 Poster: A snowHead
|
I have been advised by Quiver Killer that Loctite may be harmful to some of the plastics of which bindings are composed.
There have been specific reports of 22 Designs' bindings (ie, Hammerhead telemark bindings) cracking were Loctite has contacted it's plastic. For this reason, 22 Designs specifically forbids the use of Loctite with their bindings.
This problem has only arisen for 22 Designs' bindings & there have been no other reports of binding failures of other manufacturers. Quiver Killer have been using Loctite 242/3 (blue) on fasteners for the installation of Fritschi, Marker and Salomon bindings for over a year of use with zero issues. Furthermore, racers have been using Loctite on the binding screw interface with metal race plates for years without issue. And if your specific binding is an all metal design then of course there would be no issue.
Nevertheless, Quiver Killer are recommending the use of a more plastics friendly alternative. A couple of alternatives are:
Loctite Quicktape 249
This is Loctite in a tape form you first wrap around the fastener before installation. Still the same material, but in a form that is easy to segregate from the binding.
Vibra-tite VC-3
This is a non-anaerobic formula that is benign to all plastics. This material is first painted onto the fasteners and let to dry before installation. The fasteners in this case may be un- and re-installed several times without reapplication.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
I've been wondering about the use of Loctite on inserts and plates, so this makes interesting reading.
Surely, once you'Ve swapped bindings on and off quite a few times you're going to end up with an, admittedly small, glue deposit in the insert / plate screw hole. Am I making up a potential issue which doesn't exist? Or if it is something that might cause a small problem, how might one go about getting the deposit out?
Just a thought from a completely non-practical kinda chap ...
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
spyderjon, any chance you can bulk buy the Quicktape and then sell it on in small servings?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
+1 for the tape, like the sound of it, hate fannyin about with glue. Anyone used the tape before?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
I liked the sound of Vibra-tite untill I saw it went at £58 for 50ml 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| zammo wrote: |
| .....Am I making up a potential issue which doesn't exist?... |
Yes
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| rob@rar wrote: |
| spyderjon, any chance you can bulk buy the Quicktape and then sell it on in small servings? |
I'm on it & will advise asap.
Personally I'm carrying on using 243.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
if you are careful presumably there's no reason for the loctite to come into contact with the binding 
i'm just using a drop or two on the very end of the screw
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
Arno, very end? Surely it has to go on the thread?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Arno wrote: |
| if you are careful presumably there's no reason for the loctite to come into contact with the binding |
Exactly.
I put a blob on the bottom few threads & then shake the screw to remove the excess liquid & leave just a thin coating in the threads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
| rob@rar wrote: |
| spyderjon, any chance you can bulk buy the Quicktape and then sell it on in small servings? |
Done some research on the 249 Quicktape. Unfortunately it's a US product only & Loctite UK refuse to supply it  There's over 6.5m on a roll but it's not possible to repackage it as it only has a short shelf life once removed from it's original packaging. It's designed for larger diameter bolts than M5. Taking all this in to account it's really a non starter.
The Vibra-tite product has recently been tested by Nick at Quiver Killer. Vibra-tite are offering us a 'one-use' pack which are pretty small so Nick emptied the liquid in to a mountain bike tyre tube cap. The end of each screw is dipped in and set it aside to dry. Once dry they go in nice and clean & are re-usable without reapplication. One packet was more than enough for one set of screws (18 for his Barrons) but two sets of screws from one packet would be pushing it a bit though.
The holiday period has affected lead time but I should have the Vibra-tite one-use packs available in a couple of weeks.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
PSA: Having had the inserts done, I nipped into halfrauds for some threadlock.
However, the cack handed of us may be reassured to know that they sell Loctite Blue 248, which comes in a "pritstick" type dispenser as shown here
It seemed a bit more travel freindly than normal glue, so I went for that one. Just hoping it works now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I skied with Quiver Killer inserts for 5 days over the Christmas holiday without using any Loctite product. Before skiing I made sure all the binding screws were done up tightly. I double checked the screws after 5 days and found that although they were all fairly secure each one of them required a quarter turn of the screwdriver to bring them back to the same level of tightness as when I mounted the bindings.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
Thanks Rob.
I was wondering about leaving them with nowt on myself. Your test doesn't sound too bad, I think Kitenski had sme loosening after one day though.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
Just back from a week in the 3V. Correctly torqued but unbonded screws lasted a day & half before needing a eigth/quarter turn to retighten. Then used Vibratite VC3 & they were solid all week & are still bang on torque when checked at home today.
I'll have the 'one use' sachets of the Vibratite VC3 (as referred to in my post above) in my online store in the next couple of days. Depending on customs charges they'll be about a £1 a sachet. This is a non-anaerobic formula that is guaranteed benign to all plastics & is the only threadlock recommended by QK.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
Interesting mine needed a 1/4 turn after a few uk turns last year, I wonder if I'd left them all day they would have been ok??
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
spyderjon, can I get some of the Vibratite ordered and posted out before I go away Tuesday next week please? I assume this means I can move bindings from pair to pair without having to add anything to the scews whilst on holiday 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
spyderjon, Hi I am new to snowheads and just mounting my skis with quiver killers. What is you online store so I can order some vibratite. Thanks
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Hi there... That tape sound a lot like the tape I use... Plumbers PTFE tape! Available from diy shops for a few pence, it seems to work a treat when a little is wrapped around the threads. I can't quite remember where I got the tip from but I've had no issues with bolts coming loose....
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Vibra-Tite VC3 is now in stock.
orangekss, PTFE tape is excellent as a plumbers water sealant but it is not designed to lock a thread that's subject to this kind of vibration - I tried it on rifle scope mount screws years ago & it was useless whereas blue locktite worked perfectly.
kitenski, three sachets in tomorrows post to you.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| spyderjon wrote: |
| kitenski, three sachets in tomorrows post to you. |
Cheers Jon, so I empty them into a bike valve cap, dip each screw in and leave for x hours, is that all that is required?
regards,
greg
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
rob@rar, mm. Thanks for that - I have just had to remove and replace a heel binding - and had thought screwing home firmly would be sufficient. Not time to get some VC3 before setting off tomorrow - may be I'll use blue loctitite - with care.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
My binding has plastic base (bit of a surprise that) but I think I can keep the loctite clear with care. Is there likely to be anything in the insert which could be damaged by it? The insert appeared to have a plastic thread when I looked. OTOH spyderjon suggests a long history of blue loctitie being OK - except for damaging one make of bindings.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
I had another careful look at the inserts - and tapped them. Although they look blue, they do sound like metal - so I guess they just may be anodised - or I am seeing the old locking compound. Loctite 243 applied very carefully and bindings screwed home. But I just may take that Posi 3 driver with me - in my ski bag 
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
Chaps, I have had to take my FKS 180s off my new skis as Rossignol are going to replace them due to defective toe piece.. When remounting I'm thinking I should use quiver killlers to make sure I get a strong fixing second time around - is there anything specific you need for different types of bindings.. FKS in particular?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
HenryL, you just need the M5 screws for your specific bindings - which I can supply.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
quick report I used Vibra-tite recently on some screws holding down Markers into quiverkillers. The bindings were rock solid after 4 days skiing and some skinning.
I removed one set of bindings for the journey home, the screws were as tight as when installed. When I'd tried them without vibra-tite some screws had loosened on a previous trip even after one run.
So a pic of 3 screws, 2 that have been used and one that hasn't. There is still some vibra-tite left in the threads of the used screws, do folk think it would still provide a tight fit on 2nd use?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
|
Boooom, a season in Cham awaits you, come do it here!!!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
|
SMALLZOOKEEPER, you stocking these or anything similar?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
Sideshow_Bob, We've done the Dyna-duke and the Solly version. Had alot of delam' problems with K2 backside range. They've helped a ton to make a tight sandwich.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
|
kitenski, yes
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
spyderjon, Loctite 243 needs the absence of oxygen and the presence of 2 metal surfaces to work as a thread lock compound. Using it on plastic is a waste of time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Spyderman, A Quiver Killer insert system is exactly that, ie two metal surfaces & air tight (or pretty much air tight). The issue with liquid Loctite is that if gets on some plastics in liquid form then it can cause the plastic to subsequently fracture under load - which is why a number of binding manfacturers say not to use it. There's a thread on TGR detailing a number of failures.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
moffatross, my experience with 248 is that it needs to applied every time as opposed to the VC3 which'll do a number of insert/removals before needing to be re-applied.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
spyderjon, yep, I agree with that and it is a compromise. The Vibratite dipped screws are still red on the thread when removed whereas the Loctite 248 dabbed ones mostly just sport a few small, blue bogeys when you take them out. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
|
|
|
|
spyderjon, Send me a PM and I'll order it in. 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
