 Poster: A snowHead
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The problem is when the Biggest ...... of the lot happens to receive high accolade of the council, if I thought all the reps were like that (and fortunately I know a number of reps who are not) then I'd cancell my membership today
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Pete Horn wrote: |
| Four of my friends joined last autumn, principally for discounts, but two of them have used the Repping service as well and liked it. |
I was one of those four, and one of the two who used the repping service.
I resigned my membership, by cancelling my direct debit, after MO day (amazingly the DD tried to come out the next day, but failed!  ). I'd used the repping service before and fully intened to re-join, but the point was worth making at the time. When I re-joined, I effectively got £10 off my holiday and free membership.
That there same membership has now earned me, and a whole load of (10) non-members, 10% off the holiday that we've just booked for March 2006. I'll renew again, as when I'm on said holiday, I'll want to go out skiing with the rep.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Well there's a nice bit of personal abuse going on on the SCGB forum now, in response to Nick starting his thread about people watching what they say and being a bit more considerate. Seems like a few people have taken exception to what's been said here. Just ignore what they say D G Orf, but don't stop posting there as that's what they'd like - to get rid of any criticism.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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just had a look myself.APPALING attitude by 2 members. DGOrf , you have my support too!
I am currently reconsidering my membership of that club.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I never joined having met one appalling character of a rep in ValD' and later a couple of others who gave the impression that the 'Ski' in the title was quite important and that this scruffy boarder oik wouldn't find it to his taste. I only became interested again with all the hoo-ha surrounding MO day.
Post that, my primary interest has been in its marketing efforts and the policies behind them.
I’ve also had the pleasure(sic) of the virtual company of some of its snaggle-tongued apologists who did nothing to promote the prospect of a open armed inclusive community working for the best interests of us all. In fact quite the reverse, they exampled and reinforced all the negative aspects that had been voiced (you reading this Gerry and Tim), in trying to shout/shut down open argument. At the very best they did their club great disservice.
Dispassionately, the SCGB can only be viewed as a retailer with a mandatory social club fee.
It’s also interesting to see how they’re leveraging their membership strength. As you’re aware I’m looking for a year round ski insurance and ostensibly the SCGB’s ‘Executive Annual’ could be worth a look (anyone with a policy doc I could read?)
But if you go to their supplier: http://www.primaryinsurance.co.uk/index.html and try to buy ski insurance . . . guess where you’re redirected?
Laughably, the only, and I mean only, snow activities excluded from Primary's annual policy are skiing and boarding . . . you can go heliskiing, touring etc.
[edit] Primary Insurance, administer an SCGB policy that's underwriten by Whitehorse Ireland Ltd. who also underwrite a number of other Ins. Cos inc. Atlasdirect . . . I'll be communicating with the underwriters on Mon to see if the same cover is available through another source . . . should we consider a Snowhead's Policy??? and what's involved in that . . . I assume someone here's in the 'trade'. [/edit]
I find the idea that the SCGB is preventing me from doing business with Acumus Insurance Solutions Limited unless I pay what is in effect an additional premium to the club . . . offensive and more an incentive to take Primary insurance to task than to join the club. And presumably the SCGB gets a significant commission, at least in line with industry standards.
I wonder if there’s any congruence in the directorships of either company?
It also has to be asked, where does all the money go? The club has a large income from its members, It’s been franchising its name widely and is retailing significant properties. It should be making good profits from its commercial enterprises . . . so why are the membership fees still relatively high. They should have fallen as other income streams grew. If they’re not making profits from commerce, then there are some serious questions that need answering to the members by the management and Board.
Last edited by Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do. on Sun 17-04-05 13:59; edited 2 times in total
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I'm in favour of leaving SCGB to do want they want and we can continue to do what we want here. Discussions about SCGB here don't resemble the reasonable and informative discussions found elsewhere on snowHeads.
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| Masque wrote: |
| .... As you’re aware I’m looking for a year round ski insurance and ostensibly the SCGB’s ‘Executive Annual’ could be worth a look (anyone with a policy doc I could read?)...... |
Er, yup. Not quite sure if it woud meet your requirements, though, Masque. It is an annual multi trip policy, and the maximum cover is for 31 days in any trip. If you are still interseted, PM me, and I'll see if I can help.
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| Ian Hopkinson wrote: |
| I'm in favour of leaving SCGB to do want they want and we can continue to do what we want here. Discussions about SCGB here don't resemble the reasonable and informative discussions found elsewhere on snowHeads. |
There's a slight 'edge' sometimes, but I've thought that, all things considered, members have have refrained from too confrontational an approach in recent times. IMHO there's been worse in other snowHeads forums.
Whether it remains a valid or valuable topic of discussion is another matter, but then a large percentage of matters discussed on SH barely fall into either category! 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Nick Zotov, damm, I didn't read the **. In which case I can get better prices with the same underwriter (with identical or better cover) from at least two other Ins.Co. That does go to demonstrate the commercial aspect of the club.
I'll stick with the BMC.
Ian Hopkinson, Regrettably, decisions made by the club and its stated practice of speaking for all of us and marketing its brand, does affect us . . . some more so than others, members and non-members alike. The more the club does this, then the more right and responsible it is for us to observe and comment. It is also regrettable that lately, nearly everything it’s done has generated at the very least division and at the worst outright loathing.
There are obviously some who feel that the club can do no wrong and others that think it can do no right. But there are a whole bunch of us in the middle that turn with the wind and at this moment the wind’s coming from a cold dark place. It’s down to the club itself to change that, but don’t expect us not to complain about it.
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Masque, I think the BMC policy looks very good, too. I'll be looking at it carefully at renewal time.
Based on what I said to David Goldsmith above, I see no evidence the club has a stated practice of skiing for all skiers, these days. It has no mandate to; I'm surprised it felt is should as recently as 1995.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Nick, let's assume (which we must assume) that the Ski Club's Council in 1995 defined its stated mission and objectives. I would argue that this was a correct mission.
If our club isn't interested in all British skiers why does it recruit at the Daily Mail Ski Show - not a hunting ground of the ruling classes, in my experience.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Nick Zotov, DG's quote was public stated policy of the club until about 6 months ago when they revamped the website . . . and will someone tell them that blue text on blue ground is just plain poor design (I thought I was going blind).
I'm curious for their reasoning behind the change.
As Snowheads grows, marketing, image and message are all issues that will need to be addressed especcially as the cost of administering it rise.
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deleted
deleted
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Hmm, I had posted something one up from the bottom of last page, and it has disappeared...probably because it was boring and reasonable... But its a free world. Those who don't want to be in the skiclub (and I can certainly understand why they wouldn't - even without the school playground flavour of the insults in the relevant thread on their forum) don't have to be. Not sure that SnowHeads provides a valid alternative. I see that 10 or so of the people who have contributed to this thread make up about 25% of the total posts to the forum... Not a great start to a campaign of market domination... and I am not sure that the personal nature of some of this thread helps
In the meantime I am going to report the skiclub thread to their moderator, and hope whoever/whateverdeleted my post from this thread friday pm will let me know what happened.
Nikolai - hope to meet you on the snow again sometime
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You know it makes sense.
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Think it was in this thread that there was a post - what appeared to be an entirely inoffensive one from Tim Brown - yesterday. It too is no longer there.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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John Rivett, PG, a post that I made disappeared as well. I think that this has happened before, as moderators we never quite got to the bottom of it. Rest assured that it has not been deleted as a form of moderation, perhaps a gremlin in the system?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Masque, OK. I didn't see it - but then I bookmark the forum rather than the home page (as I do for snowheads). I don't see it in the Memorandum of Association. I agree with it not being on the club site, now.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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John Rivett, I've PMed you concerning this. It may be that the post referred to is the one split to the new thread on Ski Club missions etc to maintain the relevance of this thread to its title. It was my omission that this action was not notified to you and I apologise for this.
PG, the Tim Brown post may have been deleted by its author, as it was responded to by yours truly but had already vanished by that time.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Sun 17-04-05 17:31; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Nick, a key reason why I believe in this 'broad church' approach to the club is to protect its independence. I'm thinking primarily in relation to its publishing activities, which require high membership revenues to maintain independence from advertiser influence and control of editorial. But it actually affects all aspects of the club's independence and strength.
High membership = maximum independent revenue from subscriptions = maximum influence = a club improving skiing for its members and skiers generally. No?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I wonder if a ski resort is more likely to act if the SCGB says "We're concerned about X" than a tour operator were to do the same...
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David Goldsmith, when I think about this, I can produce only a rambling reply. But here goes.
Firstly, and to follow on fromIan Hopkinson's query, An operator like Thomson/Crystal must have an awful lot of clout with a resort, by virtue of the numbers of punters delivered. OTOH, the club does have an effective publicity machine, and would have to be respected if it became concerned about something vital - like very bad safety, perhaps. But the club can only function if it can attract/retain members. Therfore subscriptions must be kept at a reasonable level. Efficiency alone will not achieve this, so commercial revenue is also needed. Commercial activity compromises full idependence of action. Pragmatic decsions are made which achieve a balance between independence and commercial discretiion, probably. On the whole, the sysem works, and I understand membership is growing. So better efficiencies and more optioions should be available. But I wonder if the club will loose its soul as it grows bigger. Despite some snowheads having misgivings, I don't think it has, yet.
As in much of life, there are no easy answers I can discern.
I have no fixed ideas on your question. I can only ponder it.
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Of course another problem can occur if the club is the one to complain, which is that the resort can decide it does not wish the club to have a rep in the resort, I suspect that there is a constant jugling of phrases during the winter when the club is doing a rep resort report, especially when the resort is possibly suffering from low amounts of snow, the club must give a fair report to its members but at the same time not offend its hosts ...... difficult when a resort is not really skiable due to poor conditions say.
Further to this, don't forget that the clubs resort reps are voulenteers doing the job in order to be able to get more skiing in, as such all they can really do is voice any concerns they have to head office in London or act as a private individual and voice those concerns to the local tourist office, but if they do the latter there is no certainty that the local tourist office will not react against the ski club, really a very difficult situation 
Tour ops probably have more clout as they can turn arround (though they rarely do) and say fix this problem or we won't send any more guests, so a resort has to listen to them
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Mon 18-04-05 10:32; edited 1 time in total
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I guess that the ideal is to have the same reps in the same resort year on year, building a good working relationship with the locals, and earning respect for their opinions.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Elizabeth B, yes and it can work, but often it depends on the reps, I've seen reps working really well with tourist offices but I've also seen other reps just using them as a convenient place to get photocopying or faxing done, so much depends on the rep themselves
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Bit boring for the reps though if they never get to go anywhere else 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Intrestingly the vitriolic thread that followed Nicks posting to the Ski Club website has apparently just vanished .... I guess enough people protested 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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D G Orf, I think you'll find an email from the club has been sent to you.
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- and Laura got back from Skiing to deal with it.
I think that she has also e-mailed participants, or at least complainants.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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Well I'm pleased to hear that thread has been deleted - and I think that by not responding D G Orf, although it's so tempting to do, you rose above the childishness of the name-calling that did not merit a response.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think that part of the problem over there is that people don't respond often enough to those two, although I think that people should be very careful what they write.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Kramer, if you're posting over there - well said! Although I'm not entering the 'debate', you're spot on.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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And if it's not you - whoops!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| I think that part of the problem over there is that people don't respond often enough to those two, although I think that people should be very careful what they write. |
Intriguing
Who are those two ? Ronnie and Reggie ?
Do they send the boys around to fill in people who speak out ?
I thought Snowheads were made of sterner stuff !
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Latchigo, if you want to find out, then I guess that you'll have to stump up for membership. 
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Latchigo, it's just a couple of reps giving as good as they get from what little I've seen. Having had a look through the archive there, I can find nothing to match masque's gobshitery over here!
I'd enter the debate over there myself, but i wouldn't want anyone to burst into tears because of anything I typed.
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| Kramer wrote: |
| Latchigo, if you want to find out, then I guess that you'll have to stump up for membership. |
I am a member already !
I have'nt crossed the twins yet though.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Latchigo, the threads with recent contentious comment have been deleted by the Club moderator.
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Tim , bit ‘bound-up’ this morning? You might want to revise your dosage. Sorry old boy but tears are the last thing anyone breaks into when you post. 
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FAQ
to be fair I'm as guilty as anyone else of escalating that little conflict, last night I found myself typing a very vindictive reply to one of Gerry's posts 
in the end I decided not to post it as I felt it would have escalated things even further but it was very close 
