 Poster: A snowHead
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We have a policy with our Co-Op Premier Privilage account, with insurance from Axa. I dug the policy out and then quired it with the helpline at both the bank and Axa.
The policy states
skiing (on or off piste (with a guide))
So if I ski on a piste I need a guide!!!!!!!!
I was going to find a girl guide and see if that will do.
Now this insurance is starting to get silly.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It's the sad world we live in unfortunately
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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k1orange, that "(with a guide)" almost certainly refers to the "off piste". Just not well written.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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" and then quired it with the helpline at both the bank and Axa"
I'm assuming k1orange has been told its with a guide even on piste???
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Yes with a guide even on piste
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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IMHO I suspect the parenthese are in the wrong place. It shoould read "skiing on piste or (off piste with a guide)". I love it when regulations are written in the form A or B and C there is lovely abiquity.
John
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k1orange, interesting, our travel insurance is with Smile (co-op) and have just checked the policy woding, is exactly the same.
Now I've always read it as insured on piste, or off piste with a guide
Do you have an email reply from Co Op you could post here (names removed)
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no e-mail, just lots of phone calls
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I have just emailed Customer Services to ask for written clarification so will let you know what I get
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ask them what "abiquity" means when you're at it. 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| pam w wrote: |
| ask them what "abiquity" means when you're at it. |
followed rapidly by 'Moral Turpitude' - I always tick that box when I'm doing the US landing card and for the last 21 years never had any idea whether I was guilty of it or not..
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| k1orange wrote: |
| no e-mail, just lots of phone calls |
Much better to get something in writing. First because it gives you some evidence, but more importantly because they will probably actually take the trouble to find out the real answer, rather than somebody on teh end of teh phone weho doesn't know just making one up.
I don't think the co-op (or probably any other insurance company) are quite immoral enough to sell a winter sports policy that would be invalid for well over 90% of those buying it.
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| Quote: |
Much better to get something in writing
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entirely agree but exceptionally difficult these days. I have failed on several occasions with several different companies to get anything in writing at all. Even, on one occasion, when I was told that a particular motor policy covered unlimited days driving in Europe (provided not more than half the year), I wrote to them, saying this aspect was "of the essence of the contract" for me and asking that it be confirmed in writing. They never even replied. I subsequently found out, only when renewing and speaking to a less dopey person, that this was NOT the case. didn't renew, but had been driving uninsured in Europe for some of our trips.  If there had been a problem they would no doubt have denied ever receiving my letter.
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You know it makes sense.
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hiya - I've also got one of these policies. the offending wording is on p. 28 here http://www.co-operativebank.co.uk/cfscombi/pdf/bank/Priv_PrivPrem_TravelInsSummary.pdf.
Called Axa's helpline (+44(0) 844 811 0925) - they've confirmed wording refers to off piste with a guide, not on piste.
Fortunately, with my current level of skill, there's no chance of me going off piste in the next few years.. but I'll have a chat, and see if they can sort out this poor wording.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I have the same Axa policy with LTSB.
It only refers to off piste and is worded correctly in the LTSB document. Axa are very helpful with any queries and have a good reputation for their performance, when it is needed.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| bertie bassett wrote: |
| followed rapidly by 'Moral Turpitude' - I always tick that box when I'm doing the US landing card and for the last 21 years never had any idea whether I was guilty of it or not.. |
For the US entry card think of it as being against what you would think is morally correct. So if you're arrested for fraud (for example), you're supposed to tick the box for "yes".
In fact, here's a list. I guess this means if you have been arrested or convicted of a crime that's not on the list and doesn't qualify under the other items in that section of the card then you can tick "no"!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_turpitude#U.S._government_guidance_on_determining_moral_turpitude
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Syx wrote: |
| bertie bassett wrote: |
| followed rapidly by 'Moral Turpitude' - I always tick that box when I'm doing the US landing card and for the last 21 years never had any idea whether I was guilty of it or not.. |
For the US entry card think of it as being against what you would think is morally correct. So if you're arrested for fraud (for example), you're supposed to tick the box for "yes".
In fact, here's a list. I guess this means if you have been arrested or convicted of a crime that's not on the list and doesn't qualify under the other items in that section of the card then you can tick "no"!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_turpitude#U.S._government_guidance_on_determining_moral_turpitude |
... So it's not some form of eco-fiendly substitute for the stuff you wash brushes in then?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Email response
In response to you email query below. I can confirm that I have spoken to
our underwriting team and you would only require a guide for off Piste
skiing.
I accept your comments regarding the ambiguous nature of the layout in the
policy wording and have asked this to be amended for future publications.
I trust that this satisfies your query.
Please don't hesitate to contact us if you require any further assistance.
Kind Regards
Dear Sir/Madam
I am hoping that you could clarify some confusion regarding the wording of
our travel insurance - we have a policy with you, provided as part of our
Smile Bank Account
With regard to Winter sports, it says that cover is provided for "Skiing
(on or off piste (with a guide))"
Now I read that as cover is provided for skiing on piste, or off-piste with
a guide. I.e. a guide isnt required if skiing on piste. However, a recent
online discussion on ski insurance has suggested that this actually means a
guide is required for skiing both on and off piste.
I would be grateful if you could clarify the meaning
Regards
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Boris, I've just had a look at the policy, and IMHO there are more things wrong with the ski-ing part than that.
A very faint footnote mark indicates that for many snow-related activities, personal liability and personal accident cover are excluded. To name but two, this appears to apply to cross-country ski-ing and glacier ski-ing.
In the introduction to that part it also says this:
"You must accept and follow the supervision and tuition of experts qualified in the pursuit or activity in question and you must use all appropriate precautions, equipment and eye protection. Disregarding such advice and precautions may invalidate any claim you make."
Which suggests to me that you are not covered unless you ski with supervision and tuition.
It also says in the definitions:
"Sports Activities and Winter Sports Activities
– the activities listed on page 27 for which your participation in during your holiday is not the sole or main reason for your trip. During a winter holiday the Winter Sports Activities detailed are covered by your policy." (My underlining). I think that's confusing too and could be read to imply that ski-ing holidays are not covered only "winter holidays when you do a bit of ski-ing.
Pity - because I like the Co-op and put a bit of business their way and would like to use them more.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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(disclaimer - I work for the coop bank, but any opinions expressed are my own etc..)
@Nordicfan - think the key word is may invalidate any claim.. (my emphasis). This is a general comment about following instructions / advice eg you wouldnt be insured in conditions where locals advise you shouldnt ski; you should wear sensible gear. Can't find the wording about holiday purpose on my copy of the policy. Does seem a bit harsh excluding Cross Country from Personal Accident / Liability though.
The AXA call centre clarified stuff and put my mind at rest in terms of my own cover (AXA provide the policy on behalf of the coop for package Bank accounts, which is why the Bank guys might struggle with this kind of detail).
Can't comment on coop travel - would guess their policy's different.
I suppose best advice is to check individually if the policy suits you - It seemed pretty good last time I checked in comparison with the likes of M&S annual trip etc.
The guy I contacted has confirmed we'll look at the dicey wording next time the policy's updated.
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