 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi all,
I'll be off to Snow+Rock tonight to finally get some boots for my upcoming trip to Austria (Feb 4th).
I've been reading up a bit about flexibility etc - but wouldn't mind some advice on what I should be asking/expecting to hear and what extras I should/shouldn't buy.
Much appreciated!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Expect to try several pairs on and tell the boot fitter about how and where you ski. Make sure they are "snug" fitting rather than comfortable. Try going down a size. Make sure you get the liners heat moulded, and the shells as well.
I found the fit of my boots improved greatly after the shells were adjusted by heating.
Don't rush the fitting, allow at least 2 hours or more
As for extras, if you expect to walk in your boots, buy some snow-cat to protect the sole and give grip. They're well worth it also consider insoles if suggested.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks alot! I'm hoping the can sort me out. Last time I went in there they didn't even acknowledge me, hopefully they will this time.
Should have thought ahead and put some ski socks on I suppose...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Cat Tracks are the most unbelievably fiddly pointless waste of time ever. Don't buy them.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Instead of SnowCats, buy some Rud chains for your boots, much easier to put on than SnowCats as the rubber/plastic bits are more flexible. The SnowCats get a bit cold after being in a bag or pocket all day.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Make sure that you buy custom moulded footbeds, they will drastically transform the feel of a boot.
When you stand up straight your toes should touch the end of the boots, when you flex forward they should just move away. Do not be tempted to ask for a size up, the size you measure up as is the size you should ski.
Once you have the boots make sure you go and ski them at an indoor slope. This is the only way you will know if they are comfy, do it soon too. If you need alterations then you can happily go back to S&R and ask for them to be done. It is very hard for both parties if you go away and ski for a week and find a small problem.. You will be angry because the boots ruined your trip, the boot fitter will be angry as there is nothing they could do to anticipate this and you are shouting at them ( i know this through experience as a boot fitter).
You only really need to heat the shells of boots on the new salomon CS range, it will only really help on other boots to thermoflex them if there is a specific problem area.
Once you have the boots, do not wear them around the house. This is not what ski boots are designed for and they will not feel especially comfy.
Which S&R are you heading to?
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Make sure you go up to sales exec and tell them, "I'd like some help as I'm here to buy some boots today" This will get their attention. In a bigger store they should be boot specialists, if its a smaller one make sure u get the boot guy/gal. Don't be too Brand loyal or colour fussy, they are all good by snow and rock. Depending on your foot shape there will be some makes that are better suited for u.
Liners and shells molded totally agree with Scottish Scrutineer, makes such a difference. You want these for 5-10 years if you're only doing 1-2 weeks a year, so make sure they are snug coz they'll get loser over the years.
Grips are good, but after your boots aren't the newest bit of your kit you may not bother with faffing too much.........
Best investment- boot drier, if you ski hard. Nothing better than dry warm boots and stops them smelling!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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expect to feel the end of the boots pushing against your toes a little. i bought 2 pairs of boots early in my skiing days where they were too big and the lack of control you get from too big a boot is terrifying!
the shop should remove the inner liner and you should put your feet in the boot without the liner and there should be about a finger between heel and shell.
don't choose a boot cos you like the name, some manufacturers cater for narrow feet, some for wide etc so you should choose whatever size fits your foot whether its nordica/salomon/atomic etc. hopefully snow and rock will have a good range for different shaped feet.
thin socks rather than thick socks for ski boots...
i don't know about heated inners as the liners should mould over time to your foot so as long as you wear the boot around the house a few times before skiing they will mould.
flex depends on the type of skiing you want to do. 120 is really quite stiff so i think 80-100 is pretty normal. others may know better.
get insoles either fully custom moulded to your feet or a cheaper alternative is superfeet i think that may be around 30 quid. insoles make a big difference!
also i don't understand why ski shops dont have a pair of bindings set up on a 30 degree angle where you can clip in and feel the flex of a boot with the heel clamped down and the boot at an angle. it would make a difference to feel a ski boot in an actual skiing stance.
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As everyone says - pay the extra for the custom insoles. You won't have to ask for them - it's actually difficult to get out without them! But that's OK because they really do make a huge difference.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Honestly dont worry about having the shells heated, unless there is a pressure point somewhere around the foot then the shell will just heat and cool to exactly the same shape. If there is a pressure point your boot fitter may decide to heat the shell and place padding on the area where the pressure is, once the boot is on and cooling it will stretch the boot. I have seen grown men almost in tears from doing this...
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Make sure they do a shell check with your foot in the boot without the liner.
| Quote: |
Shell sizing
Before even trying on boots to see how they feel, you need to check that the shell is the proper size. As you break boots in, the foam liner will pack down, so it is important to get a snug fit. Many expert skiers and racers will get boots that cramp their toes when first tried on. Most recreational skiers don't need that level of performance. A simple guide to shell fit is to remove the liner boot and insert your foot, with sock on, and slide it forward until the toes are lightly brushing against the shell. You should be able to measure between half an inch and three quarters of an inch between your heel and the back of the shell. |
http://www.ehow.com/about_6670455_ski-boot-sizing-guide.html
http://www.ellis-brigham.com/ski-boots.htm
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cheers for all your help. I'll be going to snow and rock in Brum - unless other places are known to be good. And I'll probably get a session in at the snowdome to give them a go!
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You know it makes sense.
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I have only ever bought two pairs of boots. One I bought in a small specialist retailer, and another in a large mountain climbing and ski retailer.
I had all sorts of problems with the fit in the first pair, having the plastic boot heat stretched after my first week in them. I think the problem was more related to my tightening the straps too tight, and having fat feet. I tried adding footbeds afterwards, but they made the fit worse.
The second pair I had custom moulded to my feet. I had no problems with the fit, and have not been back to the shop for any adjustments. Still wearing this pair (7 years plus)! The first pair lasted 10 years before they were stolen!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Re the heating of shells (Specifically Salomon), I had mine heat moulded, at High St Ken S&R by the rather excellent team there (*Waves at Neil and says, "Yer mum!"*), and they couldn't be comfier. I've got big calf muscles (from mucking about on big bouncy mountain bikes when there's no snow on the mountain) and I felt much more comfortable in the boot after the heat moulding process than before. Just seemed to fit better, IMHO. So, if you're buying something from that range, I think it's worth the time/effort/embarrassment of standing in a bucket of cold water on the shop floor while the boots cool around you.
Custom footbeds are also a must have.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Carlos the Slackal wrote: |
| Custom footbeds are also a must have. |
Really? We went together to 47 Degrees in Fulham for boots. G/f was sold £90 ortho footbeds, I wasn't sold any at all, just the ones that came with the boot.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Don't judge a boot's fit immediately you try it on unless it really is way too small, wide or narrow.
Try a pair on and give them 5-10 minutes. In this time the liner will heat up a bit, soften slightly and mould to your foot. Take one boot off and put one boot on from the next pair you're comparing - so that you have one of each on. And so on - keeping the best fit on as you go. Make sure you give the boots time to warm up each time otherwise you won't be comparing like with like.
When you're doing up clips then you want to do them up so that the clip just offers resistance when closed. It should go down with a firm snap and you shouldn't have to force it. If you have to use anything other than the first or second groove on the clips above your toes / arch then the boots are too big (it could be vertical volume, rather than width). Ditto for the leg clips, but these clips can often be re-positioned.
If you're trying on lots of boots then give your feet a break every now and again.
When you think you've found your pair then take you feet out of the boots and give them a 5-10 minute break. Take your socks off and look at your feet. Put the boots on. Leave them for 10 minutes. Take the boots and socks off and look at your feet again. Any pressure points will leave red marks on your feet.
Next, make sure that you can flex the boots so that your knee is above your toes. If you can't flex them in the shop when they're warm then you don't have a hope on the slope.
If the boot feels comfortable straight off the bat then it's too big.
You're looking for a fit that's like a firm handshake. The firmer end of firm, but not crushing. Anything less will pad out and become too loose.
If in doubt then walk away and come back another day.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Disaster wrote: |
| cheers for all your help. I'll be going to snow and rock in Brum - unless other places are known to be good. And I'll probably get a session in at the snowdome to give them a go! |
If you are in the west midlands forget Snow and Rock, go here .....
http://www.solutions4feet.com/
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Crumbs, lots of useful info here, I'm going to print this off and take it with me so I don't forget!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
Should have thought ahead and put some ski socks on I suppose...
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they'll have plenty in the shop. make sure you choose a really thin pair.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Most of the readers of this thread wil have 'normal' feet and will not understand how difficult it is to find boots for 'abnormal' feet.
I have a very wide foot, and believe me, it is VERY difficult to find a boot that fits. I've spent many hours in boot fitting rooms over the last two decades, and I've been the victim to all sorts of wrong advice. My last boots were heat expanded four times until they were comfortable. Sometimes the boots felt fine when walking around in the shop, but after 4 days of skiing and tramping around a resort they were horrible and I was in agony.
Someone advised me to get foam filled liners, but when I looked at the [unfilled] boot liner it was obvious that it was way too narrow for my foot. Unfortunately these liners come in only one size.
The picture shows my foot and the liner. The liner is flexible but the sole is rigid, so clearly my foot is never going to fit inside that thing!
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Jellylegs, As it has been said on here many times.....
GO TO solutions4feet.com 
Colin worked wonders with my new boots and I have a pair which will last me a long time. I also have abnormal feet ( very high instep) Went to slush and rubble, boots lasted one year of pain, then went to another shop in London beginning with a p, they sold me foamed liners etc etc££££££££, boots were not too bad but still occaisionally painful. Solutions4feet are the masters imho.
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jellylegs, I had the same problems as you, for YEARS! Had I known about solutions4feet, I would have gone. However I solved the problem myself by researching boots for women with wide feet + high instep. I now have Atomic LiveFit 80s, and they are amazing. Just FYI.
As for the OP, I echo everyone else's advice, and also agree about getting custom footbeds.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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My advice is go to S&R and/or EB and try the boots on, make your decision and buy them cheaper online. With the money saved go to a proper boot fitter like Rivington Alpine and have them fitted properly. In my experience the large ski shops don't have the expertise to fit as well as a boot fitting specialist.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Markymark29 wrote: |
| My advice is go to S&R and/or EB and try the boots on, make your decision and buy them cheaper online. With the money saved go to a proper boot fitter like Rivington Alpine and have them fitted properly. In my experience the large ski shops don't have the expertise to fit as well as a boot fitting specialist. |
Ethics aside. The point of going to a fitter is to ensure you get the correct ones; not for them to make an incorrect pair fit.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Markymark29 wrote: |
| My advice is go to S&R and/or EB and try the boots on, make your decision and buy them cheaper online. With the money saved go to a proper boot fitter like Rivington Alpine and have them fitted properly. In my experience the large ski shops don't have the expertise to fit as well as a boot fitting specialist. |
Do not do this.
Go to someone like Colin at solutions4feet and get him to look at your feet and make a boot recommendation. If he does not have the right boot for you in stock he will tell you to buy the boots elsewhere and bring them back to be fitted at a later date.
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Do what my mate did. Buy a pair randomly off eBay for thirty quid and then hack at the liners with a Stanley knife and some gaffa tape until they feel ok.
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You know it makes sense.
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Yes, Colin is great and I have also been to Profeet and they were great too. But I have had problems in the past and needed help. Having said that, I know loads of people who've been very satisfied with boots bought at various S&R and Ellis Brigham branches. They are not fanatics (ie snowHeads) and prefer a little comfort even if "performance" suffers. (Most Brit skiers, myself included, wouldn't know "performance" if it bit them on the backside  .)
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I would go to a recomended fitter like rivington alpine.
It took me 3 hrs to get my boots fitted. There are non on display and non to try on. After about and hour of consultation and measuring you will presented with 2 to try and and he will find out which one is best for you. Its pointless going and trying on boots and explaining how they feel because you probably dont know what a proper boot feels like. The fitter should tell you which boots are best for you not the other way round.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| sellerselectrical wrote: |
| you probably dont know what a proper boot feels like. The fitter should tell you which boots are best for you not the other way round. |
Rubbish.
If you don't like how they feel, walk away. Regardless of what the bootfitter says.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| paulio wrote: |
| If you don't like how they feel, walk away. |
I can't tell how a boot is going to feel when I'm skiing in it until I've actually spent some time skiing in it. I could wear pair of boots in the shop for hours and I still wouldn't know if it was going to be OK when skiing.
For me trying on different pairs of boots is a waste of time so I rely on the experience of the bootfitter to select boots which are about the right shape for my feet, and then to make whatever adjustments are necessary to ensure a good, but not painful, fit.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Take up boarding, our people have sensible footwear not made from tupperware (except for the hard-booters but they're just odd)
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Quote: |
you probably dont know what a proper boot feels like. The fitter should tell you which boots are best for you not the other way round.
Rubbish.
If you don't like how they feel, walk away. Regardless of what the bootfitter says.
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Bit of both, surely? Ultimately you have to be the judge of what is acceptable, I agree: after all, it's your money and this whole skiing thing is supposed to be fun, isn't it? Skiing in boots that don't feel acceptable for whatever personal reason, would seem to me to be the opposite of fun.
But unless a boot fitter tells you what you're looking for, you won't necessarily make a good decision about what's "acceptable". Ski boots will never be as comfy as slippers, so someone at some point has to say how they *should* feel in order to get adequate performance from them, surely?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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1) Get boots fitted
2) Go to indoor slope/dryslope and have a ski
3) Take back to fitter if not satisfied as their job isn't finished till you are satisfied
4) Repeat from 2)
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
Ski boots will never be as comfy as slippers
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Mine do and I have horrible feet.
| ap96 wrote: |
| Quote: |
you probably dont know what a proper boot feels like. The fitter should tell you which boots are best for you not the other way round.
Rubbish.
If you don't like how they feel, walk away. Regardless of what the bootfitter says.
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Bit of both, surely? Ultimately you have to be the judge of what is acceptable, I agree: after all, it's your money and this whole skiing thing is supposed to be fun, isn't it? Skiing in boots that don't feel acceptable for whatever personal reason, would seem to me to be the opposite of fun.
But unless a boot fitter tells you what you're looking for, you won't necessarily make a good decision about what's "acceptable". Ski boots will never be as comfy as slippers, so someone at some point has to say how they *should* feel in order to get adequate performance from them, surely? |
If I was shopping for ski boots in a random 'snowsports' shop (eg snow + rock) then yes.
But if I was paying to see somebody who is a specialist and has been recommended by countless satisfied customers then no, I will have the confidence to accept what they are recommending. But I will ask questions and I will listen to what they say.
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Disaster, So what was the outcome, did you get any?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Markymark29 wrote: |
| My advice is go to S&R and/or EB and try the boots on, make your decision and buy them cheaper online. With the money saved go to a proper boot fitter like Rivington Alpine and have them fitted properly. In my experience the large ski shops don't have the expertise to fit as well as a boot fitting specialist. |
I kind of did that, but wouldn't again now my skiing has progressed. (In my defence I was still in student purchase mentality, and on second week of skiing so didn't appreciate importance of them fitting).
I bought a pair from a warehouse clearance place for £99 that were to my best guess the right length and narrow-ish make, then took them to Rivington Alpine where Graham did his best to perfect the fit, but I'm sure they wouldn't have been his choice. They've been ok, but not great, too high volume really I think. I'm going to do a few more weeks in them then get a new pair next year from Rivington.
At the time though it was the right thing for me to do as I couldn't justify £300 for a sport I didn't know if I would stick with. I was just looking for an improvement on hire boots (which I got!) Many other people who come to this site for info might be in a similar position so shouldn't have to think their only feasible option is £300 + custom insoles etc.
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Pair one bought in S+R Birmingham. They told me which boots would fit, took nearly two hours fitting, perfect fit.
Pair two bought from respected Midland specialist. Told me which boots would fit, took an hour fitting. Been back three times now, last holiday the pain did not arrive until the fourth day.....
Will try Colin but let S+R tell you what will fit and you'll be fine.
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FAQ
