 Poster: A snowHead
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Hey,
I get my GCSE results in a couple of weeks and not sure wether to carry on at school or get a job. My main goal is to work in the french alps as I've been going since I was 5. The ideal job would to be a ski instructor of course so I'd just like some tips on how I can achieve my goal of working in the alps (what course's to take, prices etc). I don't want you guys to think I'm just a kid that wants to be a fireman or something because I've looked into what jobs I can get into and I'm very focused on what I'd like to do, even if it does mean working in an indoor snow centre in the UK for a while.
Thanks 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ben3210, I suspect that I won't be the last person to respond to your post suggesting that you do carry on at school. Maybe you could do French A level? One of my nieces, who is studying PE at degree level at the moment, did skiing as one of her specialist sports at AS level - you might be able to think about that, too.
Lots of people achieve their goal of working in the Alps, and there's no reason why you shouldn't do, either. But the best way to set about it at this stage is to work on developing a range of skills and experience which will help persuade tour operators and other people to take you on. Even if you leave school at 18 you'll find your earning potential will be very low - but there are jobs that offer board and lodgings, and a ski pass as well, so you can get by.
All the standard skills such as communication, being able to work in a team, determination and resilience etc are relevant. But in terms of particular skills, cooking is always in demand - if you can get some training/experience working in kitchens, it would stand you in good stead. Bar work, and experience of being a waiter/waitress is also very relevant. My son has done two seasons in the Alps earning 3000 euros a month cooking - he's a very good and experienced cook now, but his first job was preparing the starters in the pub over the road, on Friday and Saturday nights, when he was working for his GCSEs! He did it just to earn some money, but found that he enjoyed working with food. He's a student (still, at 31  ) and studying for his Ph D - nothing to do with cookery - but his skill with food and restaurant experience has enabled him to take lots of time out - not just two seasons in the French Alps but also in Australia and other places round the world.
Qualifications required of ski instructors in France are exceptionally high, and take years to achieve. Tends to cost a lot of money, too. There are a lot of people on Snowheads with experience who might be able to help you take the first steps. I remember many years ago when the Milton Keynes indoor slope started up they were advertising for local youngsters to start training as instructors. I thought that was a great opportunity - but I was far too old and lived too far away!
(My son tells me the ski instructors get the best girls, by the way).
If you have any ski shops near you I guess you could do worse than get weekend job there - and try to persuade them to let you learn some ski technician skills - servicing skis and boards, etc.
Good luck.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ben3210, you might be an awful cook now, but so are most lads at your age - there's loads of time to learn and it's not hard getting part time jobs to get into it. It's actually more interesting cooking in a "professional" kitchen set up than pottering around in your own kitchen with the family being critical.
And women do appreciate a chap who can cook a good meal, you know.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Ben3210, stick out through A levels. Although the recession isn't as bad as the doom-mongers would like us to believe it is having an impact. A levels will give you a couple of years to ride it out. I'm not saying that unless you get A levels you'll never make it, but getting them will give you more choice later.
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RPF, I'm really trying to improve my skiing as I do a 1hr30 min session each month and go to the alps each year. I will definately look into the course's and suggestions you mentioned. I will almost definately have to find a local job to cover the cost of the course(s). Also, my french is pretty average (maybe a little above average), I've spoken to french people in a normal conversation but I'm no way fluent so I would definately have to get upto scratch. Furthermore, I'm not really a summer person so finding something to do in the summer would be hard for me in the northern hemisphere but going to the southern hemisphere would prove to be even more expensive.
Thanks for the advice and keep it coming!
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hyweljenkins, To be honest I am leaning toward staying on at school rather than going into a job first, I never really considered the reccession.
Thanks.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Ben3210, you can do BASI exams now (assuming you're 16), but from memory (someone else correct me if I'm wrong) you won't get your L1 licence till you're 17 - this only qualifies you to work on artifical slopes, and level 2 licence until you're 18. The licence is what enables you to work, so if you've passed the exams in advance, done the first aid, shadowing, child protection modulce, and CRB disclosure you'll get it automatically on your birthday. Regardless of whether or not you're qualified I think you will also struggle to get a job as a ski instructor until you're 18. Some Swiss and Austrian may employ young people during peak periods, but I don't think you'd get work all season. Take a look at the BASI website here:
http://www.basi.org.uk/
(Click on Courses then Alpine)
What I suggest you do is carry on in full time education until you're 18, doing something that interests you. Whilst studying do your BASI exams, then once you're old enough see if you can get a part time job at a local dry or indoor slope. Then once you're 18 and have your Level 2 you will be in a better position to apply for jobs, with some experience.
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Ben3210, my advice would be definitely to get some A levels either at school or FE College, and think about university too. Time is on your side. Keep skiing as often as you can afford. The more qualifications you have, the more options will open up.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Ben3210, I go along with all the advice to complete your school education. Whilst you are doing that, have a look at how costly and difficult it is to get an ISTD ski instructor qualification - which I think you would need if you were going to make a full long-term career. Then Google around and look at likely income. I'm grateful that the likes of easiski have stuck it out and become instructors - since I can't see why they do it. Still, it was their choice - and it could be yours. But finish your education first. If nothing else, it will give you something to back you up should injury stop your instructor career.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Wed 29-07-09 15:05; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ben3210, another thing to bear in mind, is that many of the "career" instructors do not just work for someone else, but run their own ski school, even if they only operate as a one man band. In this regard business management, accounting, marketing, sales skills etc are all just as important as ski teaching skills. One very successful ISTD I know did sports management at college before starting doing seasons, before moving into management roles within the ski industry at a very early age.
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It should also be remembered that A levels aren't for everyone. This country would benefit if we adopted a similar approach to the french with vocational/trade based options at just before age 16. In my opinion A levels should only be considered if someone has got, say, at least 8 passes at A-C at GCSE and have A's and B's in the subjects they wish to study at A level. I would stress that this is only my opinion. By the way, I started working at age 16 and work in the same office as my other half (who has a first in economics) doing the same job. My point is, you will have a better idea when you have your results but just follow your heart.
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You know it makes sense.
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Libertine, in principle I agree with you. In practice, Ben3210 is lumbered with the system we have, which gives a lot more options to those who complete A levels, from what I have seen.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks for all the advice, I think nearly all posts say I should continue my education which I will probably end up doing.
beanie1, Thanks for the website link, I'll definately look into it and take in your advice.
Jehu, I will definately continue skiing, I'm going every month and currently I have 6 weeks overall in the alps which I think isn't bad considering I'm 16 (or maybe it is bad  ).
achilles, Thanks, I will probably end up staying on at school and I wish to get an ISTD qualification.
Libertine, I'm pretty much sure I only have 2 A's/B's which is pretty bad. I was going to go for an A-Level in French and I.T, my I.T teacher said I've probably got a C but, I really didn't pay attention as much as I should've done in French lessons during years 7-9. I treated french lesson as a time to talk because at age 11 when I started french I had no idea I'd be interested in Ski Instructing.
Thanks guys. :
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Poster: A snowHead
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French is a difficult A level (it's a big jump from GCSE apparently, a bit like maths is) but if A levels are the way you want to go you should do it whatever as at least it is relevant to the career you wish to pursue. Best of luck in your results and in your future plans!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Well, I haven't got to the point where I've asked them about funding. I know I would have to put toward it for definate. That's why I'll need a job to gather money before I do anything else. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Libertine wrote: |
| .....This is a fair point. Would you have to fund yourself? If your parents were going to help with uni costs perhaps they could do the same for ski instructor training costs |
From what I have read, the costs of achieving ISTD could be rather greater, though some income from instructing should be coming in as one goes through the stages, of course.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ben3210, it's easy peasy to work int he Alps in some capacity or other, see here: www.natives.co.uk But you'll have to be 18, so you might as well stay in school for a bit.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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To get an instructor qual in France or Austria you have to be seriously good and it takes ages - I'm not sure they would even teach a non-national. I know someone who did the Austrian qualification and you have to be within a certain time in races etc. France especially is very protectionist and from what I've heard if they even suspect you are instructing you are in big trouble, I imagine Austria could be the same though you *may* be able to do it if you work for a tour operator, check this.
The best option to get skiing time is become a rep (no qualifications needed) and do ski guiding for the clients, this is tolerated in France and you probably get better skiing this way and more free time too. To do almost any work abroad you need to be 18 (sometimes 19), stay at school and do this after you finish.
There are 'zero to hero' courses in Canada etc. run by UK companies (if you can afford it!) but I'm not sure what their reputation is like when you come to get a job abroad, you are also are up against people that have skied since age 3 and are not foreign.
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narc, your information is somewhat inaccurate, the Austrian entry level instructor qualification is one of the easiest "on mountain" qualifications around. They do take non-nationals, but there is a language element. It's pretty easy to get a job with an Austrian ski school with a low level qualification, I know loads who've done it. Whether or not you'll earn enough to live on at first is another matter! You're correct in that to teach in France you have to be ISTD or equivalent, or pass the test technique (timed slalom) to become a "stagiare" (a trainee) with a recognised training ski school. This test is very tough in itself.
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narc, I have actually looked at becoming a rep. I noticed the ski club of great britain were taking on more people and it did take my fancy when I had a look.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Ben3210, if you want to have a career in the ski industry I'd say the instructor route is better than being a rep. If your skiing is not quite up to instructor exams yet though it may be a good place to start off. However, I think a lot of companies wouldn't employ 18 year olds to do this job.
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Reping for the ski club of GB is a bit different to reping for a tour op but I cant advise you on that, someone will no doubt.
But here is my story...went to college for an A level equvilent, wasted two years and came out with nothing more than I went in with (4 GCSE's) then worked my ass off at MacDonalds for enough money to bum a season, which I did twice! I now own a flat, a car, got enough spare cash for enough beers and fags to keep me happy, I'm studying an Open Uni to better my job prospects for the future. I'm off out for another season this year (I've again had to save to cover my bills while away) after 7 years of living the working to pay the bills life with a weeks hol here and there and I'll be working as a night porter (work all night, board all day) for some beer money!
Ben only you know what you want to do, if you want to go away this season you NEED to be applying for jobs now! I actually think you'll find it hard to find work in a resort because of your age but if you dont try you wont know. So how about enrolling at college/6th form and applying for jobs abroad, if you get a job you can go or if you bottle it you can carry on you studies or you can try and find work here, save as much cash as you can before the new year, then just turn up in a resort have a few months skiing everyday and come home when your money runs out!
You can always go to college in 12 months...I dont see why all your education has to be done in in a school/college/uni order. It did'nt work for me!
Carpe diem
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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The saving work for the summer to pay for a season over the winter assumes you have parents who will let you stay at home for free or very cheap!! As soon as I'd finished full time education my parents expected me to pay my own way, so that was never an option.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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beanie1, granted I did have a home with my parents for V. cheap but if Ben tells his parents he's going on to sixth form he'll have the same perks!
As I said I now have a morgage to cover (and I'll still be paying council tax, phone line, elec, water, etc) while I'm away this winter and the £50 a week wages wont cover it so I'm having to save now!
Just for the record I'm a Park keeper for the local council on little over £1000 a month and I've had to save up this summer to do it! If Ben worked at MacDonalds, got all the overtime he could and paid a 1/4 of my monthly outgoing to his parents he'd easily have enough money for a couple of months in the mountains at least!
As I said 'Carpe diem'!
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I think expecting to work abroad at 16 is unrealistic. Stay in school - organise some trips ( I organised group trips both in Lower and Upper sixth) then apply when you have finished college.
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You know it makes sense.
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Nadenoodlee, tsk, the voice of reason. What are you doing on here? 
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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In Austria (Arlberg) you could try this
http://www.skiakademie.at/
Regarding the job situation.
This season I expect there to be a serious cut back on foreign workers (even if they are from the EU) . Austria & France all have escalating unemployment, therefore locals/nationals will be first in line for the vacancies even if they not experienced or that qualified.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Mon 3-08-09 18:33; edited 1 time in total
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Poster: A snowHead
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Lizzard, i remember how desperate I was to get out of the UK from the age of 16 - I read every book I could find on working abroad and ways to do it and then off I went 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Hi Ben! You give no indication of what standard of skier you are at the moment, but I'd suggest that with only 6 weeks on snow and 1.5hrs per month you are going to struggle to get to the standard required to progress far along the instructing route.
There are two things you need to do: firstly, get one of the senior guys (prefereably one who is a BASI trainer - I'd be surprised if there isn't one) at Chill Factore to look at your skiing and tell you what you need to work on.
Secondly you need to get a lot more skiing in - and not just doing your own thing, but working with a coach on a regular (at least weekly) programme to expand your range of ski skills and improve your overall technique. Best way would be to join one of the regular clubs which coach at CF every week and commit the time (and money) to improving your skiing.
Then, once you've spent two more years improving both your skiing and your education, you'll have a far better chance of becoming a full-time instructor wherever in the world you decide.
An alternative to CF (and much cheaper) would be to do the same at one of the dry slopes in the area: I know Pendle has an extremely active (race) club, whilst the Rossendale club (I think there is only Ski Art) is more free-style oriented.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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ChrisWo, Ben said he can't cook. And if he's good at cleaning, especially ovens, he's not like the 16 year old lads I know.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Ben,
Working in a ski resort - forget it until you are 18. Tour Ops don't want the responsibility of employing anyone where they would be in loco parentis (think that's spelt correctly).
Do read around the natives.co.uk site BEFORE asking any questions (we get fed up of people just going on the forums asking along the lines of "How do I get a job in a ski resort?").
For your 1st season keep your expectations low - better to be working out there as a dishpig than hanging on in the UK in the hope of a rep position. And don't expect to have any say in which resort you'd be in - if you do get a choice, consider it a bonus.
Always keep trying - many people drop out just before the start of the season, more are sacked/injured/homesick by New Year.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Not sure I'm in a position to make a suggestion, but I can certainly make some anti-suggestions.
I don't believe that there's any point in trying to persuade somebody who's presumably not interested in academic work that there's any point in doing A levels. On the other hand, given the reasonable quality of his written English I wonder whether he should.
Unless he is committed to working and getting 3 grade Cs at least, I personally think A levels are a complete waste of time. Finding a vocational course would be a much better idea. I find it difficult to believe that an AS in sport (as suggested above) is worth the paper it's written on.
A degree in sport science from a former polytechnic, on the back of two Es at A level, creating £30k of debt over 3 years is a complete, utter, shameful insult to the individual.
Go camp in Glencoe for a season? That'll cost £175 for the season.
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a sports national diploma could be an alternative to AS/A levels particularly if you are not academic, you can still go on to university to study sports science after this course, its just a different route and suits some people better.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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crazy_skier_jules, given that season contracts only last five months, you could always do both.
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FAQ
sorry Do finish School first if everything else goes bad you will at least have this to fall back on (Sorry I've not come through the UK education system so was not claer as thwhere you were). Maybe use the summer holidays to start working on your Instructor qualifications.
