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since when did a sofa bed become ok for holiday accomidation

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
so been looking recently for a cheap ski deal and for the first time ive been looking at france

but since when was it ok to go on holiday and stay on a sofa bed???

yeah if i was staying with a friend and just crashing on his sofa bed for free then fine but come on!! people are paying good money for a holiday in the mountains and they are being made to sleep on a sofa bed its crap!!

anyway no real point just moaning as i cant find decent digs at a decent price haha
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
enduroaid, fairly standard for self-catering apartments. You may even find them in family-sized hotel rooms too. Not just restricted to the wintersports holiday market either. Some people think a holiday sleeping on the ground in a tent is perfectly acceptable. You decide what sort of holiday you want and you pay the appropriate price.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Since always? Market forces, demand and supply and all that.
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Since pokey French appartments met British TO cunning to create value packed ski in/out accomodation.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
French Ski apartment for rent, sleeps 6 (as long as your one of the cast of Time Bandits) otherwise just sleeps 2
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since people wanted "cheap ski deals". It's got nothing to do with British TOs in particular - they didn't create the accommodation. French skiing families (generally less well off than British ones) are looking for the cheapest possible holiday and that means space doubling up as living and sleeping space. That's also why they overwhelmingly self cater (and that doesn't mean going out to a different restaurant every night wink ) and somehow cope with wearing 20 year hold hand-me-down one piece ski suits!

But it's not compulsory to sleep on a sofa bed, old chap. Stop being such a cheapskate and pay the going rate for a proper bed. With French ski apartments, you get what you pay for and the market is wide open. There is an overwhelming choice of accommodation, of all types and standards, throughout the Alps. Many people have terrific, cheap, holidays in hostels.

I don't much like sofa beds because although they're often quite comfortable as beds, they take up an awful lot of space and are not always good sofas. In our apartment we generally only use the bedrooms but when families borrow it, or we have extra people, they sleep on inflatable camping mattresses.

And are extremely grateful. wink
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 Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
enduroaid, and another thing - I'd strongly advise you never to charter a yacht, unless you can afford a really big one and only use half the berths. Laughing A 32 foot yacht with 6 people sleeping makes a French holiday apartment look positively cavernous.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Where abouts are you looking and how many are you? We rented a lovely three bed in Le Grand Bornands for a very reasoanble price via Owners Direct. They have quite a number of apartments in lots of different resorts and I have noticed several snowheads also rent out through them.
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pam w, yacht =caravanning on water!
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kat.ryb, absolutely not. Caravans have standing headroom throughout and a kitchen which stays still. A yacht is about sailing; you just get through the nights. For many people, a ski holiday is about skiing and they are not inclined to grumble about making up and clearing away a sofa bed if it means they can afford to take the kids. Or share the cost with a load of mates.

NickyJ, you're right - there are loads of very nice apartments to rent. People just want a £249 deal including flights and transfers - and/or want a tour operator to do all the work for them, without their actually having to pay for it.
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If you pay peanuts, expect to get monkeys
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
enduroaid, i have a sofabed in my apartment but i don't sell it as such. i have 2 pull down beds and a separare bunk room and its been almost sold out this season. i sell as 4 maximum and i would hate 6 people squeezing into the 50 sq mtr space with only one bathroom. i think its a lot of faff moving furniture to put a sofabed down and makes bedtime a bit of a chore. that said i have seen many super apartments in great locations with sofa beds and that suits plenty of people
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
I always leave the sofabeds out and made up and then treat the apartment like an en suite hotel room and eat out. The kitchens are usually pretty poor as well, often being just two rings (and sometimes a microwave oven). If you are really going to self cater than get a proper apartment.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
We used to rent a two bedroom P&V appartment in Flaine for our family of four when the kids were younger .
Officially it was an apartment for 8....there were two "sofas" in the small living room with trundle pull outs.
Four people were supposed to sleep in there, with the beds out there was not even an inch of floor space left.

We did that for about four years and every time the P&V booking lady would sound amazed that there were only four of us,,,,why not get a studio she would ask....because I want to be on holiday, not in prison!

Only in France
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
only 2 of us and not looking at any one resort in particular, this is the first time we have really looked at france and its only as we are looking to go later in the season

was just amazed that people pay the kind of money they are asking to sleep on a sofa bed which lets face it is not going to be very comfortable

its seems that you have to look at an apartment for 4-8 before they even consider having a proper bed
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
The sofa bed in the place we stayed in Val Thorens was more comfortable than the proper beds... (which weren't uncomfortable)
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I have used owners direct and peak retreats both of which offer good prices, last year with peak retreats 2 proper bedrooms in morillon 1100 1 double, 1 with 4 large bunks (cost was £500) and this year rented via owners direct 1 bedroom in arc2000 for £400 - accom only but seemed cheap to me.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I have a one bedroom apartment. The bedroom has a proper bed, and there is a sofa bed in the lounge. We slept on it for two weeks without any problem when we took my parents there for a summer holiday in July. It suits small familes and couples best. Proper oven, hob and dishwasher.
enduroaid, of course you will get a proper bed if you book a one bedroom apartment. You must be looking at studios.
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If you use something like owners direct you can choose the apartment you like rather than get stuck with a typical French TO booked one.

Our apartment is kitted out for us. It doesn't have a sofa bed but has a double bed and two bunks. We only really allow 2 - 4 when renting it out through owners direct. It also has flat screen TV, DVD etc and other things that make a holiday nice. But we wouldn't go near allowing a TO to rent it out.

If we wanted to rent out via a TO we wouldn't have renovated it, just given it over as a typical French apartment. As others say you pay your money you make your choice.
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enduroaid, Please could you correct your typo in the heading it's hurting my eyes.....

Accommodation


Thank you Very Happy
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queen bodecia wrote:
Some people think a holiday sleeping on the ground in a tent is perfectly acceptable. You decide what sort of holiday you want and you pay the appropriate price.


+1 Smile
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I guess you get what you pay for - we usually go for cheap and cheerful apartments in France and are quite happy with the sofabeds. I find that after a long day skiing, I could sleep anywhere - I've NEVER had a bad nights sleep after a day skiing wink
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
steven0123 wrote:
queen bodecia wrote:
Some people think a holiday sleeping on the ground in a tent is perfectly acceptable. You decide what sort of holiday you want and you pay the appropriate price.


+1 Smile
I partly agree with that statement. The problem is that it can be incredibly difficult and time-consuming to trawl through listings lokking for acommodation that I regard as genuinely large enough for a family holiday. And if the accommodation is booked through a tour operator, working out the true holiday price including underoccupancy supplements adjusted for child-specific pricing requires the mathematical skills of an actuary. I sometimes wonder if the people trying to sell holidays and acommodation (the agents, that is, rather than the owners) have any idea how difficult it can be to use their web sites. How hard would it be to allow searches to include the questions, 'Are you willing to use a sofa-bed or sleep in the hallway' and 'What is the minumum size in sq m?'
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Rented a very small studio direct from the owner last week, its only 18m2 and has a sofa bed and bunks, just 2 of us and left the sofa bed up all week, it was fine, really comfy. Could not really imagine 4 in the studio however it would be very very friendly. But for 2 its fine. Its quiet, clean and ok and cheap for 1/2 term, £350. Basic rule with a french place is don't fill it to max occupancy.
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Quote:

people pay the kind of money they are asking

which is what? Out of peak season, 2 bedroom apartments (ie 4 beds in proper beds and 2 extras on a sofa bed if you want) are typically about £400 in our area. Kitchens with 4 rings, full size oven.

How much cheaper can you reasonably expect to rent?

If you are looking at Tour Operators then yes, it is a right pain working out the under-occupancy charge. If you want nice apartments, much better to look at Peak Retreats or Erna Low (if you want to use a British operator) or google for the enormous numbers of privately let apartments, which tend to be cheaper.

Or ask on snowheads for advice and suggestions.

But please, don't just moan and complain.....

The holiday accommodation business is extremely competitive and, with the internet, it's never been easier to shop around.
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Jonny Jones wrote:
steven0123 wrote:
queen bodecia wrote:
Some people think a holiday sleeping on the ground in a tent is perfectly acceptable. You decide what sort of holiday you want and you pay the appropriate price.


+1 Smile
I partly agree with that statement. The problem is that it can be incredibly difficult and time-consuming to trawl through listings lokking for acommodation that I regard as genuinely large enough for a family holiday. And if the accommodation is booked through a tour operator, working out the true holiday price including underoccupancy supplements adjusted for child-specific pricing requires the mathematical skills of an actuary. I sometimes wonder if the people trying to sell holidays and acommodation (the agents, that is, rather than the owners) have any idea how difficult it can be to use their web sites. How hard would it be to allow searches to include the questions, 'Are you willing to use a sofa-bed or sleep in the hallway' and 'What is the minumum size in sq m?'


Alternatively you could simply pop in to a travel agents and ask them to do the hard work for you?
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Quote:

you could simply pop in to a travel agents and ask them to do the hard work for you?

and if you ring the TOs, they can help too.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Agree with Pam. When we were booking our holiday with Esprit I had been trawling through there online brochure to work out which suites met my fussy requirements of a room each for us and the girls (that would take a cot in one) and that had a bath without paying the earth. I phoned up but the one that I found was already booked for that week. They then offered me two interconnecting rooms for less than I had been expecting to pay in there courchevel accmodation (hadn't been in the paper brochure which I was starting my search from) met our requirements beautifully.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Slept on sofabed many times as young kid, teen and young adult. My parents are very working class. We simply cannot afford a big posh luxury chalet everyone else seems to think is the norm and can afford easily. This is reality for us, reality of what we can afford, sofabeds can be very comfy and I've yet to have one actually impact on my holiday. After all I don't give up all my money to go out to the Alps and lounge around going 'ooo this is rather nice' I go out to SKI!!! Not into the whole rich man's wining and dining ski holiday - I just need a place to crash after a day on the slopes and if a convertible bed or 'clic-clac' as they are known in French gives me that place to crash I am quite happy! It's all about the sliding for me - simples.
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
crazy_skier_jules, + 1 - we had a lovely holiday in Cham in a studio with two clic-clacs - and cooked a meal there each night!
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
enduroaid, always been the same in self-catered places. "Villa sleeps 8". That'll be three pokey little bedrooms and a living room with a pull-out that was your sofa. Probably next to the "kitchen", or what passes for a kitchen. Evil or Very Mad
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crazy_skier_jules when we took our kids skiing, they had sofabeds or bunks in the hall. No way we could have afforded it otherwise.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Hells Bells, it's perfect for kids and bearable for adults who just want to ski and crash.
I'm 21, supposedly I'm supposed to be partying hard every night after skiing... I just crash out and snooze a lot! Feel old :/
either way a sofabed works for that kind of lifestyle NehNeh
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crazy_skier_jules, 21? Just you wait mate until you are twice that age...... you'll be out partying hard cos it's the only chance you get all year
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And when we click in - and then ride the gondola, six man or whatever, we are all the same - that is why sport is a great leveler, unless you are a crooked Russian ogliarch who takes a heli Toofy Grin
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Do you want a comfortable sofa that converts to a bed, or do you want a sofa that converts to a comfortable bed? It is probably easier to find either of these than one that is comfortable as both a sofa and bed. I have bought this and is very comfortable to sit on, but it converts to a great bed.
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Nice 10 year thread resurrection Laughing
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
This thread has been sleeping comfortably for 10years rolling eyes
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Spam knows no time limits, apparently.
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It would be interesting to note whether posters views have remained the same over the ten years Toofy Grin
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