 Poster: A snowHead
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I'm not really looking for touring boots, but on my last few of trips I've found myself walking up the hills more often than before.
I've currently got a pair of the old translucent yellow Sally X10's with zipfit liners and a booster strap worn under the front cuff, these mods make them a bit stiffer than standard and they feel OK to me - even Warren Smith hasn't hacked bits off them in search of ankle flex 
However, a couple of years ago I had the soles ground as part of an alignment job. This left them with a toe and heel insert that is totally flat. They're even skiddy when walking on the flat - never mind when trying to haul my sweating bod over a couple of steep steps. This lead to a "fun" moment last week, I can tell you!
I've noticed that F*ckwork Chamonix show the Garmont Shaman as an alpine boot, and it has what appears to be a pretty good vibram sole. But are there any other contenders?
Cheers
Marc
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Lange Banshe, we have vibram units that will fit any modified plug shell, so not too much of a problem there
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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the sole units from a banshee as SMALLZOOKEEPER can be modified to fit most boots....... depends on the thickness of the plates tat were put on for the canting work.... atomic race plates also have a little more grip than the average
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I'll check this evening, but I think the plates are only 2/3mm thick. Is that good or bad?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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my Atomic M90s have good grippy soles on them. Even the bit between the forefoot and heel has grips on it. I'm pretty sure the newer Hawx have a grip on them too.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Mosha Marc, there's not a lot of thickness available to rout back on the X wave, the lange plates are probably 6-7mm, an atomic 3mm plate may be a compromise in that it is not slick
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JT, the sole pads on the banshee are a din sole, then just have some vibram grip sections on them, making them a good half way option, there is a flat section for binding release
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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The lange are 7mm and really can only be put on the Plug boots due to the construction of the Binding Lugs.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Or just stick a lightweight crampon in the sack.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Scarpa wrote: |
| Or just stick a lightweight crampon in the sack. |
Good plan. Any recommendations?
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CEM, they measure 4mm as it happens, but I don't know if that helps.
Scarpa I hear what you say, but how long does it take to get them on?
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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spyderjon, grivel G12 is the answer to all crampon questions. What was the question?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Mosha Marc, comprex, I have old Grivel 2Fs, I reckon my CM mono points might be a touch of overkill 
They clip in almost the same as ski bindings but you have to force the rear lever up then wrap a strap round. Takes a few seconds for each foot. Great on ice, snow, rocks etc. And a damn site better on neve... you can front point instead of kicking steps.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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comprex, Nope.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Looking at the Vibram site, it seems they do supply to Rossignol as well, so is the shortlist; Banshee, Shaman and B-Squad? Any opinions on these three and how they compare against each other?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Mosha Marc,
Suck up and get rid of those yellow things they call boots
You're 30 mins from Chamonix...
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Mosha Marc, I had a look at the Grivel G12 crampons in S&R today & I think that Scarpa has the best solution. The soles on my Atomic's are well treaded, including the bit between the toe & heel pieces, but they easily become clogged with snow effectively making them smooth. Vibram is softer so maybe it works better in this respect(?) but all the touring boot guys tend to have crampons as well so why not straight to crampons?
Or, for a cheapskate solution , what about just using Cat-Tracks? Dirt cheap so worth a try.
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| spyderjon wrote: |
| Mosha Marc, I had a look at the Grivel G12 crampons in S&R today & I think that Scarpa has the best solution. The soles on my Atomic's are well treaded, including the bit between the toe & heel pieces, but they easily become clogged with snow effectively making them smooth. Vibram is softer so maybe it works better in this respect(?) |
A tread filled with snow has more traction in snow than a plastic tread of any shape. The snow filling the treads forms cohesive bonds to outside snow under downward pressure, the cohesion resists lateral or rearward shearing when the other foot steps. The only reason car tyres don't use this principle is because any given contact patch is not on the ground long enough, and the cohesion would only make for extra rolling resistance loss.
Other than the risk of cutting oneself or ones' trousers (and chillier feet) nothing wrong with having crampons. Don't forget the anti-clumping plates.
I really wish Black Diamond would bring back the old Attack Pack, with the axe slots and crampon slot right there on the outside.
Cat Tracks are nylon and tend to get rigid, inflexible, and rather lacking for traction in really cold snow. The lug cover bits snap and get torn esp. if you try to front-kick steps. They are really for hard surface.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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comprex, Cat Tracks are not nylon.
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rjs, you are correct. Urethane.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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comprex, Spot on... anti ball plates are a must when walking in soft snow. If you have a pie-cutter frame (like the 2Fs) they will ball up very quickly.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| comprex wrote: |
| ......A tread filled with snow has more traction in snow than a plastic tread of any shape. The snow filling the treads forms cohesive bonds to outside snow under downward pressure, the cohesion resists lateral or rearward shearing when the other foot steps.... |
Thanks for that. Good to hear that I should be ok on my Atomics then. Mind you, I don't really do walking.
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spyderjon, stick a brush or scraper on your pole for when you want to click back in.
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You know it makes sense.
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spyderjon, unless considering ice and technical mixed climbing as well, you may be better off with something like the G10 - lighter and less chance of tripping due to slighter shorter front points which given the general clumsiness of ski boots will make life easier.
For all things crampon, this gives a good overview: http://www.needlesports.com/acatalog/Mail_Order_Crampons_32.html
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Do the crampomatic ones fit the front of alpine boots?
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Poster: A snowHead
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Mosha Marc, I don't know but they are not recommended for ski touring if that is any help plus you might struggle to find people stocking the Cramp-O-Matic. The New-Matic are easy to use even with thickish gloves after a bit of practise and stay put without adjustments once on. The up size is that the G10 are also a good choice with stiff walking boots (B1/B2) so great for winter hill walking and mountaineering here in the UK between ski trips.
Check out the crampon section here http://www.grivel.com/ for recommended applications
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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spyderjon, I saw that too. Not too sure how badly it effects the release of a normal alpine binding though.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Glad to see he was wearing a helmet for some of the more dangerous phases of his project!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Mosha Marc wrote: |
| spyderjon, I saw that too. Not too sure how badly it effects the release of a normal alpine binding though. |
They reckon none providing you have a sliding AFD, which sounds logical to me. The din's easily checked/adjusted if you have a torque testing machine
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