PCR or antigenic test must have been taken less than 24 hours before boarding.‘
Am I overthinking this?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I would say, if in doubt, do the maximum that may be required. In other words if unsure you need a test get one anyway.
That said, I'm sure people will be reporting back on here there are interpretations and experiences as the season kicks in. So stay tuned.
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@Rookiescot, Are you over thinking this?
I would say not in theory, but yes in practice...I can't see how it is practicable for the French to check cars over the Geneva border crossing for vaccination/test status given the amount of regular daily traffic between France and Switzerland. Been lots of posters saying no checks taking place over the summer.
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You know it makes sense.
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We are in a similar position, taking 2 x single jabbed 15yr olds at Xmas. All the info I am getting out of our village in the GM is positive, no pass needed for chair lifts etc, so I am going to save my energy for another month or so yet.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I have three in the 12-18 range which is seriously causing issues (we're based in the UK with US passports) as North America is equally tricky. Canada requires (as of now) that everyone 12+ needs to be double jabbed to avoid quarantine (which puts paid to my Whistler trip in December). Vail Resorts (Vail, Breckenridge, etc) are requiring 12+ to be "fully vaccinated" to eat in on-mountain restaurants and (for kids) to do all day ski school. While Vail haven't yet decided what fully vaccinated means, the uncertainty was enough for me to cancel my Whistler-replacement trip to Breck.
So now looking at Italy in December (or alternatively, heading over to Ireland to get a second jab for the boys in November and attempting to argue the toss). Surely this useless government will start to pay attention when they realise their blue wall voters are about to have February half term cancelled*. : 
* an extreme reaction, but I am not spending all this cash to eat sandwiches on the lifts (YMMV).
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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This is a great post that I will be following. Questions that I was looking to ask really.
In essence, where can I go with my 14 year old son? I am double jabbed, he is due his only jab next week. But it seems one jab is not enough for many places.
I really don't know what to do. Where can I go? Should I book? Is it worth it considering all the hoops to jump through? Will it be enjoyable with all of the regulations that have to be adopted?
We are both very keen to get on the slopes after missing two winters now. I can't help feeling that this winter will be also lost.
On the plus side I am looking at first week of April (School hols where I am) which might mean things have improved. Down side, late season so not as many options. France being one as it's high but then France seems a total mare!
Any help is appreciated. Thanks.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Tue 5-10-21 14:32; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Here's a weird one. The NHS App terms of use state that anyone over the age of 13 can use the app. But the .gov website states that only people over 16 can access the covid passport. Has anyone with a kid aged between 13 and 15 got the app, because I'm wondering if one half of the above have got it wrong.
I might get my 13 yo to download it later and check it out. Will report back.
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@Timmycb5, both could be true as the covid passport on the NHS App is only one of its features? But do check and see.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Boofont, the only problem I'm aware of for France is that he'll need a couple of tests during the week if you want to visit restaurants. From a skiing perspective, on current rules, it will be fine.
I took my 14-yr old this summer and had no problems at all, although that was before the pass sanitaire was brought in for restaurants etc.
I'm also vaguely optimistic that we might go for second jabs for teenagers in the next few months.
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@snowdave, If not, then am I right in thinking outdoor cafes are OK? Of course that doesn't help if the weather is dreadful.
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@snowdave, Thanks. My lad is mad keen to get away so would probably take another jab for that reason alone! I'm hoping things might ease of a bit.
Do you know what type of test it is please?
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@Boofont, PCR or LFT. Has to be done at an approved pharmacy I think. Valid for 72 hours
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I'm also vaguely optimistic that we might go for second jabs for teenagers in the next few months.@snowdave,
My understanding is that UK teens won’t be having 2 jabs due to the small cardiac risk after the second jab. Have you read differently by any chance?
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| bambionskiis wrote: |
I'm also vaguely optimistic that we might go for second jabs for teenagers in the next few months.@snowdave,
My understanding is that UK teens won’t be having 2 jabs due to the small cardiac risk after the second jab. Have you read differently by any chance? |
My understanding is, looking at the numbers, the risk of myocarditis from Covid outweighs the risk from getting it from the first vaccination, but not from the second, as you only get a marginal increase in protection from Covid going from one to two jabs.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@bambionskiis, without turning this into another COVID thread (plenty of those in apres) - yes, I think the data is moving towards the relative risk being in favour of vaccination, particularly as COVID becomes endemic. This is a combination of a) some of the myocarditis research being questioned quite heavily (not least one author turning out to be an antivaxer), and b) evidence that even in 12-17yr old males, COVID carries 6x the myocarditis risk vs 2 shots of the vaccine.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.23.21260998v1.full-text
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Thanks for all the input and answers guys.
I guess this is a constantly moving picture.
Look forward to hearing how it goes for those travelling at Oct HT!
I still don't know whether to jump yet though!
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@luigi, there is a chance teens will be offered a second vaccine before the ski season. If this doesn't happen I think the situation in France will be that 12-17yr olds will need to do lateral flow tests in a pharmacy every 72 hours for the pass sanitaire if it is needed for activities they need to access. As things stand the pass sanitaire will not be required for ski lifts.
My youngest is only eligible for one vaccine so far but we have two self drive self catering ski holidays to France booked for the coming season.
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You know it makes sense.
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The other problem seems to be UK 12-15 year olds can't get a covid pass to prove either vaccination or recovery from covid, (ignoring the debate whether one jab is 'fully vaxxed' for u18s or not, all the NHS covid pass services seem to apply from 16+) which is what you need to get the Italy green card or French pass sanitaire, to avoid the BS of testing every 3 days just to be able to go to restaurants or, in the case of Italy, get your flight home.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Gazzza, yup. It's crap. You can apparently get the NHS app. My 13 yo has downloaded it and I've contacted the Dr's surgery to try and get the access to it. Gonna have a look to see what is on there and will report back.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I emailed the border police at MUC to better understand entry requirements for end of October - I am double jabbed as is Madame SS, 16 year old single jabbed, 13 year old no jab and 9 year old no jab. Their reply pasted below. We were planning to travel directly from MUC to Austria.....
*********In response to your request, transit at the airport towards Austria is generally possible.
It must be proven to the airline whether you have been vaccinated or tested.
You and your wife are vaccinated and the children must all have a negative test.
Since you only want to use the federal territory for transit, your children will not have any problems with entry or transit.
A final decision is made by the colleagues during the actual border police immigration control, as the legal requirements for aliens must also be met.
For this purpose, you should carry all documents with you in the original, if possible.
A written entry permit is generally not issued here, as the documents include cannot be checked for authenticity.
No legal claims can be derived from this confirmation email.
The assessment of your facts only applies to entry at Munich Airport.
I would like to point out the current entry requirements, which can change daily.
Link:
https://www.bundespolizei.de/Web/DE/04Aktuelles/01Meldungen/2020/03/200317_faq.html
In addition, there is a quarantine in external border traffic in certain cases. For more information, please refer to the information sheet in the appendix, with the request that you observe them.
You can find the latest information on quarantine regulations and Corona under the following links:
https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus/Quarantaene_Einreisen_Deutschland.html
Evidence of vaccination and recovery are equivalent to negative test evidence within the scope of the obligation to provide evidence. You can also be exempt from entry quarantine. This does not apply to a previous stay in a virus variant area, here travelers are always obliged to present a negative test result on entry; the evidence then does not release you from the entry quarantine.
The proof must be presented to the carrier before departure abroad. The proof must also be carried on entry and presented to the competent authority upon request.
Please carry this confirmation email and the digital entry registration (DEA) with you when entering the country.**************
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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That’s useful to know, and something I also need to check properly - I’m going to Italy, but flying in to Innsbruck. The current Austrian regulations at the moment are roughly equivalent to Italy, and they also seem to allow unrestricted transit, but it’s another possible dimension of risk if that changes - eg if Austria started banning uk before Italy did, I’m not sure where it would leave us.
My 15 year old got her jab yesterday, and will turn 16 in Nov, so hopefully we will avoid all the nhs app challenges. I’m pessimistic they’ll get a second jab approved any time soon (I think the gov. will prioritise boosters for the 50+, unless the modelling becomes much more compelling - given I’m 50+ I’m a bit conflicted on which is better personally).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Gazzza, the nhs app for single jabbed teenagers clearly displays 1/2 vaccinations
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Dyrlac wrote: |
So now looking at Italy in December (or alternatively, heading over to Ireland to get a second jab for the boys in November and attempting to argue the toss). Surely this useless government will start to pay attention when they realise their blue wall voters are about to have February half term cancelled*. :
* an extreme reaction, but I am not spending all this cash to eat sandwiches on the lifts (YMMV). |
Out of interest how would you get a second jab for your children in Ireland?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| LadyDi wrote: |
Out of interest how would you get a second jab for your children in Ireland? |
As best as I have been able to ascertain, Ireland will jab kids (including those “visiting” Ireland) at their walk in centres, including those who’ve had their first jabs in other countries, with no apparent requirement for, eg, an Eire Health number. Which *should* get them a certificate useable in the EU. I figure it has a 50/50 chance of working, which are better odds than waiting for our government’s inevitable day late/dollar short U-turn.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I wrote to my MP recently, bemoaning the disparity between the vaccination policy for teenagers in the UK and EU. Basically, along the lines that older people have benefitted throughout the pandemic and young people have been largely shat-upon in terms of lost teaching, closed amenities and [now] curtailed travel. This was the reply:
Thank you for contacting me about Covid19 vaccinations for teenagers and the implication
for travel outside of the UK and specifically to the EU.
Given the success of the rollout amongst adults, it is possible to take a more precautionary
approach to rollout among younger people. This means that first doses will be prioritised
and recommendations on the second dose will be delayed to allow the JCVI to provide the
best available advice with the latest information for the second dose. This approach will
ensure younger people are provided with some immediate protection from severe disease
now and I understand that the aim is for the second dose to be given later to extend
protection for a longer period. Further data and the potential availability of alternative
vaccine options will inform exact details which will be set out in due course.
I understand your concerns about the potential implications for teenagers travelling outside
the UK if they are only partially vaccinated and will raise these with the Department for
Transport for further advice which I will pass on to you as soon as it is received.
If you are travelling imminently then you will need to check the current UK travel rules and those for the country to which you are visiting. There is advice available here: Travel abroad from England during coronavirus (COVID-19) - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk).
Thank you again for your email.
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@Klamm Franzer, it doesn’t seem an unreasonable reply or approach in this regard.
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That's what I thought. At least it looks like a second dose is on the cards - hopefully before Feb half-term in our case.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Klamm Franzer, keeping my fingers crossed for that too. I can cope with my youngest needing regular tests at the pharmacy. My wife and his older sisters normally bail for the hot tub leaving us to get a few more runs in, so it’ll be simple enough to work a test in.
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I don’t know why this has only just occurred to me, but…… if the pass sanitaire is required for the train in France, how will that work? The test to get on the train at St Pancras won’t work for the pass sanitaire but that I’m guessing is OK, but it will be needed for the TGV part. Where in the utter feck am I supposed to get a test between trains?
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