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BASI 1 : Should I just do it?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I've been toying with the idea of doing something more with my skiing, but I'm not sure what else I can do.

Would I gain anything from doing a BASI 1, other than a qualification and the ability to teach on dry and indoor slopes?

I see there's a 5 day course at Hemel in April....
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
feef, if you are looking mainly at developing personal skiing the L1 is a good option, but maybe think about doing in the mountains rather than indoors? You will have the opportunity to be pushed further than you can be indoors, and I think it provides a stronger foundation for going forward with instructor exams if that's of any interest.

Other options might be some of the more specialised coaching weeks offered by the likes of Snoworks, etc.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
The only reason I'm looking at doing it indoors is that I have my mountain trips already planned this season, I'm just back from Tignes for 2 weeks, and in March I'm in Cham with a guide for some off-piste, so there's not much room for a BASI course as well.
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feef, the L1 will give you a lot to think about and will expose any weaknesses in your core technique. Well worth doing for that alone, and if you have already committed your ski trips for this season doing it indoors will allow you to make the most of your ski time.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
rob@rar, That's pretty much the answer I was hoping for, thanks Smile
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feef I did mine last October indoors, it certainly improved my skiing. Having just failed my L2 I wish I had done my L1 in the mountains as I suspect it would have identifed a weakness which I could have fixed prior to the L2.

However for the money I don't think you can get a better weeks training indoors, it will certainly challenge you and help remove any bad habits, posture etc

Good luck with it!

Thread here I wrote after mine:

http://snowheads.com/ski-forum/viewtopic.php?t=80968

regards,

Greg
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
feef, I did my level 1 indoors and enjoyed it and passed, having moved onto my level 2 I found that I had a weekness in my carving which was never really covered in my level 1 as the slope usually has loads of park stuff set up.

In my debrief I was told to get lessons on carving which of course I ignored until I went on my level 2 and then had to work like hell to get to the required level, my advice would be do your level 1 indoors if it fits your needs but you would get so much more from doing in a mountain environment or at least I would have Smile

kitenski, please you got back ok

When you get your debrief back probalbly next week give me a shout and I'll either compare what mine said or I'll send you a copy if it helps
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
kitenski,
What did you fail on if you don't mind sharing?
What kind of standard is a level 2? Is there any video available of a level 2 skier?
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Huckacliff duckabranch, if you go onto youtube, BASI have a series of video's showing the level that would be expected and states what the assessment criteria is at each level.

http://www.youtube.com/user/OfficialBASI

just pick the area you wish to look at
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kitenski, Sorry to hear that you didn't make it. Sad

I thought you'd had on mountain training before you went for your L2?
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Curtains, I've seen the videos.. my own ability isn't the question, as I'm easily well beyond level 1, it's more about the usefulness and validity of the qualification that I'm wondering about.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
I was under the impession that I was about this level but skiied like a numpty today fell over and hurt my shoulder....take the exams if you want to.... be it for work or vanity it's your money...
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Spyderman, long time bad habits/lack of skill from being over 40 and never been taught to carve, if I'm honest with myself. I wish I'd had some mountain training and identified it earlier as I reckon it could have been sorted prior to the course.....

Huckacliff duckabranch, failed on not being able to carve two clean lines down a blue run. full report in the next two days or so.....

This is me, you can see I drift in the turn, not locking onto an edge. Sounds so simple to fix, but it wasn't (for me anyhow)!!


http://youtube.com/v/hxl3rayeoHk


Last edited by So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much on Sun 16-12-12 17:08; edited 1 time in total
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
kitenski, I would fail you too... not saying I could do a lot better but just doesn't look right ...
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
II, out if interest, what doesn't look right to you? I know why I failed and am fine with their decision.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
kitenski wrote:
II, out if interest, what doesn't look right to you? I know why I failed and am fine with their decision.


In my very limited experience.. I'd say you're not setting the edge on the outside ski early enough. It's skidding before it's even on the fall line, and from then you're fighting to get it back
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
kitenski, not enough angulation an weight transferred to the outside ski, you're using you're inside ski to support your weight, if you we're to take the inside leg away I'd bet you'd fall inside,
inside knee not pointing in the direction of the turn all due to the above,
That's my untrained eye on it,
What did the examiner say?
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Huckacliff duckabranch, feef, yeh that's along the right lines, there is a little skiddy rotation at the start of the turn, then not getting enough edge angle/weight not over outside ski.

sounds so simple Sad
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kitenski, what Huckacliff duckabranch said... press as hard as you can on the outside ski and just go for it... I can do this but other areas of my skiing are sadly lacking...
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Not dogging Anyone who uses fridges but they ain't the place to practice stuff like that,
takes an age to get to the top, Everyone is in your way, by time you've got the feeling of what you're doing you're back at the bottom waiting again,
When you next out on snow Kitenski? Gutted for you because a couple of days hard work on snow, you'd have it nailed.
What's the cost of the level 2 week?
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Huckacliff duckabranch, yeh there's no way I can/could have sorted that in a fridge. I could do the carving fine on one leg doing javelin turns Wink

L2 costs, I hate to think!! Course itself was £550 I think, then add in accom, transfer, flights, food, the odd shandy.......

the good news is I have something to work on to improve my skiing!

I'm out in Jan to San Cassiano, some nice cruising blues to hopefully sort it!!

II, just standing on the outside ski won't fix it to L2 standard, I need to then get more edge angle to affect the turn radius, as well as a cleaner transition..
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Was just wondering when the requirement to carve cleanly changed, I know a few older in years level 2s who could kick my ass over most of the mountain with other aspects of skiing but definitely don't carve cleanly?

kitenski, Probably similar I guess, pretty much because of many years of skiing straight skis and never really been able to properly make the transition.

I learnt to ski late in life and on carving skis so learning to carve was just a progression of parallel skiing, but I have seen how hard it can be for them to make the transition, I have also seen that it is very possible to do and also seen at least one of these level 2s make the change through social race training sessions without thinking.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
gatecrasher,

L1 one definition (which I passed) is:

Cleanly carve of the last 2/3rds of turns on a green or easy blue piste without
traverse.
Understand how to achieve effective posture and balance

L2 is

Perform cleanly carved turns on a blue piste.
Show a variety of turn radii.
Use effective posture and balance.

L3 is

Perform cleanly carved (unless the task is otherwise) turns on a red piste.
Influence the radius of the arc whilst still carving.
Use effective posture and balance
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kitenski, good of you to put that video up and invite criticism. Hope it goes better for you second time around.
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Ray Zorro, thanks. I'm not sure if I will take the resit, I've already taken enough time away from the family and my 'day' job to do the L2......
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kitenski, Like I said I'm about the same as you this is what I do in my head do that drill... It may not work for you...
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
kitenski, Huckacliff duckabranch, I learnt the sensation of carving in a fridge - by starting with a traverse then gradually increasing the arc of the turn (always making sure to stop an check my tracks after each traverse/turn to make sure I was leaving two defined tracks). Only video demonstration I have seen of this is on the warren smith dvds. I think that it would be on #1 in the series.

If it is quiet and not too cut up then fridges are a perfect environment to learn to carve. Just be patient and you will get it.


Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Sun 16-12-12 19:35; edited 1 time in total
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
kitenski wrote:
just standing on the outside ski won't fix it to L2 standard, I need to then get more edge angle to affect the turn radius, as well as a cleaner transition..

Standing on what is going to be the outside ski is one way of fixing everything else.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
II, just standing on the outside ski won't fix it to L2 standard, I need to then get more edge angle to affect the turn radius, as well as a cleaner transition..[/quote]

That's what I thought when I read that, it's a catch 22 though, you won't get any more edge angle unless you get more angulation, you can't angulate any more because the inside leg is acting as a stabiliser,
Did you get a full debrief and drill to work on from the examiner?
You'll nail it no doubt about it, you now know what to work on
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
kitenski wrote:
Course itself was £550 I think.

Pass or fail that is still amazing value for instruction with a BASI Level 4 instructor.

Quote:
the good news is I have something to work on to improve my skiing!


Very Happy


Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Sun 16-12-12 17:53; edited 1 time in total
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Huckacliff duckabranch, I get a written debrief. you don't get told how to fix it, I had to run two lessons on improving carving, so self help Wink

The trainer did suggest some drills, javelin turns seemed to work well for me, and I can practice those almost anywhere......
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Elston, indeed, I *think* BASI trainers have to do more once they achieve L4 to become a trainer.... but I'm guessing at that!!
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
White pass turns as well, helps release the outside ski to becoming the new inside ski,
Works for me getting me
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Huckacliff duckabranch, got a link to white pass turns or can you explain???

going to be a drill tastic weekend in Jan Smile
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
I'm not good at the interweb and links, but I'll give it a go

http://youtube.com/v/M9l7f-_a8Bw
Practicing this drill helps stops the cause of certain A framing(ie using the inside leg to support weight) and keeps you on the correct edge of the inside ski
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kitenski, I was taught the feeling of carving on the lower 3rd of a dry slope, through simple "pedalling", ok it won't teach you the whole deal but...it does really help to reduce the chance of failure, practicing on a long slope just by it's nature can lead to failure from the very first turn, the subconscious is saying... "turn the skis" because I might build up too much speed! The minute you turn the skis to initiate the turn you've failed.

On a really short section of slope there is no "subconscious" fear of building speed so much better chance to use pressure to initiate the turn rather than a subconscious slowing rotary movement.

I know a lot of people aren't keen on dryslopes but they are actually great for giving feedback, you don't need tracks for reference, you can hear when the skis have stopped skidding, everything goes pretty quiet once the skis lock in.

I had no plan to learn it, my coach did, but I was just following instructions.

We did..

One straight run on the bottom third of the slope
A few runs starting "straight down falline" with just lightly "pressing only" "no rotation" on one ski...and see what happened!?
The first run of pressing probably resulted in 2 mat widths change in direction from falline start point.
Next run more pressure no rotation on the ski= about 3 mats change from start position. Lots more runs like this building the confidence "not to turn the skis"
Next run, same pressure as last runs but now with a conscious reduction of pressure on opposite ski= about 90 degree change in direction from original falline starting position. Shocked

Then... from falline position..

A run of pressure one ski release pressure other ski until one mat width was crossed then transfer pressure/release of skis to change direction, after a few more runs doing this...increasing pressure and release and increasing rate of change I suddenly got my first lightbulb for a "carving feel".

I found it very important to start from a "straight down the falline" position, it's a far easier starting point from which to apply pressure without encouraging rotary movements.

Pedant edit! rolling eyes


Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Sun 16-12-12 20:19; edited 1 time in total
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gatecrasher, I prefer dry slope to indoor, longer, less crowded and cheaper,
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Huckacliff duckabranch, I guess there's no reason it can't be done the same way on a snow slope, but because they are faster there will be a point near the bottom where you will have to turn the skis to stop. As you know a lot of dry slopes you can do a straight schuss from a little way up and come to rest without turning the skis, so I think helps.
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gatecrasher, yes I catch your drift, more of a confidence builder and less to worry about other than the feeling of edging,
it's a beautiful feeling carving either on bristles or snow,
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Quote:

just standing on the outside ski won't fix it to L2 standard

I'd agree with that. I can ski quite well on one ski (changing legs just before transition so changing edges on the one ski) and can also ski an easyish blue run completely on my left leg (not so good on the right....) but that ain't necessarily carving. I can't carve nice parallel lines even down a really easy run - always skiddy/smeary bits.
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