 Poster: A snowHead
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OK, so I'm currently an Anwarter ski instructor in the Austrian system, which is for all intents and purposes equivalent to BASI 2. I'm approaching the level where I'm thinking about starting the ISIA courses, but I'm not quite sure how to go about it. It's a pretty simple process in Austria - 10 day course, offpiste course, 10 day course, done. Relatively cheap too. Only problem is my level of german, and the fact the whole course is taught in german. This wasn't too much of a problem with the anwarter, which is fairly basic, but I'm a long way off being able to talk technical stuff in german.
Which is why I'm contemplating converting to BASI, frankly learning everything in English is going to be much better for my instructing. I know you have to have a second language at some point in BASI, but that's very different to learning everything in a foreign language. Problem here is, I don't want to go right back to the start, and blow £500 on a (for me) pointless level 1 course. Does anyone know what I would need to do to get exemption form Level 1? I realise I'll almost certainly havef to do the level 2 course, but I'm just not prepared to do level 1.
Also, could someone explain exactly what you have to do (coursewise/prerequisits) for BASI 3 ISIA? Second discipline, eurotest, technical/teaching/coaching modules... it's all a little confusing...
Any other advice would be cool too!
Cheers
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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To complete BASI Level 3/ISIA you have to do:
Teaching assessment (1 week course)
Technical Assessment (2 week course)
2nd discipline (any one from snowboarding, nordic, telemark or adaptive to BASI Level 1 standard, 1 week course)
Alpine Development Coach Level 1 and Level 2 or Alpine Fresstyle Coach L1 and L2 (three days for L1, 4 days for L2)
Common Theory (1 week course)
Mountain Safety (1 week course)
2nd language (which is now a telephone interview)
Child Protection Module (now an online course)
Valid 1st Aid certificate (at least a two day course)
200 Hours of logged teaching after you completed BASI Level 2
get in touch with the BASI office for an idea about exemptions. I'm sure a number of people will have asked them about the read across from the Anwarter into the BASI system.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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stewart woodward, SNAP 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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stewart woodward, SNAP
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| ccl wrote: |
http://basi.org.uk
basi@basi.org.uk
Why not contact BASI directly and ask? |
Yeah I did that as well, guess I'm kind of fishing for people's opinions of BASI...
| rob@rar wrote: |
To complete BASI Level 3/ISIA you have to do:
Teaching assessment (1 week course)
Technical Assessment (2 week course)
2nd discipline (any one from snowboarding, nordic, telemark or adaptive to BASI Level 1 standard, 1 week course)
Alpine Development Coach Level 1 and Level 2 or Alpine Fresstyle Coach L1 and L2 (three days for L1, 4 days for L2)
Common Theory (1 week course)
Mountain Safety (1 week course)
2nd language (which is now a telephone interview)
Child Protection Module (now an online course)
Valid 1st Aid certificate (at least a two day course)
200 Hours of logged teaching after you completed BASI Level 2
get in touch with the BASI office for an idea about exemptions. I'm sure a number of people will have asked them about the read across from the Anwarter into the BASI system. |
Bloody hell that's a long list!! Anyone know roughly how much that lot'll cost in total?!
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| clarky999 wrote: |
Bloody hell that's a long list!! Anyone know roughly how much that lot'll cost in total?! |
You may need to contact Gordon Brown to see if he can add your course fees to the National debt
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| ccl wrote: |
http://basi.org.uk
basi@basi.org.uk
Why not contact BASI directly and ask? |
Yeah I did that as well, guess I'm kind of fishing for people's opinions of BASI...
Bloody hell that's a long list!! Anyone know roughly how much that lot'll cost in total?! |
That's pretty much my opinion of BASI.... seems really really overcomplicated.
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You with CASI Dave?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
I know you have to have a second language at some point in BASI
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Allegedly. But according to their website, "However if you have a grade B in a foreign modern language at GCSE or higher you can forward a copy of your certificate to BASI by 1st January 2010 to gain exemption from this test."
So in fact there is no requirement to have a second language. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Sweet at least that would be one bit out of the wya lol!
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clarky999, CSIA 
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You know it makes sense.
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| Bloody hell that's a long list!! Anyone know roughly how much that lot'll cost in total?! |
BASI want its Level 3 qualification be recognised by ISIA (so it carries the ISIA Stamp), therefore the the list of things in BASI's qualification need to meet ISIA's criteria. As far as I'm aware the CSIA does not meet the ISIA criteria.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Austrian Landeslehrer does though, and it's not that complex. Does involve the Eurotest though.
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Poster: A snowHead
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clarky999, not too familiar with the Austrian system, is that the top level qualification? BASI's top qualification (L4/ISTD) has fewer modules (just 4: technical, teaching, Eurotest and Euro Mountain Safety) and is eligible for the ISIA Card not the Stamp.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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No, Austrian system goes Anwarter (BASI 2), Landeshleher ISIA (technically it's split into two levels, but landes 1 isn't really properly recognised, it's just seen as halfway through ISIA), Staatlicher ISTD (top level of instruction, which you need to open you're own ski school etc) and Bergfuher which is an offpiste ski guide (I'm not quite sure how it compares to UAIGM or whatever it is, but is fully recognised to lead high alpine multiday tours etc in Austria at the minimum).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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clarky999, thanks for that. I'd guess it's a national decision to include the Eurotest as part of the Landeshleher because I don't believe that ISIA require it at that level.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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clarky999, It seems to me that improving your German might be the easier option.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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clarky999, It seems to me that improving your German might be the easier option.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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ccl, if all they want is a B at GCSE, I doubt if he needs to.
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rob@rar, that's correct - though the CSIA4 does meet ISTD. I do wish the CSIA would add a course to gain ISIA acceptance, but as far as I can tell from what I've seen and heard, ISIA isn't that important? I find stuff like a "Child Protection Module" really hard to swallow, very health and safety-esque. Anyway, bit of a thread drift, and there's no disagreement that the BASI 3 isnt a more complete qualification - just personally I'm happy with how the CSIA trains and teaches.
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| DaveC wrote: |
| I find stuff like a "Child Protection Module" really hard to swallow, very health and safety-esque. |
It's really not a big deal. Was a morning in a classroom when I did it (now an online course to do in your own time) and it gave food for thought, nothing more. For some people, particularly those who are not long out of their teenage years and perhaps have a bit less experience of the world, it could help them avoid getting into stupid situations which could eventually lead to unwarranted accusations of inappropriate behaviour. The course was not a bad thing to do in my opinion, so I see no harm in having it as part of the qualification.
I also have "Advanced Child Protection" and that really was very tedious (a boring Friday afternoon in Aviemore when I really wanted to be on my way home)...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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CSIA IV meets the ISTD? Does it carry the ISIA card then?
I didn't know that Landeschilehrer 2 required Eurotest. There's definitely a race required for Staatlicher - what level is required for that then, I wonder?
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I dunno, for Landes 2 it's a timed GS*, maybe Staatlicher could be test technique (slalom?), or maybe just with lower tolerances?
*Which I presume is the Eurotest, it could just be a national variation, then eurotest is in Staatlicher?
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Tue 23-02-10 21:44; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| clarky999 wrote: |
| I dunno, for Landes 2 it's a timed GS |
The Eurotest itself, or a local GS to a different standard than the Eurotest?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I don't know, I thought it was the Eurotest, people who I know who've done it/trained for it made it sound like it was, but I oculd be wrong.
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| ccl wrote: |
| clarky999, It seems to me that improving your German might be the easier option. |
What I meant was to improve the German and continue in the Austrian system as maybe being easier than converting
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You know it makes sense.
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Yeah I'm coming to that conclusion...
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Please don't take this the worng way... but I have come to a conclusion...
bug
All
Snow
Intelligence
.... but lots of financial!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Eh?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ah I get it
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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DaveC, ISIA is not important to CSIA as the vast majority of their instructors work in Canada. They don't want their instructors to work overseas as they want plenty of instructors to be available to work at home, so there's no motivation to introduce the courses that would make the qual meet the ISIA standards.
People always slate BASI for having lots of courses and being expensive, but these training standards are implemented by ISIA, not BASI (excluding child protection I think, but as Rob said that's so quick and cheap it's irrelevant). At some point soon ISIA WILL crack down on member bodies who are not implementing their minimmum standards, so if your governing body doesn't you will lose your ISIA stamp.
clarky999, yes I'm pretty sure you're right the speedtest for the top Austrian qualification is the Eurotest as Austria along with the UK, France and Italy are the "Eurogroup".
However, as for converting I have a sneaky feeling that BASI considers Anwarter to be the same as L1 (obviously you can teach in the mountains unlike with BASI L1, but I think the technical level is comparable to BASI L1 - I know people who've failed BASI L2 then gone and done the Anwarter to get an on snow qualification more quickly). So I think you'd have to do the L1 to convert (I think they make you go back one level). But maybe I'm totally wrong, so best just to call the office and ask!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| DaveC wrote: |
| I find stuff like a "Child Protection Module" really hard to swallow, very health and safety-esque. |
DaveC - the Canadian system has the same stuff in the CSCF coaching module. Sign of the times I'm afraid.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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so which is the best, CSIA or BASI ....  ..... coat ......
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rayscoops, skiboards.
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rayscoops, i know you're taking the p* but it's pretty simple - Canada - CSIA, Europe - BASI. That's not to say you can't work in the other with the other (exc. some European countries with CSIA).
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| skimottaret wrote: |
http://snowmediazone.com/the_zone/data/500/BASI_exemptionList.pdf
here is the basi excemption list, it is a bit old but at least worth a look |
So judging by that I'd have to go right back to the start, which I can't be arsed to do - will just have to keep working on my Deutsch!
Out of interest, how much does it cost to do all the courses for BASI 3 ISIA? Couple of thousand?
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FAQ
