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Will 21/22;season happen for the British?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Well, I've booked for three weeks in Jan/Feb '22. Ever the optimist but I do think it'll happen.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I've embarked on my weeks and weeks of holiday planning and will be booking a trip for half term and easter asap. I'll also be doing some last minute jobs closer to the time.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I really hope so

Assuming vaccines are rolled out this year, and boosters in Autumn like the flu, I can't see any reason why not
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I really hope so as well, but think the chances of skiing outside the UK are no better than 50/50.

People in general are only just starting to realise how difficult it is to get this sort of virus under control. With tight control of borders there is a reasonable chance of life in the UK being back to something approaching "normal" next winter. But with new variants emerging all the time, more international borders are currently closing than opening.

It will take the rest of 2021 for the UK adult population to get both current Covid-19 doses, before we start to think about boosters. The make-up of next winter's flu booster has probably already been decided. Covid-19 vaccines will be being redesigned now to allow for currently known variants, but there are still too many new variants emerging to think that these will be fully effective, and international tourism can get back to pre-pandemic levels, next winter.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'm disgusted that someone with the name Boris could show their face on here Laughing Laughing Laughing
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@Yellow Snow, I am the original and have been here a lot longer than the imposter has been on the scene Toofy Grin
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I'm hoping the Psb can go ahead, but that might get caught at the tail end of European restrictions/worries about a winter surge. Will most likely depend on the EU vaccine situation. Probably a late(ish) decision on that one, but buttons don't usually appear until late summer anyway.

Carried forward PreBB and BB from this year, so hopeful. BA flights now available. (Interestingly, the web site is showing flights from both Heathrow and Gatwick, so they are being optimistic about some sort of return to "normality").

Just waiting for details of the "3rd week" to see if it's viable Very Happy Very Happy


The flu vaccine is based on the prevalent strains in the Southern hemisphere winter, so preparations will be gearing up soon. Obviously, some of the production capacity will currently be taken up with Covid. Be interesting to learn what arrangements they are making to produce both in enough numbers. I can see more people than usual taking up the flu vaccine this year, especially if it is rolled out with any sort of Covid booster to take into account any new strains.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Yellow Snow wrote:
I'm disgusted that someone with the name Boris could show their face on here Laughing Laughing Laughing


Call him de Pfeffel because he does talk a lot of piffle. I am sure it's nominative determinism at work Happy
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We've booked a week in Corvara at the tail end of Jan 22 so here's hoping so...
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I'm going to wait and see how international travel, Covid, and snow limit what we can do next season. I'll have stopped working by then so hopefully have 3/4 months to choose from for a number of ski holidays.
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We've booked our pre xmas trip for mid dec. to Mayrhofen. So always have tux as backup.
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Mr.Egg wrote:
We've booked our pre xmas trip for mid dec. to Mayrhofen. So always have tux as backup.


Good cancellation clause; or just risking it?
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
ecureuil wrote:
I really hope so as well, but think the chances of skiing outside the UK are no better than 50/50.

People in general are only just starting to realise how difficult it is to get this sort of virus under control. With tight control of borders there is a reasonable chance of life in the UK being back to something approaching "normal" next winter. But with new variants emerging all the time, more international borders are currently closing than opening.

It will take the rest of 2021 for the UK adult population to get both current Covid-19 doses, before we start to think about boosters. The make-up of next winter's flu booster has probably already been decided. Covid-19 vaccines will be being redesigned now to allow for currently known variants, but there are still too many new variants emerging to think that these will be fully effective, and international tourism can get back to pre-pandemic levels, next winter.


it will be amazing if the cases just disappear once everyone is vaccinated (by end of summer by current estimations). i personally think it will all come down to how much society can 'desensitize' itself to rising cases come winter. this virus isn't going away appears to be the majority opinion so as long as society can accept rising cases (&hopefully not a similar rise in hospitalisations etc), i think we will be ok (for ski trips). i dont think we should be as concerned about the variants as the press want us to be, from what i've read current vaccines protect, or are fully expected to, against serious illness. fingers crosssed.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I have booked 45.5 days of skiing next season: multiple trips in Europe and North America which will be a PB if it comes off (not bad when you consider I am also working full time). I am, however, close to writing off this Easter, but cautiously optimistic for a long weekend at beginning of May.....
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
ecureuil wrote:
The make-up of next winter's flu booster has probably already been decided. As I understand it, next winter's 'flu vaccine will be decided upon based on the most common variant in this coming summer's Southern Hemisphere 'flu season (of course, this will be complicated if no-one gets the 'flu down under). And vice versa for their variant for their next winter Covid-19 vaccines will be being redesigned now to allow for currently known variants, but there are still too many new variants emerging to think that these will be fully effective, and international tourism can get back to pre-pandemic levels, next winter. Given the speed to market of the first vaccines which in some cases have employed (sort of) new technology, and their effectiveness against new variants, and the current planning in place collecting data on new variants (and 'flu like regulatory approvaly) I would like to think that this wouldn't necessarily be an issue ...
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Charliegolf wrote:
Mr.Egg wrote:
We've booked our pre xmas trip for mid dec. to Mayrhofen. So always have tux as backup.


Good cancellation clause; or just risking it?


DIY Option
Easyjet flights
Booking.com accommodation which can be canceled upto a few days before.
At worse we lose the flights if we cant move them.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
ecureuil wrote:

People in general are only just starting to realise how difficult it is to get this sort of virus under control. With tight control of borders there is a reasonable chance of life in the UK being back to something approaching "normal" next winter. But with new variants emerging all the time, more international borders are currently closing than opening.


In Scotland the virus was on the verge of being eliminated last summer. However we suffered from the old "too little, to late" and "too much, too soon" foisted on us by the clowns in Westminster and where reinfected with a Spanish variant which replaced the other circulating variants. Of course the Kent variant then came along, though noting it might well have arisen outside the UK but as the rest of the world are not actually doing much genomic testing we will never know.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
@Mr.Egg, That is how I book my trips. Just rebooked flights to Innsbruck for Jan '22 using BA vouchers from cancelled March '21 flights. Like you, accomodation booked through booking.com and can be cancelled up untill pretty well the last minute.
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under a new name wrote:
Given the speed to market of the first vaccines which in some cases have employed (sort of) new technology, and their effectiveness against new variants, and the current planning in place collecting data on new variants (and 'flu like regulatory approvaly) I would like to think that this wouldn't necessarily be an issue ...


It should be noted for example the AstraZeneca vaccine was ready on the 30th January last year, and Pfizer and Moderna where ready in a similar time frame. The rest has just been testing first to make sure they provided an immune response which was known by Easter, and then a proper clinical trial and ramping up manufacturing.

Here is a great starter on the mRNA vaccines with some links to cover other types and the differences between them all

https://berthub.eu/articles/posts/reverse-engineering-source-code-of-the-biontech-pfizer-vaccine/
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@jabuzzard, not convinced an untested vaccine is "ready" Twisted Evil - see Mr Sanofi's experience.
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@jabuzzard, Doesn't Scotland have autonomy for lockdown etc.?
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MorningGory wrote:
@jabuzzard, Doesn't Scotland have autonomy for lockdown etc.?


many people in scotland think that holyrood kept the borders open, both with england and at the airports under pressure from Westminister and the travel industry. Essentially, Scotland's FM is only responsible for the good decisions made never for the bad.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
jabuzzard wrote:
In Scotland the virus was on the verge of being eliminated last summer. However we suffered from the old "too little, to late" and "too much, too soon" foisted on us by the clowns in Westminster and where reinfected with a Spanish variant which replaced the other circulating variants. Of course the Kent variant then came along, though noting it might well have arisen outside the UK but as the rest of the world are not actually doing much genomic testing we will never know.


I've seen this ridiculous statement about eliminating the virus in Scotland before.

Absolute rubbish!!!

If that was the case, then Scotland (the only Country in the World to achieve such exceptional results) would have had daily figures in the tens, hospital admissions in single figures and practically zero deaths for the few weeks it would have taken for the new variants to circulate. (which they would not have done had everybody followed the rules). As a result, the curve for infections in Scotland would have had a very noticable delay compared to the rest of the UK, and, with the tier system in place, should have been much lower. Did this occur?

Scotland were the first to introduce a fourth tier in response to surges. This would not have been necessary if the first wave had been defeated as you claim.

Decisions about lockdown in Scotland were taken in Scotland, as were decisions about further restrictions, as a result of surges in the virus.

Stop listening to the SNP propoganda, and check the facts yourself.


Last edited by After all it is free Go on u know u want to! on Wed 17-02-21 18:23; edited 3 times in total
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I have a funny feeling this threads going to go on a while...
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MorningGory wrote:
@jabuzzard, Doesn't Scotland have autonomy for lockdown etc.?


Yes it does, but it doesn't have the autonomy to take the economic measures to mitigate any lockdown. As such the Scottish government is severely hampered in what it can do.
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brianatab wrote:

Absolute rubbish!!!

If that was the case, then Scotland (the only Country in the World to achieve such exceptional results) would have had daily figures in the tens, hospital admissions in single figures and practically zero deaths for the few weeks it would have taken for the new variants to circulate. (which they would not have done had everybody followed the rules). As a result, the curve for infections in Scotland would have had a very noticable delay compared to the rest of the UK, and, with the tier system in place, should have been much lower. Did this occur?


It's not rubbish, but if you where not living in Scotland and following the Scottish daily figures you won't have noticed it happened. Basically there was an extended period with new cases per day in single figures and no deaths or hospital admissions. So yes this DID occur. The clueness of people south of the border to what actually goes on in Scotland is at times mind blowing.

I would note that New Zealand and Australia have limited the virus excepting outbreaks from quarantine facilities, so it's not exceptional by any stretch of the imagination. However you can look much much closer to home in the middle of the Irish Sea and the Isle of Man to see it is possible to achieve even now.

I remain convinced had the UK government sat down and had a proper grownup discussion with the devolved nations and Ireland, implemented much more restrictive travel arrangements (at least what is in place now) last May, stuck with the lockdown for a few weeks more, along with proper sick pay for those having to self isolate then things would be a lot better today than they are. Sure nobody would have had a foreign holiday last year but I firmly believe most people would take that as a price well worth paying to be out the current situation. I would not when I where a lad very few people went abroad for a holiday.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
jabuzzard wrote:
MorningGory wrote:
@jabuzzard, Doesn't Scotland have autonomy for lockdown etc.?


Yes it does, but it doesn't have the autonomy to take the economic measures to mitigate any lockdown. As such the Scottish government is severely hampered in what it can do.


That only applies for furlough and other business supporting measures. Scotland could have still enforced quarantine at the border.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
jabuzzard wrote:
, but it doesn't have the autonomy to take the economic measures to mitigate any lockdown


Wrong again. They do have a certain amount of autonomy. They can't change the rates of support, which are the same for the entire UK, but can change who and when they get it.

e.g. When newly registered self employed were excluded (on the grounds of susceptibility to fraud), she over ruled the decision, and awarded it for Scots. (another case of buying votes?)

Autonomy for changing tiers also triggers various levels of support.

Sturgeon loves taking credit for anything positive, even when she played no part, but always wants to blame Westminster if it's negative news.
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You know it makes sense.
There is no doubt she has done a better job than that blundering baffoon but it is also equally true that she has played politics - always plays the n+1 rule AFTER UK government.
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I don't know how many times some people have to be told that NO part of the UK can be compared to NZ before it sinks in!

We might be an Island. Scotland is certainly not. It was not possible to isolate in the same way. There are simply too many points of entry/exit, too much cross border traffic, and too much trade passing through.

Trying to compare Scotland with the IoM is even more idiotic. Very easy to isolate themselves, especially at a time of year with very little tourism. A tiny population accessible through only 1 Port and 1 airport. Mostly self sufficent.

If it was so easy, then Shetland and Orkney could have done the same, but they couldn't.
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jabuzzard wrote:
The clueness of people south of the border to what actually goes on in Scotland is at times mind blowing.


Not really, most of the news we get is England (London!) based, very few non-Scots have any links to Scotland either, so it's (in the nicest possible way Smile ) not much interest to us.

An of course, the venom some of the Scots give to England (ref: your quote) doesn't inspire interest rolling eyes
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I'll be booking Japan for next winter as soon as a good deal on flights is available (normally I book around June ish for January)

Not totally confident I'll be able to go though.

Skiing in Europe will surely be fine by next winter.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Question mainly to the scots guys on here. Are the scottish ski resorts likely to be open next winter to visitors from England?
(Given that under devolved powers, the scottish government can ban internal leisure travel on covid grounds, if it so chooses.)

And in the meantime this summer, with differences over quarantine still simmering, is it likely that the police in scotland will be stopping cars, to check that visitors from England are not quarantine evaders? (I ask because my partner is keen for us to visit the cairngorms for walking.)
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peerless ploughman wrote:
Question mainly to the scots guys on here. Are the scottish ski resorts likely to be open next winter to visitors from England?
(Given that under devolved powers, the scottish government can ban internal leisure travel on covid grounds, if it so chooses.)

And in the meantime this summer, with differences over quarantine still simmering, is it likely that the police in scotland will be stopping cars, to check that visitors from England are not quarantine evaders? (I ask because my partner is keen for us to visit the cairngorms for walking.)


both police forces that straddle the border have categorically stated they will not be doing border checks as it is simply far too impractical. ski resorts will open dependent on weather conditions and covid restrictions. nothing to do with what side of the border you stay on.
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peerless ploughman wrote:
Question mainly to the scots guys on here. Are the scottish ski resorts likely to be open next winter to visitors from England?
(Given that under devolved powers, the scottish government can ban internal leisure travel on covid grounds, if it so chooses.)

And in the meantime this summer, with differences over quarantine still simmering, is it likely that the police in scotland will be stopping cars, to check that visitors from England are not quarantine evaders? (I ask because my partner is keen for us to visit the cairngorms for walking.)


I’m booked to go to the trossachs for Christmas week. Can’t see there being an issue unless we’re in a national lockdown.
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brianatab wrote:
jabuzzard wrote:
, but it doesn't have the autonomy to take the economic measures to mitigate any lockdown


Wrong again. They do have a certain amount of autonomy. They can't change the rates of support, which are the same for the entire UK, but can change who and when they get it.

e.g. When newly registered self employed were excluded (on the grounds of susceptibility to fraud), she over ruled the decision, and awarded it for Scots. (another case of buying votes?)

Autonomy for changing tiers also triggers various levels of support.

Sturgeon loves taking credit for anything positive, even when she played no part, but always wants to blame Westminster if it's negative news.


Gees you have absolutely no idea do you. The Scottish government has ZERO borrowing powers. It was to wait till Rishi Sunak decides to borrow some more and then there is a total lack of respect for the devolved administrations as it is sometimes weeks before the Treasury lets the devolved governments know what the Barnett consequentials are going to be. Oh and this is not just some SNP moaning as the highly unionist Welsh Labour and DUP have made exactly the same gripe.

Note I only happen to live in Scotland. I have never and will never vote for the SNP, but frankly I have given up on the union because the clowns in Westminster just spend their time making matters worse. They seem pathologically unable to do anything useful to save the union.
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Scottish schools went back earlier than the rest of the uk last summer

We had low figures in Wales as well. Weeks of low infection rates and days of zero covid deaths.
Once the schools and universities reopened, on top of easing all other restrictions, cases rocketed.
Thats not UK Gov fault.
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Kj82 wrote:
peerless ploughman wrote:
Question mainly to the scots guys on here. Are the scottish ski resorts likely to be open next winter to visitors from England?
(Given that under devolved powers, the scottish government can ban internal leisure travel on covid grounds, if it so chooses.)

And in the meantime this summer, with differences over quarantine still simmering, is it likely that the police in scotland will be stopping cars, to check that visitors from England are not quarantine evaders? (I ask because my partner is keen for us to visit the cairngorms for walking.)


both police forces that straddle the border have categorically stated they will not be doing border checks as it is simply far too impractical. ski resorts will open dependent on weather conditions and covid restrictions. nothing to do with what side of the border you stay on.


Yes but even when they where open this season I could not go despite being living and working in Scotland. It was all prebooked online only (with the exception of the Lecht who made no attempt to limit numbers or where they where coming from, got in the newspapers and spoilt it for everyone) and you would need a credit card registered at an appropriate address to make the booking. So for example living in Fife I could not book for Glenshee because I would have to give my address for my credit card and were I to lie on the form then the address would not match that of the card and the booking would be declined. Even if you wanted to go touring where are you going to book as you will run into the same issue. So basically you don't need police checks at the border to make it next to impossible. They could also put some ANPR up at the border crossings to make it easier to catch people. There are only 30 border road crossings and one of those is access from a farm, with 12 being unclassified roads, one being a track leading nowhere and another where the road crosses into England only to cross back into Scotland a few metres later (I compiled a list with OSGB36 grid coordinates for them all). The Scotland/England board is nothing like the NI/Ireland border with it's over 200 crossings.

My gut feeling is with enough vaccine uptake the answer to whether Scottish Ski resorts will be open to the English is yes. I have given up on them being open to me this year. Which is galling as it's the best season since at least 2013. I did sneak some touring in on the Lomands last Saturday though. I was gutted not to be able to get on the Thursday as that would have been epic, by Saturday the wind had blown it all about. However there where ski and snowboard tracks left raised in the snow so someone had a great time on Thursday Sad
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I gather the preferred police tactic is NOT to erect an actual road block, certainly not at the actual border, but to pull over drivers on rural main roads ( not usually dual carriageways, certainly not motorways) for questioning.
The covid regulations provide extra justification/ opportunity for doing this, especially in wales and scotland where devolved governments have imposed more specific 'stay at home' rules against travel across the invisible boundaries between counties or council areas.
So the car's condition and its paperwork may be in order, but its driver can be stopped, delayed for a while, quizzed in detail about the reason for the journey, and fined and turned back if it's an inessential journey. Or more severe consequences for a quarantine case.
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If we aren't able to ski next season, then not being able to ski will be the least of our concerns....
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