Just how bearable is a standard french ski apartment?

A snowHead

We have found somewhere to go, location is perfect, price is great - but the choice of apartments is basically the same whichever "residence" we choose - either studio or 1-bed of about 25m sq.

As a family of 4 (2 adults, 13 + 11yrs) the 1-bed apartments seem to have the right combination of beds - 1 double bedroom, 1 sofa with pull-out bed. Upgrading to a 6 person apartment seems to only gain us bunk beds in the hall - the living rooms are still described the same yet they are £400 a week more.

So, just how viable is it to stay for a week in one of these shoe boxes?

We tend to eat-in and watch a dvd or something at night or play board games rather than go out.

In the past we have gone out of season and been lucky with privately rented apartments which whilst not huge have had decent settees to sit on.

Husband is worried that we will not have any comfortable seats and that the entire apt is smaller than our living room, but it doesn't seem like we would get that even if we upgraded?

Thinking of taking our camping chairs!

Any advice?

A snowHead

Newer apartments seem to be larger, so maybe look for a more recent development? The apartments being built in Les Arcs, for example, all seem to be bigger than the rabbit hutches which were the norm. Personally I never booked an apartment that required sofa beds in the living room to be used - just too little space.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

If you feel strongly pay more and get a bigger appartment - lots of bigger MGM etc appartments out there or get a hotel etc.

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I wouldn't do it, but then I like my comfort. 25m 2 is quite small for a family although is doable. Unless your kids go to bed at the same time as you every night, you may want to look for an apartment with a cabine with bunk beds and either a double bedroom or double sofa bed in the sitting room. This may be a much more agreeable arrangement all round - all the kid's mess can stay in the cabine and you will still have somewhere comfortable to sit until you want to go to bed.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

skimom, we stayed in a very nice apartment in Montgenevre last March - just the two of us and it had a bedroom and supposedly would have slept two more in the living room. Everything about it was really good except for the seating! I had a foul cold and cough when we arrived so we didn't go out much in the evenings till towards the end of the week and we ended up bringing in the plastic chairs from the balcony as they were better to sit in than the sofa that was there. I think a problem with something on the small side is what to do with everyone's stuff too.

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skimom, I'm sort of with your husband on this. My view is that the maximum capacity of an apartment is determined by the number of people that can be sat down comfortably at the same time and not the number of beds. Especially so if you are going to spend a lot of time in it.

Saying that, though, lots of families quite happily co-exist in that amount of space.

One tactic might be to take the £400 you save and translate it into a memorable experience or two, which will likely make up for any accommodation inadequacies.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

I dislike having people sleeping in the sitting room. Unless they are willing to go to bed last, and get up first, it's a right pain. When we had kids (teenagers) sleeping in the living room I used to put my French café music DVD on loud, till they got their rses in gear. They detested it, so it worked well. wink

Most - not all - sofa beds are rather uncomfortable settees.

Other questions about the apartment - does it have decent cooking facilities? An oven? Dishwasher (this might sound like a luxury, but in a tiny kitchen it's a big help).

What resort are you looking at? Most will offer a very wide range of apartments, from cramped to luxurious.

I have happily spent weeks on quite small boats compared to which a 25 sq m apartment is quite roomy. But it takes a lot of organisation.

If you're driving, folding camping chairs might not be a bad idea. You can always leave them in the car if there's no room for them!

What's the difference in sq m between the 4 and 6 bed apartments? A bit of extra space is very useful. You could use the hall bunks for the kids and free up the living room - or use the bunks as a dumping ground for all the gear which won't go anywhere else.

A little, cheap, apartment makes for a cheap holiday, especially if you stay in at nights. Ski holidays are so expensive, it's one good way of making them more affordable. And at least when you put stuff on a shelf, or on the table, it'll stay there (unlike on a boat).

After all it is free

It depends on your family. We once booked a couple of late deals to Les Arcs and then later in the season to la Plagne, from memory both apartments were less than 20sqm. In Les Arcs we had a single room with 2 sofas that converted to 4 beds at night, it was very very small, and although it was smaller than our lounge at home it was still bigger than our boat that we happily spend a month on in summer.

I dont think the accomodation is that important, I go to ski, the apartment is just somewhere to sleep. However the kids are now older, so we try and get a proper 1 bed as a minimum. (The 'cabin' style rooms often have very small bunkbeds) and it does give us a bit more room to mess up and clean !

I've only just noticed that our apartment for next week has no oven.

Hence, I'm having to re-write the menu... rolling eyes

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skimom, 25m2 for a family of 4 is , IMHO, just way too small. Take the option of hall bunk beds. At least you may be able to get across the appartment without climbing across the kids!
It was a slightly different layout when we had a 6 bed 32m sq appt in Val Thorens, a small double bed room, bunk room, living area with sofa bed and a pull out bed, table and chairs. So glad we took the larger option rather than the smaller 25 m².

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We are looking at the Les Sybelles area - ideally we want ski in/out - I have a dodgy ankle which will hopefully be ok on skis (this is the first hol for 3 years due to an injury so one consideration is that I might be spending more time in the apartment than normal - usually we ski 9-4.30), anyway I don't want to be traipsing about in ski boots - especially at the end of the day if its aching - I'm rubbish at carrying skis!

We have to go half-term, so availability is tight and bargains few and far between.

We are driving so we can take camping chairs, and I am used to 'catering' on a 2 ring stove with no m/wave for up to 4 weeks at a time so not so worried about the facilities - most of the apartments we are looking at seem to have dishwashers, but no oven.

we definitely will have 1 separate room.

Back to google I reckon

You know it makes sense.

I'd much prefer to have a teeny apartment than not go skiing at all. Of course we'd all prefer a big apartment to a small one - but families who are well organised, and accustomed to holidays in less than ideal accommodation will cope if they have to. Resorts are full of people apparently having a great time in camper vans! We used to do 5 people in a pop up roof Toyota, in Scotland, usually in the rain. We survived, and even had fun! It seemed jolly luxurious compared to a tent.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

As FraserP says 25m2 would be really small for a family of 4 with kids your ages. Don't forget you'll have loads of ski gear all over the place which would make it feell very cramped. Most hotel rooms for 2 are about that size!

A snowHead

skimom, i'ld try looking for somebodies private apartment, but at half term that might be easier said than done.

A snowHead

We happily survive in our 1 bedroom apartment complete with comfortable sofa beds (we've slept on it ourselves for 2 weeks). It is 32 sq m, but we've spent holidays in the past in a 25 sq m one. Difference was I think that the bedroom and bathroom were smaller, as was the kitchen area. Living space is roughly similar I think.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Where are good places to look for private lettings?

Sure I found a website last time I booked where you could put up requests, but blowed if I can remember what it was called.

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skimom, Only you know your family well enough to decide,and that will depend on how harmonious the kids are....or not!You need to take careful note of the description,ie,is it a sofa bed(double)or two seperate singles?Is it definately a seperate bedroom....or divisable? Many of us have done this multiple times,and its less of a problem than you might think.Sure,its cramped,and it helps if you are organized...but a week is not the end of the world wink

If,as you say,its at a bargain price....take it,and use the saving on lessons,meals out etc.
To make any real gains,you would need to go 35+(and you may well still have sofa beds).Stop worrying.....you're going skiing snowHead

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

skimom, a good place to start is the resort website, which will normally have loads of links.

Also, go onto google.fr and google the resort name and "appartement location".

But practically everything nice will now be rented for half term.

If you've found an ideally located, low-cost apartment for half term, I'd go for it, rather than risk losing it; it's very late in the day.

Hope the ankle is OK. snowHead

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Skimom
The only time we have booked a 1 bed for our family of four was when we booked a luxury CGH MGM one in school hols. We did not enjoy the experience of sleeping in the sitting room. It would have been bearable if it had been a UK style double sofa bed. however it wasn't. One single bed pulled out in a drawer - my husband used this and referred to it as the coffin Skullie

I slept on the other single mattress (which was the sofa) - it was so narrow I worried I'd roll off onto the hard floor. If the set up is like this in a luxury apartment I wouldn't risk it in a more basic apartment. There is also the issue of lack of storage space in small apartments.

I also tend to avoid the apartments with alcove bunks as the floors tend to be hard tiled and would not want my children on bunks next to such a hard floor - my children are younger than yours though.

We now try and find accommodation with a double and twin bedded room minium.

In your position I'd look at some of the other Maurienne resorts or other villages in les sybelles and try and find somewhere with a 2 bed apartment.

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

I've stayed in tiny French apartments several times because they are cheap, for cooking i've found they are generally a nightmare, 2 hobs, no oven, no microwave is the standard affair. You have very little space to prepare your food and IME you can't all sit round a table at once to eat. Sleeping in the living room is also rubbish because you all have to match your going to bed and getting up times. They are great because for me they make skiing affordable and I will stay in them again but but a they probably better suited to a group in their twenties who come in, eat, go out, come in, pass out than a family who will spend time in them in the evening. You might be lucky and it might be much better than the ones i've stayed in but I definitely view them as a means to an end.

After all it is free

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skimom, I don't know if they have availability but we found Miranda on here with chalet la giettaz to be fab value. You have to drive five mins to the lift but then you are at the main lift so no messing about walking in ski boots! Great ski area, lovely chalet, breakfast delivered, wii etc jacuzzi, bar, food available. I'd only ever done ski in ski out but found it no hassle - we didn't even have a car! Village is very quiet though. People think I pimp their chalet for some gain, but I just happen to love it for it's value for money with lots of extras! If interested just google chaletbla giettaz. This year we are off to rob@rars place for a change though Smile

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skimom, since having kids (currently 4 & 6) we've stayed in apartments the same as you describe. And something similar with mates before. We've never found it a problem but obviously it depends on your expectations. I also don't know what you think is value for money. For me it's a place to eat, chill and sleep. I quite like the "cosiness" and the main action is in the day when there are no restrictions Very Happy

One thing I would say is that the vary quite a lot in quality, equipment, comfort, convenience, etc. And that is what I look at when booking.

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what is a reasonable size for a family of 4 or 5? (I'd really like some hints)

My apartment is 42m2, and that has a double bedroom and a bunked room (proper room, with full size bunks and a wardrobe), seating and dining table for 4 people, full kitchen facilities, decent size bathroom and separate loo. It's comfortable for a family of 4, and a bit cosy for 4 adults but perfectly liveable for a week or two. Most apartments that size would also have sofabed(s) in the living room and be sold as a 6-person apartment, but I preferred not to do that.

You know it makes sense.

Layne, I'd do that too, but not at the age of the op's kids? They're a bit older.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

A couple of sites that have reaped rewards for me are www.homelidays.com and www.chalet-montagne.fr

A snowHead

I enter this discussion as an apartment owner who also rents apartments in other resorts.
We own a 35m2 2 room apartment in Arc 1600. We stay in it ourselves and also rent it out via an immobilier (http://www.alpes-horizon.com/sejours/location--arc-1600.html). The immobilier describes it as a “standard apartment” and will only let it for 4 people. The bedroom has 2 bunk beds (it can only be described as a bedroom if it has a window). In a separate part of the apartment are two single beds. We do, however, have a bed/settee in the living room and a separate mattress forming a sitting area at right angles to it. We regularly have 6 or 7 people in the apartment for a week or so with no problem, but we are all good friends used to mucking in together.
So my hints for renting an apartment are:
Visit the resorts web page and visit each immobilier in turn to see what is available
Examine the details of each apartment in turn paying particular attention to its location in the resort, the floor area, the floor plan, the list of equipment and of course the photographs of the apartment.
There are lots of apartments out there take your time and choose the one that suits you.
John

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Shimmy Alcott,

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You get what you pay for, both as an apartment owner & when renting. We've got a17m2 cosy little place in Tignes & - 4 years down the line - sometimes still can't believe that we've got a home in the Alps. We love it. Yes, bigger would be nicer but having looked at loads of apartments (some bigger), ours fitted the bill nicely.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I'm obviously showing my "frenchness" here but I really don't get the the moaning about small apartments in ski resorts, or even on holiday. When renting that is, not when you own one and spend a significant amount of time there.

I don't go to these places for the accommodation. They are purely a mean to an end: skiing within a budget.

From the age of 5 till about 16, I went skiing every year with my parents in one of those "rabbit" hutches, with bunk beds in the hall/entry and one bedroom if lucky but often just a sofa bed. Decent but small kitchen usually..

I mean you get up, have breakfast, leave the flat before 9, do not come back till gone 5, often go out for a stroll or shopping after, cook/eat your meal, watch tv/read book, bed..etc...

What's the fuss about a small place. Either you're after "luxury" and pay the price, or you're spend a less, don't get many comforts but hey...you're having fun all day nonetheless...which is the point...

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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

25m2 is plenty big enough for our family of four, needs must and all that. We stayed one Christmas in a 17m2 in La Norma and it was *just* on the right side of bearable. The way we look at it is that if we're riding all day we're so knackered after we've eaten that it's pretty much time to kip. We tend to watch a film and have a glass or 2 of beer but mostly we see the room as somewhere to get our heads down. My young 'uns are 10 and 6 and sometimes fight like cat and dog. Put it this way if it was a choice between a 17m2 'apartment' and not being able to afford another week, the broom cupboard it is Wink

Oh and don't get me started on the comedy baths that are just bigger than a handbasin, my missus and kids pish themselver everytime I'm in there with my knees up by my chin. But coz we're slumming it we're getting 4 weeks this season in 3 trips so I can live with being a laughing stock

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We stayed here (4 adults) and had more than enough room.

http://www.igluski.com/courchevel-1650/residence-pierre--vacances-le-golf-1650_p27816

Help!!

Just how bearable is a standard french ski apartment?

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