 Poster: A snowHead
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Saw this today on Planet Ski. Interesting topic and has caused quite a bit of debate on Twitter already. http://www.planetski.eu/news/6690.
I'm all in favour if it helps stop mindless out of control skiing,
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Been debated rather a lot.
Not nearly as much as helmets.
Just as much consensus.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| under a new name wrote: |
Been debated rather a lot.
Not nearly as much as helmets.
Just as much consensus. |
Did you see the story from a writer at Planet Ski. She got a broken leg from an out of control skier, he didn't stop and skied off with his friends.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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We have piste police in Avoriaz apparently
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Thank you.
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In Whistler we have loads of mountain safety people who pull passes from the skiers/boarders if they go too fast in a slow zone.
And for the more serious stuff we even have actual police who ski around all day and they carry guns  .
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I saw an out of control child about 10 have his skis taken off him in Flaine at New Year by a lift operator. It was the right thing to do he literally went from top to bottom arms waving, screaming in a straight line with no regards to anybody else. Piste was a green and used by lots of small children in ski school.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
I saw an out of control child about 10 have his skis taken off him in Flaine at New Year by a lift operator
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his father (or so-called responsible adult) should probably have had the balls taken off him.
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@Linnylou26, yes I did see. Dreadful. And your point is?
Debated on here nearly much as compulsory helmets and with as much conclusion.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| under a new name wrote: |
@Linnylou26, yes I did see. Dreadful. And your point is?
Debated on here nearly much as compulsory helmets and with as much conclusion. |
I wasn't trying to create any trouble or huge debate just thought it was an interesting topic and wondered what people's thoughts were.
I wouldn't be without my helmet and wouldn't let my children ski without one. I respect it's people's own choice and wouldn't think anything less.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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[quote="pam w"][quote]
Exactly it certainly made my own child 7 think a bit.
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I don't think a kp/h limit, as shown in the photo is workable or fair, unless skis are going to start to be equipped with speedometers, but having a "no faster than the general flow of traffic" rule on some pistes seems totally reasonable, and perhaps a more general one to ski with "due care and consideration" at all times. And to take lift passes from anyone who blatantly breaks the rules.
It is a little ironic when people start talking of sticking to black runs as a safety measure (as I've seen on some threads)...
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You know it makes sense.
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@Linnylou26, definitely, children should wear helmets. No argument. But for very different reasons than adults.
But piste policing is a perennial topic that comes up every time someone's on-piste stupidity is reported somewhere. (I'm guessing at least once a year?) There doesn't seem to be any easy solution, other than education.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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"This month Vail Resorts in the USA has issued a speeding ticket to a person that was skiing too fast in a slow zone"
I'm in favour of a fine for that that tortured pronoun.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Robhogg, "No faster than the general flow of traffic" sounds reasonable but is probably entirely impractical (measurement of general flow) and doesn't help the nervous beginner in the middle... But (see below) could be a restatement of rule2...
"Due care and consideration" is surely encompassed in the generally adopted but rarely enforced F.I.S. Rules, at #1 http://www.fis-ski.com/mm/Document/documentlibrary/Administrative/02/04/30/10FISRulesofConduct-English-A4_Neutral.pdf
Problem really is that you can't easily legislate against stupidity, nor ignorance. Unless you are Robert Redford.
If everyone knew they own capabilities and limits and followed the FI s rules while understanding what they mean*, we'd have fewer problems.
* e.g. Appropriate speed means you can avoid any obstacle or skier in front of you no matter what they do.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Personally, I'm a believer in that everyone should have a Mountain License.
the rule would be very simple
1. You MUST have a Ski/Board license to buy a lift pass.
2. In order to get a Ski/Board license you complete lessons and a safety course and pass a test at the end of it.
3. You can accumulate points on your license (similar to a driving license) if you are caught speeding, drunk in charge of Ski/Board equipment (breathalyser required), skiing/boarding without due care and attention etc etc
4. If you Injure someone on the mountain you are liable for the injured parties expenses if you are proved at fault.
5. You must provide proof of insurance at the time of buying your pass - or buy a pass with insurance included.
6. If you accumulate enough offenses your license is suspended, your ski pass removed and you must pass a new ski/board & safety test before allowed on to buy a pass again.
7. repeat offenders are banned for 1 year, 3 years or life according to either the severity of the offenses or the amount of time you re-offend
In a world with an ever increasing population one must consider that the slopes will become more crowded. consider it preventative measures.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@Insiders, that's completely over the top IMO. Vast majority of skiers and boarders are responsible, and the vast majority of skiers and boarders return from holiday after holiday having had a great time. Simply no need to create a massive bureaucracy, which would not guarantee to fix the isolated examples of dangerous skiing we see on the slopes.
Piste Patrol having the ability to dispense advice about responsible slope use, hand out warnings, and in the last resort pull liftpasses for a set amount of time seems like a sensible way forward.
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@Insiders,
You could apply that to just about anything,
1. You MUST have a Child Buggy/Pram license to buy a buggy or a pram ( especially those stupid three wheel "look I jog with my sprog ones" ).
2. In order to get a Buggy/Pram license you complete lessons and a safety course and pass a test at the end of it.
3. You can accumulate points on your license (similar to a driving license) if you are caught speeding around the aisle of Tesco/Waitrose/Lidl/Aldi whilst on phone to Chardonnay your best mate discussing rubbish without due care and attention etc etc
4. If you Injure someone you are liable for the injured parties expenses if you are proved at fault.
5. You must provide proof of insurance at the time of buying your buggy/pram ( higher excess for those stupid "I jog with my sprog" ones
6. If you accumulate enough offenses your license is suspended, your buggy/pram is removed and you must pass a new buggy/pram safety test before allowed on to buy a pram/buggy again.
7. repeat offenders are banned for 1 year, 3 years or life according to either the severity of the offenses or the amount of time you re-offend
In a world with an ever increasing population one must consider that the aisles will become more crowded. consider it preventative measures.
Please apply above rules to just about anything.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Timbobaggins,
That's a pretty lame response to a fair point
And SOME people DO need a pram/buggy license
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@rob@rar, If you're responsible - you've got nothing to worry about 
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@Insiders,
Sense of humour ????
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@Timbobaggins, where was yours then???
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Insiders,
Probably where yours is/was 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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LOL - peoples opinions would change very fast if they'd sustained life changing injuries from a drunk, out of control skier...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Timbobaggins wrote: |
@Insiders,
Probably where yours is/was |
I don't really think being made disable from a crazy out of control skier is a funny matter requiring some kind of sense of humour
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Maybe all that's needed is a little common sense.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Insiders wrote: |
| @rob@rar, If you're responsible - you've got nothing to worry about |
I'd worry about the hordes of people who would be put off snowsports because of the ludicrous rules surrounding it.
Not the first time this idea has been discussed on snowHeads
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Insiders wrote: |
| LOL - peoples opinions would change very fast if they'd sustained life changing injuries from a drunk, out of control skier... |
There is a tough driving test, stringent laws, automatic speed cameras, marked and unmarked police cars some of which are dedicated to enforcing these rules, yet we still have needless deaths and injuries on our roads. What makes you think introducing something similar for skiing is going to make a difference to the small number of serious incidents, like the one which happened to my friend quoted earlier in this thread?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Timbobaggins wrote: |
@Insiders,
You could apply that to just about anything,
1. You MUST have a Child Buggy/Pram license to buy a buggy or a pram ( especially those stupid three wheel "look I jog with my sprog ones" ).
2. In order to get a Buggy/Pram license you complete lessons and a safety course and pass a test at the end of it.
3. You can accumulate points on your license (similar to a driving license) if you are caught speeding around the aisle of Tesco/Waitrose/Lidl/Aldi whilst on phone to Chardonnay your best mate discussing rubbish without due care and attention etc etc
4. If you Injure someone you are liable for the injured parties expenses if you are proved at fault.
5. You must provide proof of insurance at the time of buying your buggy/pram ( higher excess for those stupid "I jog with my sprog" ones
6. If you accumulate enough offenses your license is suspended, your buggy/pram is removed and you must pass a new buggy/pram safety test before allowed on to buy a pram/buggy again.
7. repeat offenders are banned for 1 year, 3 years or life according to either the severity of the offenses or the amount of time you re-offend
In a world with an ever increasing population one must consider that the aisles will become more crowded. consider it preventative measures.
Please apply above rules to just about anything. |
I would extend this scheme to supermarket trolleys as well 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| rob@rar wrote: |
| There is a tough driving test, stringent laws, automatic speed cameras, marked and unmarked police cars some of which are dedicated to enforcing these rules, yet we still have needless deaths and injuries on our roads. |
Road casualties are the lowest since records began despite the number of cars on the road being close to a historic high. So those tests, cameras etc have apparently made a difference. Which does not mean I favour controls on skiing. It's a silly discussion anyway as resorts aren't about to make it harder for people to buy lift passes.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| dogwatch wrote: |
| Road casualties are the lowest since records began despite the number of cars on the road being close to a historic high. So those tests, cameras etc have apparently made a difference. Which does not mean I favour controls on skiing. It's a silly discussion anyway as resorts aren't about to make it harder for people to buy lift passes. |
You're right. So maybe sensible measures to moderate a small problem is the way forward, rather than drastic measures which will suck the joy out of skiing holidays despite not eradicating dangerous skiing?
Agreed it's a silly discussion, for the reason you cite.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I have a lot of respect for what I ahve seen of the Italian way of policing the pistes.
ONLY people causing danger to others are harassed/prosecuted - those causing real danger and or injury are delt with harshly.
Race kids going round for the thex lap of the race piste at 90kph are no issue, they are in control. The out of control middle aged skier at 40kph will loose his lift pass. The loud durnks crahing around the piste may be asked to leave town. The russian who crahes like a boling ball into the skiscool class gets thrown out of the country and his passport stampped DO NOT RETURN, regardless of his political connections .
I most regularily see them 50m from the cafe at the bottom of Zerotta, watching people return form the off piste run off Cresta Yula/Arp - they are checking to ensure people are properly equipped. We smill and nod, sometimes say hi and comment on conditions.
Those with no backpack will of course be asked a few questions, the results depend more on their attitude to the fact they were doing something they weren't supposed to be doing - some get a firm taliking to, at the other end of the spectrum, they are walking doen the road to Courmayeur sans skis or liftpass 
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@Idris, I'd be happy to see that kind of common sense applied more widely.
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France already has piste police. Their job is to arrest responsible leaders who, allegedly, take work from ski instructors incapable of teaching people to ski under control.
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No need for any extra rules most lift passes are electronic we live in a CCTV world if someone hits another person and ski/boards off without stopping/giving details and a description can be given there is a reasonably good chance that the person could be identified from CCTV at top and bottom of lifts this is then tied into info about who purchased the lift pass, it can be suspended and the person needs to do a course/be given advice or in very serious incidents the police brought in.
Give everyone on lessons a copy of the skiway code, and actually use it during lessons so pupils learn the importance of the code.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Insiders wrote: |
Personally, I'm a believer in that everyone should have a Mountain License.
the rule would be very simple
1. You MUST have a Ski/Board license to buy a lift pass.
2. In order to get a Ski/Board license you complete lessons and a safety course and pass a test at the end of it.
3. You can accumulate points on your license (similar to a driving license) if you are caught speeding, drunk in charge of Ski/Board equipment (breathalyser required), skiing/boarding without due care and attention etc etc
4. If you Injure someone on the mountain you are liable for the injured parties expenses if you are proved at fault.
5. You must provide proof of insurance at the time of buying your pass - or buy a pass with insurance included.
6. If you accumulate enough offenses your license is suspended, your ski pass removed and you must pass a new ski/board & safety test before allowed on to buy a pass again.
7. repeat offenders are banned for 1 year, 3 years or life according to either the severity of the offenses or the amount of time you re-offend
In a world with an ever increasing population one must consider that the slopes will become more crowded. consider it preventative measures. |
oh well that's the Russians and londoners hols up the spout, probably Parisians as well
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Gotta agree that more rules won't help. 99% of slope users are responsible and in control (excusing those on their first day on snow, who really aren't a danger to anyone but themselves). It is the 1% that need educated not the 99% that need over regulated.
We all really have to take responsibility. Out of control, dangerous, skiing should be castigated by all slope users. It is an onus on all of us to speak out and let those idiots know that their actions are unacceptable. That attitude was certainly very prevalent when I was learning, I'll admit I got chastised by my peers a few times in those formative years.
I got taken out in Italy at Christmas by some clown, luckily I was only a bit tender but he took a chunk out of my ski and his edges sliced through my ski pants. No one picked him up on it (he stopped well downhill of me, and I had a fair walk uphill to get my hat so he was long gone before I could get to him). This wouldn't have happened before, I am sure he would have been given a dressing down by others in the past.
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FAQ
What next apply your 'rules' to pedestrians in this country - not allowing them to go out without a competency test 
