 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi i am actually in alpe d'huez at the moment untill the 12th March, we would normaly ski red runs but want to progress to blacks. Yesterday we skied the Sarenne and thought it was a nice run, not too difficult. We have also tried La Fare and found it fine! The other blacks we skied were "La Balme" and "La Foret" but found them alot more challenging, having trouble with steep mogul fields. can anyone advise us with regard to which are the easier black runs to learn on in Alpe D'Huez???
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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La Fare is the most manageable I think, barely a red to be honest. It would be a great run for doing laps if it weren't for the lengthy lift sequence to get back up again! La Balme was a bugger when we were on it last week - carnage, and the Sarenne is a grooming lottery (nicely groomed some mornings, moguls top to bottom - at least on the steep bits - on other days, it seems). That Combe something-or-other that seems parallel to the Sarenne on the piste map is meant to be a cracker.
Those ones at the top can all be mogulled as I understand it, so if you like black steepness but not bumps the best thing might be to ask the lifties where the bumps aren't on any given day.
I'd avoid the Tunnel.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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maybe col de cluy or combe charbonniere? the other blacks which haven't been mentioned are pretty steep
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From the top of Marmottes 2, try Macle. It's fairly straightforward or you can go the other side and ski Balcons which I think features the steepest pitch of all the Alpe d'Huez blacks. It isn't at all bad unless it's bumped up.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'd avoid the Tunnel
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Go on - go for Le Tunnel.
It's an adrenalin rush you'll never forget.
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Paulio i agree the the run down was nice but the lift back up from Vajuny was a pain! I think we must of been lucky the day we got the Sarenne as it was a handy enough run all the way down. im not in a hurry to do la balme again.
Arno think we will go with the combe tomorrow as both yourself and Paulio recommend it.
Bad roo i think Macle will be the run that we do after combe, if ya agree that combe is easier??? If balcons is V. moguly might give it a miss.
Griffterski may wait till next time for the tunnel as everyone says its tuff as f*ck!!!!
for us Steepness is not the prob. its moguls/ice.
All in all, If i were to put the 5 blacks that we have done in order (easy to difficult) i would go:
La Fare
La Sarenne (Draing run tho)
Glacier
La Balme
La Foret
Would ye agree???????????? Would like to see the order you rate them>
I really apreciate the feed back, if there is anything else ya think off let me know.
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snowfinch, don't do La Fuma at Auris, you won't like it.
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snowfinch, I don't know AdH, but I'd be very wary of attempting a black run on the basis of what people on this forum regard as easy. Runs vary hugely according to grooming, snow conditions, temperature, light and visibility, and this week's easier black might be next week's harder run. Also, the reason for a black grading can vary and one man's meat is another's poison - I, for example, am much more comfortable on a steep mogulled run than a steep groomer, but I'm a little unusual in that preference.
I'd strongly recommend giving any new runs a good eyeballing from a lift or nearby run before committing yourself. You should also consider seeking on-the-ground advice from the ski patrol about current conditions and tha nature of any hazards that you might encounter.
Black runs are labelled as being for expert skiers for a reason. Make sure you know it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I love the Sarenne, but I don't think it is a true black, I think its rating is more to scare timid skiers off because there are limited exits if you can't handle it. I have skied it when it is very mogully, also with bare patches and with sheet ice on the bottom section (it was closed at the time but we made the mistake of following an ESF instructor), but with good snow it is lovely. Tip, when you come off the lift let the crowds get a head start (or go like the clappers to get a head start) and you should have the run to yourself,
Fare is great if you add it to the run down to Alpette.
Last time we were in ADH we discovered Col de Cluy on the last day, it was quite knarly at the end but v. satisfying, it also fits into the "I don't know why this is a black, until you get to the drop off to the moguls!
The Tunnel is a sort of must do, I have got into more trouble in the run in to the Tunnel entrance than I ever have on the moguls themselves, I would add that apart from the adrenelin rush of doing the first part of the run, the bottom of the Tunnel run is not that special imo.
Good to do the Tunnel at lunchtime ... less ice and less crowded. Fallen over people is a much more difficult obstacle than the bumps themselves.
One tip might be to get an instructor (Stance or Masterclass) and say that you want to improve your Mogul technique, I did this culminating with the Tunnel, which I handled with much more confidence, rather than the previous "sideslip to the edge, panic running out of room, turn .... etc"
Done the 3V's for the last couple of years and am hankering for the "honesty" of ADH! Might go back next year.
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| Lizzard wrote: |
| snowfinch, don't do La Fuma at Auris, you won't like it. |
La Fuma is a much overlooked gem but i can never work out how it gets so mogulled because i have never seen anyone else on it 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Piste gradings and people's perception of it's importance is a bit of bug bear of mine.
IMO you shouldn't pay too much attention to the piste grading. Bigger factors are the conditions and your physical state.
Aside from the technical skills of skiing you should straight away try to learn some mountain skills i.e., assessing terrain, weather and crucially the combination of the two. A slope that doesn't get much sun is going to be prone to ice. On a cold day it's probably not the place to go. However, if the temperature is up it could be the ideal place to go. The snow will have softened but because it doesn't get sunny will have held it's composition and be nice to ski on. That's just one simple example.
In the morning, get yourself on a couple of tried and tested slopes first and then take on something a bit more challenging. Do most of your hard ski morning or early afternoon (provided you've not overdone it at a mountain restaurant). Plan your route home carefully to avoid tackling something that will be tough on tired legs. Also give yourself time so that you don't have to rush for the last lift.
Generally poor conditions are always going to throw up tricky sections so again you need to learn early on how to "pick your way" safely. You can be technically quite average but still able to ski any terrain using your brain. Thinking that coloured line on the piste map tells you everything you need to know is a bad idea.
Met an ex-colleague on the train a while back. I've never skied with him but it is a shared interest. He came out with the classic "I am not the best skier but I can ski most reds and blacks". No offence to this one particular guy or others. I am sure I must have used the line myself in the past. But it is totally meaningless statement and misses the point of skiing entirely. Don't get me wrong the grading system is good when used as a general reference point and is necessary as an indication of the difficulty. But part of the challenge of skiing is coping with what you find, skiing well and enjoying it... rather than surviving and then saying "I have skied a red/black run".
Poor visibility is one of the best things for finding out poor technique, regardless of the piste grading.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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A slope that doesn't get much sun is going to be prone to ice.
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Alternatively that slope might not have melted and therefore will stay soft while other aspects are going through a freeze-thaw cycle hence why powder will generally last longer on N-facing slopes and (although a massive generalisation) N-facing slopes may be more unstable.
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| Layne wrote: |
Piste gradings and people's perception of it's importance is a bit of bug bear of mine.
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With you on that one.
A mate of mine wouldn't set foot on a black run, despite some of the easier blacks in the resort being well within his ability. He had managed to work up such a hoodoo about black runs that his confidence completely deserted him when faced with one.
I managed to sneak him onto one in poor visibility and he skied 2/3 of it brilliantly until he spotted one of the marker poles and then he just went to pieces. Bizarre really.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Layne wrote: |
| Aside from the technical skills of skiing you should straight away try to learn some mountain skills i.e., assessing terrain, weather and crucially the combination of the two. A slope that doesn't get much sun is going to be prone to ice. On a cold day it's probably not the place to go. However, if the temperature is up it could be the ideal place to go. The snow will have softened but because it doesn't get sunny will have held it's composition and be nice to ski on. That's just one simple example. |
True. But until you ski a run, it's often difficult to know how much sun it gets, so this can be a chicken and egg problem. That's why I always talk to the ski patrol or other skiers before I first tackle the hardest runs in a resort.
Now I'm a competent skier, I completely share your view that it's good to enjoy a run for what it is and not for its grade. But I still remember the frisson of excitement I fely when I first tackled a black on my impossible-to-control 205cm skinnies, so I fully sympathise with the OP.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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"Black runs are for experts"?
Pffff.
A second week skier can at least sideslip down all but the very fiercest of them. About half the skiers I know had a go down a black piste during their first week on skis.
If you can ski a red, you can ski a black. Just not quite as well.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Layne, 100% with you on your first post. Besides which, if it's an easy black then it shouldn't be labelled black, then if it's really a red, what's so special about skiing it? We have blues that should be red, reds that should be blue, reds that should be black, but don't expect any easy blacks on this side of the valley! I've been to 2 other resorts this week and haven't skied a red that would be anything but blue here - the whole colour thing is totally spurious. 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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paulio, anyone can sideslip down anything. It's not skiing though, is it?
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Lizzard, you've managed to state the bleedin' obvious and be wrong at the same time.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I just mean you can hack the hard bits and ski the easy bits. A second week skier on a black is the same as a first week skier on a red is the same as a first day skier on a blue. My point was that black pistes shouldn't be feared by many of the people who do seem to regard them with a sense of bewildered terror.
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paulio, you're quite right to say that in most resorts on most days, most-second week skiers could ski most black runs without hurting themselves. But it's the exceptions that are the problem, and I've seen more than one person freeze with panic on a runs that was well within their technical capability. That wouldn't be a good thing to happen to snowfinch.
Personally I usually talk to the ski patrol about conditions on advanced runs in an unfamiliar resort not so much because I doubt my technical ability but because I like to head straight to the best snow and the most fun.
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Thanks for all the replies. Did Combe Charbonniere, Col de Cluy and Clocher de Macle yesterday on the recommendations here and enjoyed them all. On Col de Cluy there was one quite steep mogulled part, but the slope was wide and at the far side of it was able to avoid most of them and it was grand.
I see what people are saying regarding not getting too wound up about blacks, but speaking for myself, I really enjoy reds and not having been on a black before, it is hard to get a sense of what 'very difficult' is. All marked black on the map, though often for different reasons - could be snow quality, gradient, narrowness with steep gradient... Although 'The Tunnel' and 'La Fare' are both marked as black on the map, the technical ability required to do each is quite different, so the recommendations I got here were brilliant in that I was able to challenge myself without finding myself somewhere struggling to cope with the terrain!. Anyway, after those runs in the morning yesterday I took a lesson and asked the guy to improve my 'mogul technique' and it definitely helped me out. Much more comfortable with them now but I think I willl just enjoy some of those runs again and leave 'The Tunnel' for another holiday...
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One more thought, in some resorts, notably 3V's, not necessarily ADH, you often have a choice between Red/Blue/Black to get from A to B, in the afternoon I choose Reds & Blacks to avoid crowded runs full of slow skiers.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Empty black easier than super-busy chopped up blue. Definitely. I keep trying to explain this to various black-averse scaredycats who I know, but they won't listen.
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snowfinch, glad to hear you're having fun out there
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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As an aside to those naming La Fare as the easiest black slope in the area: it's actually the steepest black in the resort when total vertical drop is measured against total length.
Useless bit of triv, but there you go.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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bad_roo, that's fascinating if true. All 3 in my group the other week agreed that we found it overgraded. Weird.
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Col du Cluy - a fairly short nice black, with one steep (normally moguled) section.
Combe Charbonnier - It killed my legs, it's a long run (longer than it looks) and when all chopped up and moguled I found it a bit tricky (in my mind it was my skis - couldn't have possibly been my poor technique). There's no option (other than jumping down what most skiiers call cliffs) other than to ski all the way to the bottom.
I found the Tunnel easier than Combe Charbonnier, but this was probably more to do with the snow conditions.
(You'll have finished your holiday by now, so this "advice" is a wee bit late)
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You know it makes sense.
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Le Tunnel --- just back from ADH. A total adrenaline rush at the top, not particularly difficult after the first 200 meters of steep giant moguls. Otherwise, views superb. Conditions difficult at the moment. A must IMO -- but be careful. The mogul field at the top can be very hard, depending on conditions, and there is no way back once you are there (except going back through the tunnel, which would be awkward). Make sure you are comfortable on steeps, and moguls - and yes, that you can sideslip.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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The first time I skied Le Tunnel in 1999 I thought it was very scary and intimidating. Coming out the the tunnel there was a queue of 7-8 people all getting in each others way traversing, side slipping looking to make the first jump in. The first 30-40 metres were big, icy moguls. I was quite chuffed to get down with no mishaps and without freezing up. When I returned a couple of years later I found it a totally different proposition. Coming out of the tunnel it was far less rutted and there was hardly any moguls at all. I fairly flew down. I looked a bit of a prat as I'd been bigging it up with the crew I was with who had never done it before. That was when I decided that piste grading or off piste grading for that matter was a bit like weather forecasting. Worth listening to but never to be relied upon 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Agree with that. Certainly depends totally on the conditions. There hasn't been any (decent) snow at ADH for a couple of weeks, so the moguls are more prominent at the moment, combined with a late season thaw (day), freeze (night) top layer adding to the fun early morning. After a lot of snow, I can imagine that Le Tunnel is far less intimidating. A classic in any case -- and definitely worth doing IMO. Worth trying the unpisted black Vallant de Pre at Les Sept Laux for a thrill. Steep at the top and after that a glorious run through some semi backcountry.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I can remember skiing the Tunnel one year when it was an untracked powder run with no moguls. Also had another experience being first down a freshly corduroyed Sarenne, which was just like a downhill race course from top to bottom. Happy days.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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bad_roo, had exactly that at Easter 08, they opened the top lift following a gale and the Tunnel was still shut. Pretty much first off the tram and easily first down at the bottom. GS skis do have their advantages at times 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Skied La Balme today. First bit easy peasy and all went well until we hit a field of mega, mega moguls. Cue some carnage. I slid about twenty metres on my back bottom - embarassing. Last third rutted and mogully but relatively easy. Other blacks up there were in good nick and no harder than a lot of the reds.
Could not get up to Pic Blanc to do Sarenne due to 45 minute queues.........
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