 Poster: A snowHead
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Just had a nose at the Slush and Rubble site and was laughing my jollies off at the asking price for an Adidas goggle-£130. Here's some of the guff they wrote about it:
'This innovative goggle from Adidas has a unique 2 part self-levelling frame that works with or without a helmet to give a snug and extremely comfortable fit. In addition, spherical anti-fog Vision Advantage lenses give precise optical clarity and superb peripheral vision, while ClimaCool* technology provides airflow through lenses to prevent fogging. Finally, it uses fully padded dual density face foam that is comfortable next to the skin. '
Is this the finest example of the Ernest Hemingway school of bull? Anyhow, £130-I ask you..........
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Only pay that for Oakleys in my book.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Nadenoodlee wrote: |
| Only pay that for Oakleys in my book. |
I wouldn't even do that.. I seem to get through goggles pretty quickly - all that taking off when you get into restaurant etc. 60 or 70 in end of season sale or other discount is the only way for me...
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Oakley Crowbars cost that much with polarised lenses. Definitely best goggles ever, although I don't feel any need for polarised, so I went for the normal lens with a second low-light one instead, cost about the same. Certainly, you don't get much goggle for anything less than about £50.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I wouldn't even pay that for a jacket and salopettes. My goggles cost €22 in Italy in 2006. Some people have more money than sense.
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queen bodecia, some people can afford what they wish to purchase
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holidayloverxx, indeed but more fool them for being willing to pay over the odds. If they weren't prepared to do it, prices would fall.
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I bought some Uvex goggles last season due to a contact lense disaster. They are brilliant and saved my holiday.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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If someone will pay it then the price is justified!
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Frosty-were they impregnated with a prescription?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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It's not "over the odds", it's what that item costs.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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In these days of ubiquitous offers, especially on t'internet, it seems unnecessary to pay full price for anything. Oakley goggles are available for much less than that.
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I got a cracking pair of goggles "free" with a fall line sub (not the current offer which looks less good).
kevin mcclean, I'd agree with you. Plenty of ski gear can be worth paying a lot for, but goggles get scratched and lost. I wonder what the cost price of Oakleys is btw - always seems very inflated, and my wife's Oakleys really aren't that special (which is why I passed them to her...)
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You know it makes sense.
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queen bodecia, So why is the price of these goggles "over the odds"? Are the materials inferior? is the technology cheap to develop - I genuinely don't know, but if I could get goggles to fit my face (which I've found impossible), that didn't fog up, were optically great and they happened to cost £130, then I'd pay it. That's my value judgement and while it isn't yours it doesn't make me a fool (and I certainly don't have more money than sense)
I paid a lot for my jacket and salopettes 4 years ago. I expect them to last several more years. In the meantime Mr HL has had 2 cheap jackets and 2 cheap salopettes. Clearly not everyone can afford to pull out a lto in one go, but sometimes not doing so is a false ecomony. I hope you get many years good service out of your inexpensive goggles.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Can't help but wonder what the margin is on a product like that when there are products that do the same job for a tenth of the price and probably made in the same factory.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I would suggest you don't get kitted out by Chanel! 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| kevin mcclean wrote: |
| Frosty-were they impregnated with a prescription? |
no, wore my specs underneath for 5 super vision days in heavy snow.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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queen bodecia, but is it the same job? Are the materials and finish identical? It doesn't matter if 2 products are made in the same factory, different standards will apply depending on the standards set buy the buyer. I agree that the big brand names are likely to have a higher margin, but in many cases, it's my belief, that they put more into product development and quality and in a free market naturally they should get greater reward. Ultimately that's how cheaper products can be made, through using the technology that the big boys have developed.
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Sun 20-12-09 19:27; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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stoatsbrother,
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I wonder what the cost price of Oakleys is
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Butterfly recently found somewhere to buy a pair at £56 inc p&p.
Oh, sorry, I've just seen you said 'cost' price. Dunno.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Anyone know where I can get a V12 Vantage for £7k? Pretty sure they're made in the same factory as the Dacia Sandero.
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| Quote: |
former Dacia owner
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We need to talk 
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holidayloverxx, I'm guessing that part of the premium price of branded products is the brand name itself, not the cost of materials and manufacturing. I've seen it in the clothing industry in a factory in Sri Lanka where lots of similar products were made in the same factory by the same staff using the same materials. Yet one shirt cost £20 in Next and another from the same production line cost £80 in DKNY.
People who are prepared to pay the extra for their perceived 'superior' brand are keeping the prices artificially high.
I suspect the skiwear industry is much the same and I know the motorcycle clothing industry certainly is. For example most brand off the peg motorcycle leathers are made in the same factory in Sialkot in Pakistan. Yet a Dainese set will cost the purchaser anything up to a grand whereas an RST set from the same production line £200-£300.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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queen bodecia, I've been in retail for donkey's, including in B&M, so I know how it works. Same material and staff, yes, but what about final QC? I have certainly know of examnples where the finished product woudl look identical, but on the cheaper garment the seams woudl be narrower, facings woudl be inferior, buttons cheaper, button holes not as well overlocked etc etc etc. (I don't deny there is a premium for the brand).
I'd be interested to see the Dainese set of leathers and compare every stage of producution to see if the RST set is truly identical.
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holidayloverxx, would you care to tell us what the acronyms stand for? This is an interesting argument.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Hurtle, B&M = Buying and Merchandising. QC = Quality Control
Amongst other things, Buyers source the product & set the standards; Merchandisers look after the money - tell the buyers how much they can spend, what the margin needs to be and determines the price the product can be sold for.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Sun 20-12-09 19:42; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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holidayloverxx, I accept there are differences with levels of finish and technological processes used, but by and large these products are made in countries where labour and land is dirt cheap. Therefore to me the huge differences in price (sometimes five- or even ten-fold) between different brands of product to me is totally unjustified. You may be paying more for a few nice technical gimmicks but you're also paying a heck of a lot for a logo.
I'm not talking about Aston Martins (although you can buy a decent house for that sort of money, lol!).
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holidayloverxx, thanks. And RST?
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You know it makes sense.
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queen bodecia, what about the cost of product development? who pays for that? where are the development teams located? what makes the technical features "gimmicks"?
TBH I think we've both got a point, and I'm off for my supper now.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Hurtle, dunno - that's from queen bodecia, I think it's a cheaper brand of motor bike gear. (quick google confims)
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Poster: A snowHead
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| jonm wrote: |
| It's not "over the odds", it's what that item costs. |
No.
It's what the market will bear.
Goggles and sunglasses are one thing I personally will never pay a lot of money for simply because I lose them so often and it hurts less if they're cheapo.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hurtle, RST is a cheaper brand of motorcycle clothing.
holidayloverxx, indeed we both have points. I think mine is purely down to the huge diversity of costs for products that essentially perform the same function and are often made by the same staff in the same location. There is certainly a justification for an increased retail price for products made with superior materials and following extensive development, but my question is how this translates into a ten-fold cost increase. I'm pretty sure there is a large element of brand cost premium.
My point is that people are prepared to pay much higher prices for perceived 'superior' brands. If people weren't prepared to pay these inflated prices, then the prices would have to fall and the margins would become more reasonable. Not only that, the lucrative business in forgeries and theft would become far less lucrative. You don't see knocked off Decathlon gear on fleabay at a tenth of the cost.
Just my two-penneth. I'm a cheapskate and rightly proud of it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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holidayloverxx, queen bodecia, oops, sorry, missed that (re RST).
This really is a fascinating argument, particularly since you both - unusually for snowHeads - have some facts to back up your assertions. Do carry on!
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Maybe the world should just have one huge ski wear factory with everyone cruising about in whatever it produces. I know, we could give everyone ski-vouchers which they could exchange for goods and services on a rationed basis.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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One further point in motorcycle clothing are the RiDE tests. For those that don't know RiDE is a Bauer-published (formerly EMAP) monthly motorcycling magazine. I used to know them quite well at Emap having done a bit of design/PR work for them in the past.
Anyway, they conduct independent product tests along the lines of Which? magazine. The tests of branded leathers made interesting reading. The expensive off-the-peg brands such as Dainese, Alpinestars, Spidi, Arlen Ness all performed at the bottom end of the scale and were equalled or even bettered by many of the cheaper brands (RST, Akito, IXS). There were some notable exceptions such as European-made brands which all performed better. The tests ranged from abrasion resistance to seam strength, fit characteristics, showerproofing, body armour impact strength, etc.
I wonder if anyone performs tests like this for ski clothing and accessories. I'm sure it would make interesting reading.
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| holidayloverxx wrote: |
| what makes the technical features "gimmicks"? |
Not wishing to jump into the middle of a debate (more merge from the side...) I, like I suspect you, find many of the technical features on higher end ski goggles anything but a gimmick.
Over the years, I've probably got through about ten pairs of goggles. The only two that haven't been unbearable, and have actually done the job as advertised, have been the Oakleys (indeed, I bought the second pair on the basis of how good the first pair were). Every other goggle I have bought (£10-£50) have fogged up almost the second I put them on, or been almost impossible to see through because of the lens quality etc etc etc. In my opinion, the £100 Oakleys were worth every penny as I paid £100 each for goggles which actually did the job they were designed for. I no longer dread the thought of having to change from the sunglasses to the goggles as I once did.
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Just my two-penneth. I'm a cheapskate and rightly proud of it.queen bodecia, Yeah and I bet you don't buy your mates a drink either 
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| Quote: |
| Can £130 for a goggle be justified? |
Not for me. My £25 goggles fit perfectly, have never fogged, have survived many years of abuse, and give enough optical clarity for me to be unable to blame them when I wipe out. They don't, however, have a prestgious brand name so would be unacceptable to many snowheads.
I'm with the cheapskates. I'd prefer spend my cash on other stuff.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
queen bodecia
....people are prepared to pay much higher prices for perceived 'superior' brands....
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some people are prepared to pay appropriate prices for better quality, and for products that suit them. some other people are indeed prepared to pay much higher prices for a label without any thought or idea of what goes into the product.
it takes all sorts, thankfully, otherwise the high st would be full of boutiquey type shops which is not helpful when all you want is something average, so you keep being a cheapskate love
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Oakley do the job, last and are better than cheaper stuff i've had, which has been hard wearing but not as good. Hence the pay out. I don't buy more expensive stuff because I like giving it away, I buy it because it is in this instance better.
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FAQ
that's my point about buying cheap!)