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When are skis too old?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Hi Snowheads,
Now that I have bagged a cheap deal to be able to take my own skis on the 2021 end of ski bash,
I've got to decide what to take with me.

I've got a pair of of Salamon Enduro XT800 made of titanium and the "Old Bamboo" which were new and fabulous in 2012 ..
If a bit long for me at 182cm.

They {The Salamons} are in good nick, but am I delusional that an 8 year old pair of skis still have not lost their "pop"?
And perform just as well as the last time I took them out .. in 2015.

What do the Snowheads think?
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
DrLawn wrote:
Salamon Enduro XT800


A bag o'5h*te!!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Obviously I don’t know anything but what could have happened to alter them in 5 years storage?

I actually think you should treat yourself to new skis though, many good ski bargains around...

hth Blush
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No way have they lost their pop.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
When they have 150 to 200 days then they are getting old
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You'll need to Register first of course.
Skis are too old when you're trying to justify new ones.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
@adithorp, +1 Very Happy
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Only good for the museum.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
hi @kittya I had to look up "hth" .... I have the same thoughts how often do we have to buy skis?
I didn't have to look up "o'5h*te" though, but I don't agree, but perhaps I just don't have enough experience?
I misread @Dave of the Marmottes answer first time I read it.
and cheers @adithorp ... I think that just about sums it all up.

I haven't used my own skis for a few years, mainly due to the cost of carriage, but with EasyJet letting me take them for a couple of quid. Its going to be hard to justify spending over €100 to rent the latest and greatest.

Cheers guys and girls for your input ... I really didnt know the answer to this.
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I've been wondering much the same over the years, @DrLawn. Slowly coming to the conclusion that skis do age and go off, even if you do not use them. It's well known that in the weeks immediately after they are manufactured, the curing processes take some time to complete. Hence you can sometimes get skis that are not completely flat even though they are new. My guess is that various ageing and curing processes probably continue, albeit slowly, for many more years. I got a strong hint of that from my 1992 K2 skis that I kept for the nostalgia but not used for several decades now. They have spontaneously de-laminated. Now, it's only the top sheet that has come away from the rest, but even the top sheet will be adding to the skis' performance to some extent, even if marginal. With your specific skis, they have a habit of de-laminating anyway (even when new) - mine did and likewise for about half of the people I ever came across who had them. If SpyderJon is lurking would be great to have his opinion on this all too...
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@DrLawn, An intermediate ski, made in the Chepelare factory in Bulgaria. Salomon's mass-production base that used to make the "iconic" Bulgarian brand "Orion". Cheap as chips!
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Thanks for your input @bobski62,
I think I'd be calling it a day with Skis from 1992 .. My Volkl P10's from that same era went in the skip a long time ago.
I wish I'd kept them though ... you know why .. just that nostalgia of remembering when and where you could drive them ... all 195cm worth.

I've still got a pair of Volkl Snow Rangers though, I bought them in 1996 ...
I remember the Mark Warner guide saying to me at the time ... "You're not going to use them on the piste are you?"
I suppose they looked a bit wide at the time .. (I just went out to measure the width in the garage ... but they were too far back in the pile)

But while I was out there @skimastaaah I had a closer look at the bag o'5h*te
I think you are probably thinking of a different bag ...
They are one of the best pair of skis I've ever owned ... heavy as hell ...
and it says on the tail of one of them:
"made in Austria, sandwich sidewall, double TI laminate, full woodcore,
R 17.9 109 81 125
182"

So there ... its worse than insulting a mans wife, saying his skis are a bag o'5h*te
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
But for 99p each way I'm going to find out if they are still good ...
Will they keep up with my current rental choices ..
Rossignal Hero short turn, Head Magnum or as its the Oxylis ... Salomon X12.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
I like the
Quote:
double TI laminate
bit.

It shouldn't be long before that becomes 2 x single TI laminate ... Mine only lasted a handful of weeks before they de-lam'ed. But I did enjoy them while they lasted. I glued them back together with epoxy and put three bolts through the tails of each, drilling some holes. They gave me a bit more use that way as rock-hoppers but soon I grew to hate them as de-lam'ed skis, I realised, have very little performance. Thumbs up for the Head Magnums; delightful. But mine are worn out now in every respect. Picked up some Atomic Redster S9s last winter to replace them and still trying to find their limits! Right now, they still have bigger balls than I do.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@bobski62 I must admit mine are becoming a bit curly at the tails I noticed last night where I've stood them up on hard surfaces.

And I too rate the Magnums a lot, usually I get to have a brand new pair from Mountain Mystery ... this season they had been used already and although they looked in good nick, they didn't seem to be as wonderful as a new pair.
Later in the week I tried the Rossi Hero, it took just a while to get used to them and suddenly I was "in the Zone" with them ...
perhaps it was because the sun came out.

I just had a thought .. I can't actually remember taking the P10s to the tip, I wonder if they are down the shed in the old Thule Box.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Just to add my own humble opinion.
While I do agree with @bobski62 that the epoxy will age this might not be the main consideration. The abuse they have received during that time will determine how they have aged. Epoxy resins are good for a long time, it is the bonding between the different materials that will start to show if they are subject to a lot of stress.
I can't see why you don't just take them along, you only have the 99p to loose if you then hire.
One thing that has not been said as far as I can see is what about the bindings, these are a crucial piece of safety as far as I'm concerned. The spring will age and they may have rusted up inside.
So you have enough justification to take them out, to then hire a top of the range for a day and then buy the new skis you desire. Toofy Grin
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@BFG_Skier, my thoughts precisely!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
DrLawn wrote:


So there ... its worse than insulting a mans wife, saying his skis are a bag o'5h*te


Wish I could change my wife for an updated version in the way I change my skis! wink

Originally Salomon produced bindings, then innovative ski boots (sx 90/91/92 Equipe), followed by game changing skis (9000 Equipe 2S). Then the inclusion into the Amer Corp and previous Adidas coupling, Salomon just become another "marque" taken from their original sports breeding and palmed-off to the masses as mass produced commercial "tat". I demo'ed the Sally XT 800 Ti's back in 2013/2014 with SCGB and was rather unimpressed, dull skis with too much chatter. A year later Salomon produced the X-Race, which was a different class of ski that punched way above the Salomon norm. If you fondly regard the XT 800's go for something like the Salomon XDR Ti in either 84 or 88mm …….. https://www.snowcountry.eu/salomon-xdr-88-ti.html?country=GB&curr=GBP&gclid=Cj0KCQjw2PP1BRCiARIsAEqv-pQZfhSNY1tBrkX793mf8-8RTsa0OuxDEwolLtgb8nGMD8hXsn-CrPUaArmIEALw_wcB in as long a length that is comfortable for you.

There are some bargain skis out there to be found. Personally I'd go for the Blizzard Brahma 88 for the versatility of that particular ski, or Whitedot Altum 94 ("these skis are as close to the mythical one ski quiver as i can imagine. they performed impeccably and brought a huge smile to my face in some of the most diverse and challenging conditions I’ve ever skied in.")
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The comment about 150 to 200 days constitutes old, sent me scuttling off for my records.
My old K2 Wayback88 have clocked around 400 days and are still enjoyable. I would point out that I service them myself thus prolonging base life. They are looking a little rough on the top sheet but its all about the surface that contacts the snow. I'm fully expecting to get a 2021 season from them.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
From experience, and as a 'rule of thumb' I think you are in the right ball park @Rogerdodger, it's generally in the 100s. But I've found it has varied from ski to ski. An industry chap I spoke to a few winters ago maintained that some - low end- skis have a design life as short as eight weeks of use! I found that pretty shocking but I guess that if a typical intermediate-level skier uses them for half a dozen week-long holidays and then life moves on or they trade up, it kinda makes sense. I've used the Head Magnums about 200 (fairly full-on) days. In the last few weeks, they definitely were past their best. Even with the sharpest of edges they would give me a modicum of grip right under the foot, but little else. Noodles basically.

A stray thought I had this winter. As a skier, I really (really) enjoy my turns. I remember someone commenting once on a day tour that they could tell my line on a descent from everyone else's as it was twice as squiggly! Now... made me wonder: if you do twice as many turns skiing as someone else who likes to just 'stand on their skis' / straight line it, do you wear out your skis twice as fast!? I don't mean edges or base, I mean losing their torsional stiffness.
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Hi guys, the reason I ask is that years ago when skis were mostly made of wood and had the edges in short sections screwed in, I think we were supposed to store them with tips and tails taped together and a block of wood keeping the centres apart. I don't bother with any of that any more, I did do it with my first pair of skis for a couple of weeks .. which were Blizzards with a Red & White diamond pattern on them .. circa 1975.
I don't know if there were any good or not ... I ripped the soles off them on their first outing at the White Lady in Aviemore.
I suspect there were not very good ... I'll never know.

So @skimastaaah your misses had better not be watching this thread.
I'm sorry you did not appreciate the XT800's ...but it takes all sorts and its great to have a great range of boards for all tastes.

I've tried Whitedots a few times and despite so many people gushing about them, I just don't get it, with them.
I see you're fond of what I call tubby skis 84 & up, and that's great if you like them.
I did have an urge for Rossignol Experience 84 when the were Black and Yellow, but I rented some that felt as dull as ditchwater, probably death by a thousand rentals.
I've not had the pleasure of X-Race, but I really like the Salomon X-Max 12 ... I really loved these and nearly bought some last year as you could get them for £205.

But should we bother with old model skis ... as the clock is probably ticking from the moment they come off the production line.
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
A ski is too old when it no longer performs the way you want. This could be due to it being knackered or it could be that your skiing has changed to now require something different. Either way, it’s the end for the relationship.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Yeah I just don't buy the skis age out thing. I've had skis I acquired after they'd already had a very tough paper round* and ended up flogging for another 80+ days until edges finally popped. Mind you since zero camber and rocker came along losing "pop" is a lot less relevant and you'd notice it more with a high camber piste ski.
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My old Nordica Enforcers did wear out after 11 years of skiing and touring. Must have done approx 500 days on them. They really had lost all their pop and felt lifeless.I updated them to the new Enforcer Free as my all mountain ski, such a difference Cool
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@Dave of the Marmottes, my Atomic SL11s died after about 18 weeks/6 years. They decambered & went all floppy.
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 snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@Gordyjh, sounds fair - at around 110ish days then?

I wasn't actually suggesting that you don't wear "pop" out but the OP is talking about skis bought in 2012 and last used in 2015. Unless they have been kept in a particularly hostile environment I can't see why storing them for 5 years has made them unskiable. I have some fairly lightly used skis from 2010 that I wouldn't consider unskiable for some considerable time, which at the current rate of use may be longer than my practical ability to ski them.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@DrLawn, See my comment on your boot thread. Same applies to skis. Plastic and metal will degrade over time and you don't want to shred an edge.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@RedandWhiteFlachau, metal that is kept dry doesn't 'degrade' over time. Normal use is not going to result in either plastic deformation or fatigue of any metal layers in a ski. If the layers start to separate over time that is what will cause any change in stiffness of the ski. Maybe wood cores become softer over time, I don't know
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Our 2010 Mantras did ~400 days before edges were too thin to go through the machine...
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@Dave of the Marmottes, something like that.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@rambotion, Metal Fatigue. "A weakness that develops in metal structures that are used repeatedly" In materials science, fatigue is the weakening of a material caused by cyclic loading that results in failure. Or, Polymer fatigue, which is the process of damage to the friction surface of polymer caused by repeated cyclic stresses (deformations) whose amplitude does not exceed the ultimate strength of the polymer. In both cases there is a potential for a catastrophic failure and that is why manufacturers will recommend a shelf life on Skis and Boots. I would agree that failure is more likely to occur at junctions of materials; layers within the ski, metal edge glued to side wall (I've seen that rip off), screws holding bindings in place (seen) or within the more fragile binding components themselves when put under stress.
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