 Poster: A snowHead
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So, in response to a question earlier, I thought we could benefit from a thread devoted to mounting bindings.
I've been fitting bindings for 30 years, first in a ski shop in Zermatt, in the shop mostly with jigs, but sometimes without, since leaving I've always used paper templates.
Most shops in resort nowadays have the necessary mounting jigs and a good proportion in the UK as well, but for those who can't access these, or want to DIY I'll put together some resources here 
Obviously you'll need a template, pretty much all bindings are out there, just Google "xxx binding paper template"
Or, if you're lucky, your bindings came with a template in the box.
Wildsnow have most of the touring templates here:
https://www.wildsnow.com/backcountry-skiing-search/?cx=partner-pub-8093284038752434%3Ayxtlw7-4zut&cof=FORID%3A11&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=templates&sa=Search
Binding Freedom also have most of the popular Alpine models here:
https://www.bindingfreedom.com/paper-tempaltes/
Note, you'll need a few things too:
1/ A reasonable ability to measure, drill and screw things
2/ A couple of step drills, 3,6mm x 9mm for skis without a metal reinforcing plate in the binding mount area and 4,1 x 9mm for metal reinforced skis (and I think carbon skis) If mounting junior skis then a 3,5mm x 7mm is required as these are generally shallower underfoot
3/ Waterproof wood glue, binding glue or epoxy
4/ Binding screw tap for metal reinforced skis
5/ Countersink bit
6/ Your best #3 Posidrive screwdriver/T20 for Dynafit bindings (never use a bit in a drill, too much torque)
7/ Centre punch
Contact Spyderjon at the Piste Office for binding tools:
https://thepisteoffice.com/index.php/the-piste-office-store/binding-mounting-tools.html
or Tognar:
https://www.tognar.com/binding_tools_boot_canting_glue_ski_snowboard.html
You can get away with a depth collar on an ordinary drill bit, but you must be absolutely sure it doesn't slip for obvious reasons!!!
If you're in the slightest bit unsure of your abilities, then (and maybe always) do a trial mount first on a piece of wood to test your work!
When using the paper templates, there's normally a scale printed to check the printer scaling is correct, don't miss this step.
There's plenty of advice out there on this, not all of it perfect!
Naturally any additions/corrections welcomed
Ken
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| KenX wrote: |
If you're in the slightest bit unsure of your abilities, then (and maybe always) do a trial mount first on a piece of wood to test your work!
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Best tip ever
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Mounted my first pair last year, when I swapped Marker Schizo bindings for some Beast 14s touring bindings. Bought the bindings and drill bits from Jon at The Piste Office, and with much help and a template from Jon on avoiding hole clashes gave it a go. First test mounted on a piece of wood, which I’d highly advise if you don’t do this often. It took quite a long time as I checked, double checked, triple checked the hole placement. But great result!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Mounted a second pair the other day - bought my son some Bent Chelter BC skis, and because I don’t know what boot size he’ll be and hope they might last more than one season, I bought some Atomic Warden 11 demo bindings (wasn’t too easy to find demo bindings with 95mm+ brakes). Again test mounted on a piece of wood. The paper template I found online for Warden bindings was perfect for the toe, and position of rear holes on the heel gave the correct length (and boot centre placement versus my imaginary recommended line on my piece of wood), but the hole pattern on the heel wasn’t correct. I marked up the holes on the skis, but didn’t double check the hole positions by laying the binding over them. Doh. As a result the holes were a mm or two out, which made getting the screws in very difficult! Made a bit of a pigs ear out of the first one, but got it screwed down super solid in the end. Learned my lessons for the second ski.
It’s very satisfying to mount your own skis.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Have been doing my own mounts for about 10 years now so a few hints below from my experience, adding to above
Getting the centre line right is vital, measure from the edges not the top sheet, sloping sidewalls can make it rather wonky, I have a little draper analogue caliper that works well.
The boot centre mark on a pair of skis is often out, check, measure from the tip
As said above always check the scale on a paper template, I have a selection of old wooden bed slats from an old bunk bed to do test mounts on. If I have not used the template before I always do a test mount, screw the bindings on and put the boot in checking boot centre and forward pressure is ok. For example I have 4 different set ups for Rossi fks. 2 jigs of different ages, 1 plastic sticky one that came with a pair of new bindings and a paper template, they are all slightly different as far as boot centre and forward pressure set up is concerned.
Watch for the hole volcanoing when you screw on the bindings, I always countersink the holes very slightly, the proper drill bits do this anyway,
I purchased a little screwdriver type torque wrench that does the 4nm, don't over tighten the screws
Hope that is. Useful ? If I think of anything else will post it
Thread should be a sticky as kenx suggested, as it could be a superb resource, epicski used to be great, tgr is as well if you can ignore the rudeness!!
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Mon 24-12-18 14:11; edited 1 time in total
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Re volcanoing, screw the screws in halfway, without the binding, then remove them. Use countersink to remove the volcano, then fit for real (man)
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@KenX, Thank you
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| Zorrac wrote: |
Thread should be a sticky as kenx suggested |
Done
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Always check after mounting for any gaps under the bindings, if in doubt, remove and sort the problem, don't be tempted to tighten "a tad more" as it will almost certainly strip the thread........
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@spyderjon, basically the same
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Oh, and buy a bag of the orange rubber rings for Kilner jars for a quid or so, perfect for holding the brakes up, good for ski tuning too 
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You know it makes sense.
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| Quote: |
Getting the centre line right is vital, measure from the edges not the top sheet......I have a little draper analogue caliper that works well. |
2 set-squares against each edge (one either side) is another easy way to accurately locate the centre
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| geoffers wrote: |
| Quote: |
Getting the centre line right is vital, measure from the edges not the top sheet......I have a little draper analogue caliper that works well. |
2 set-squares against each edge (one either side) is another easy way to accurately locate the centre |
Or the folder paper trick
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Poster: A snowHead
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To centre a drill over existing holes when re-drilling for qk-inserts I scribed some cross-hairs on some clear plastic which I could stick to the ski, then centre the bit on the cross rather than hope that centring over the hole was accurate
Existing hole would probably have self-centred the bit, but this made sure...
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Finding the centre line is probably the most difficult part. I now print off a couple of paper tape measures with a mm scale. Tape them onto the ski clear of where the mounting will go after taping down a length of masking tape down the centre of the ski.
One end on a convenient clear "tens" marking on one steel edge, and the other end does the measuring on the opposite edge. Then simple to work out where the centre is to the nearest say 0.2mm. Even if the tape is at a slight angle across the ski, the centre will still be at half the measurement.
Camping shops sell tent peg rubber bands approx 115mm long - excellent to hold brakes.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| geoffers wrote: |
| Quote: |
Getting the centre line right is vital, measure from the edges not the top sheet......I have a little draper analogue caliper that works well. |
2 set-squares against each edge (one either side) is another easy way to accurately locate the centre |
I like to use a Vernier caliper to do this too and just scribe two marks into the top sheet at about a quarter and three-quarters along the length of the ski. I don't worry about the marks in the top sheet as the skis are going to get scratched to bits anyway.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I've been doing this for tele bindings for years. My tip is to print the template onto transparent film --- easier to get centered and straight on the ski.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@geoffers, @spyderjon, @colinstone, @Kelskii, @ski, @altis, agreed, centre line is paramount
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If you've mounted the screws with epoxy, a soldering iron placed on the heads makes it easy to remove afterwards as it will soften the epoxy! Don't forget to clean the threads up on the screws afterwards when you re-use them........
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Final way to get your centre line (probably only good for shops/techs who lack the actual correct jig).
Place any jig on the ski, mark the holes with a pen not a drill, draw an X between the 4 front holes and another between the 4 back holes.
A line drawn between the two centres of the X's is the centre line, now crack on and use the paper/plastic template.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| KenX wrote: |
| Re volcanoing, screw the screws in halfway, without the binding, then remove them. Use countersink to remove the volcano, then fit for real (man) |
Personally prefer to do the screw thing, but then dress the ski surface flat with a chisel not use a counter sink. This also helps with the sort of shwarf type 'peelings' you can get around the holes after drilling if the top sheet is the tough anti scratch type.
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What's the view on the best way to fill old holes ? I've gone the wire wool \ Epoxy route, but it's a bit time consuming. I see @spyderjon, sells plastic plugs - are these an option.
Also - any views on the clearance gap for old and new holes. Unfortunately the pattern on the rear of the set I'm putting on is only about 1mm different to the old.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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According to experienced folk law you need 1.8 mm of metal plate between holes if the old one is properly filled, though I always round this up to 2mm. If you have no metal plate then I'd increase that further.
The plastic plugs are best fillers in my opinion, though be sure to clean out the old holes before hammering them in as you could compress the stuff inside making bumps on the base.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@AndAnotherThing.., for a non metal ski I don't like going less than 10mm centre to centre (measured along the length of the ski) so that's about 5/6mm edge to edge. But it depends upon the ski construction, which set of holes it is, how lardy'n'aggressive you are and if you're hucking etc. I always avoid a line of holes across the width of the ski as well as in front of the new toe etc.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Sun 27-10-19 20:47; edited 1 time in total
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2mm's a bit tight.........
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You know it makes sense.
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Thanks all. I'll have a measure.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I've manufactured a batch of Drill'n'Tap Guide to enable DIY binding mounters and Quiver Killer insert installers that don't have access to a professional binding jig or drill press to easily drill and tap holes that are perpendicular to the top sheet of the ski and that won't 'wander'.
It's 25mm thick to ensure that the drill/tap can't be tilted and it has a series of three different precision sized holes to accommodate all binding drilling/tapping requirements:
- 3 x holes for all binding mounting step drills / the 12AB metal layer binding tap / the Quiver Killer insert step drill / the Quiver Killer tap / the Quiver Killer Pro installation tool
- 3 x holes for the Quiver Killer 'Rescue' drill bit
- 2 x holes for the Quiver Killer 'Rescue' tap
When used for drilling the guide should be clamped to the ski but when tapping it can simply be hand held.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Thu 19-11-20 1:00; edited 3 times in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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Nice! How much?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Great idea
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Nice one @spyderjon, Significantly more portable than my pillar drill workbench setup at home - this will meet a need for me.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Anybody used the binding freedom insert deburring tool for cleaning the hole before inserting quiver killer inserts?
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@spyderjon, hang on a minute....
How come you're working on our skis whilst clearly wearing one of Roop's T's? That's got to be against the brand guidelines!
I suspect that entire picture rich post is merely a poorly disguised attempt to acquire a new Whitedot T next time I drop by 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Big thumbs up for the drill n tap guide from the piste office. After bothching up a QK install on my bro in laws skis (2x toe qk inserts out a few mm) i purchased the qk rescue kit and drill n tap guide which both worked a treat.
Not sure if this is the normal way for removing a QK insert but I found it easier to already have the nut and locking bolts in the qk insert before heating.
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FAQ
