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Vredestein Wintrac

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I dont know if this is the correct forum, so forgive me if not.

I am having a discussion with my friendly tyre fitter about what tyres I need on my VW Passat. Having mentioned that I will be driving to the Alps once a year, he recommended Vredestein Wintrac tyres. I will not be having 2 separate sets of tyres for summer and winter. The tyre fitter said these would be OK to use in the summer also.
Does anyone have any opinions on the effectiveness of these in the snow, and also using these as an all year tyre.

Steve.

p.s. 205/55/ R16 91 @ £86 each all in fitted.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
ringingmaster, bargain price!
I had Vredstein's but they do noticeably wear quicker and on my car were noticeably noisier, so I only had them on in winter, absolutlley brilliant on English muddy slippy damp wet roads! On snow and ice no noticeable difference to tarmac, absolutly reccomended:-D
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Used then on my mercedes, eventually all year. Brilliant tyres, howver in summer not quite the planted feeling of the conti summer tyres i had. Merc was well insulated so not much more noise. They got us everywhere in the alps etc for 6 years and never used the chains. (used 2 sets they do wear in summer)
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I have just had a set of Wintrac Extremes delivered and am wondering whether to have them put on the existing wheels, keeping the present M+S Dunlops with 4mm tread for summer, or get another set of wheels to save faffing around having tyres changed every 6 months. I try to minimise summer mileage anyway (use small No 2 car for commuting and shopping) so would it be worth just leaving the Wintracs on for summer? What sort of mileage have you guys obtained ?

(225/60 R18 were £570 for 4 mail order Sad )
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Yoda, thats towards the price I paid Confused
I had mine for two sesons and then flogged em on e bay for £250. Very Happy
Obviously taking the tyres on and off rims does damage the rims and the tyres slightly each time, therefore I think a seperate set of wheels is preferable.
As I only have the car for 3 years (business lease) I'm relying on chains now as there was a cost and the hasle factor of the winter tyres. If I wasn't changing so regularly I would deffo have two sets of tyres.
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Yoda, Got about 12k on them, but we did use them driving through france one summer (with the car very loaded) at over 30 degrees, they didn't like it at all. Sold the car with the next set on at about 7k and they looked virtually new. They were amazing in the snow/ice and got my old merc to places it should have not got to! Much better than the avon ranger ice we have on the replacement subaru forester, they are very noisy, seem to go out of balance all the time. At the price yours cost i would get a second set of wheels and use summer tyres as the wintertracs did not wear very well when it was very hot, the rear tyres really suffered.
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Thanks Boredsurfing and carroz, I had a bad feeling a new set of wheels was going to be the answer Laughing Looking at minimum three alpine trips this winter so that will be about 6000 miles plus whatever I do here. Will be interesting to see how they wear.
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After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Yoda, Boredsurfing where did you buy your winter tyres from?
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I have Wintrac Extreme's on my spare Standard 17" BMW Wheels and used them from Dec till May last season.3 Trips to the French alps and a Scotland Trip from Cheltenham and they have 7mm Left on them still.So pretty good really but I dont know about using them all year round,You may shread them if you do alot of motorway miles.Paid £450 for mine fitted bought from

http://www.thmc.co.uk/

Regards Mark
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I paid £400 for mine fully fitted they are 215/60 R16's They arrived at the local garage yesterday and are yet to be fitted....

got them from mytyres.co.uk they had 33 winter tyres in my size to choose from


Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads on Sat 15-11-08 19:38; edited 1 time in total
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rob@rar wrote:
Yoda, Boredsurfing where did you buy your winter tyres from?


rob, I got mine from micheldever tyres just off the M3/A303 http://www.micheldever.co.uk/ plus theres a nice pub in the village for lunch Toofy Grin
(They were out of stock and ordered in)
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
ringingmaster, In that size and 91 load, they're only made in Run Flat and might not be compatible with your rims. Are you sure they're Wintrac and not Snowtrac? If they're Snowtrac, you should be paying about £80 each all in.
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rob@rar, from mytyres.co.uk
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Yoda wrote:
rob@rar, from mytyres.co.uk

Me too, several times. Went for GT Radial and they're fantastic. Very Happy
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I've got a quote from mytyres and the cheapest they do for my size (235/45 R18) is £200+ per tyre, just for supply only. I was hoping to pay a little bit less than that.

I have a set of winter tyres from a previous car which are currently unused. They are not the right size for my current car but I was wondering if I got a new set of steel rims to fit the old tyres would it be possible to use them with my current car? I'd need to double check but I don't think the old tyres are significantly different - something like 245/40 R17 IIRC.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
rob@rar, the price of the Wintracs I bought was actually about £15 less per tyre than the cost of replacing with the "standard" M+S's that come with the car, which rather surprised me. I don't know the answer to your question but it would not really be an option for me as my chains would not then fit (hoping I won't need them but you never know). I bought those last year to fit the standard tyres. Actually the standard M+S tyres on my previous car (also hairdresser's 4x4) got us up to Tignes in a blizzard with no problem (waved through the chainage area by the gendarmes) but I got to thinking about the going down bits, braking distances on dodgy roads etc and have decided to go the whole hog this year having experienced winter tyres on a hire car.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Is the Vredestein Wintrac a current model? (the QUATRAC appears to be the current model) If not check the date of manufacture as tyres typically hve a 4 to 5 year shelf life.
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rob@rar, You're old tyres are 2.7% smaller than your near ones, so negligible difference in terms of rolling circumference, only a 10mm difference in radius. Speedo will be slightly out. The main thing to check is with regard to the Rims rather than the tyres. Is the offset the same? Is 17" big enough to clear the Brakes, etc? If there are other models within the range, maybe at different trim levels that have smaller diameter rims, the last point shouldn't be an issue.
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DB wrote:
Is the Vredestein Wintrac a current model? (the QUATRAC appears to be the current model) If not check the date of manufacture as tyres typically hve a 4 to 5 year shelf life.


The Wintrac Xtreme is current. http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandgroepen.asp?UsersessionID=55873835&BandgroepID=2
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Spyderman wrote:
If there are other models within the range, maybe at different trim levels that have smaller diameter rims, the last point shouldn't be an issue.

That's a good point. Yes, there are models below mine with a 17 inch rim rather than the 18 inch that I have.
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rob@rar wrote:
Spyderman wrote:
If there are other models within the range, maybe at different trim levels that have smaller diameter rims, the last point shouldn't be an issue.

That's a good point. Yes, there are models below mine with a 17 inch rim rather than the 18 inch that I have.

Just as long as the offset is OK and your model doesn't have uprated bigger brakes or trick suspension, you should be fine.
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Spyderman wrote:
DB wrote:
Is the Vredestein Wintrac a current model? (the QUATRAC appears to be the current model) If not check the date of manufacture as tyres typically hve a 4 to 5 year shelf life.


The Wintrac Xtreme is current. http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandgroepen.asp?UsersessionID=55873835&BandgroepID=2


I see that it is now, the first search I did on google was coming back with tests from 2000-2001.

Last year the ÖAMTC (Austrian AA) tested the the wintrac 4 exreme against other similar tyres. The "Continental CrossContact Winter" and "Michelin Latitude Alpin" also received good marks

http://www.oeamtc.at/refresh/frameset.php?p=http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_seiten/reifentests/winter2007/SUV/uebersicht.htm

The continental was best in the wet, the Michelin had the best wear rate. The Vredestein performed well but wore out quicker than almost every other tyre in the test.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Well the Wintracs are fitted, all I need now is some snow Laughing

Whilst sorting out the new wheels I was somewhat shocked to find that the list price of a replacement set of my "standard" wheels is £1800 Shocked

However, a set of genuine Honda "accessory" alloys in the same size came to £650 (with customer discount), which seemed a reasonable deal when I checked a few "third party" supplier sites. These have a different number of spokes to the "standard" alloys but look perfectly acceptable to me.

Is that "standard" replacement price some sort of insurance rip-off scam for those who have wheels nicked or damaged, or what?
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Yoda, I doubt if the Dealer is paying more than £50 each. Cost to Honda more like £20 each.
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I've just ordered a set of Wintrac Extreme XL. They were the only tyres that I could get in my size at the moment. £538 delivered, plus local fitting charge. Will try to find a reasonably priced set of rims for next winter. Need to sell my old winter tyres now - is there much of a secondhand market for winter tyres?
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Dealer prices ar daylight robbery. We got a couple of 'extras' for our Nissan direct from the factory at a bargain price compared to the dealer.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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rob@rar, I got £250 for my vredsteins on E bay when I changed cars.
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 So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Spyderman, hmm well aluminium is around 2000$ per tonne at the mo so if a wheel weighs in at (guesstimate) 10kg that's about 20$ just for the aluminium base metal + whatever other things go into the alloy. Then there's forging/casting, machining, finishing whatever. Can't see them doing it for £20 Puzzled
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Put them to use today...

Drove 160miles to Inverness and back.... Temp ranged from +4 to -2.... worst conditions were a 1/2" of fresh wet snow and passed a car that had crashed into the crash barrier - car was a right off (10mins earlier I recon... they were out the car and people were helping them).

Coming back in the dark when it was -2C had to brake hard and swerve to avoid 3 deer on the road ....

All done without any problems at all Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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Yoda, More like 7KG for an Alloy wheel. £20 was a guess, but I bet it's not far off, given their buying power.
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Boredsurfing wrote:
rob@rar wrote:
Yoda, Boredsurfing where did you buy your winter tyres from?


rob, I got mine from micheldever tyres just off the M3/A303 http://www.micheldever.co.uk/ plus theres a nice pub in the village for lunch Toofy Grin
(They were out of stock and ordered in)


Interesting...

I ordered some 'snow tyres' from Micheldever last week, and based largely on this thread went for the Vredsteins, and asked for the snowtrac. They've actually fitted the Quatrac 2, which would appear to be an all-season tyre. It does have the M&S designation however.

Will that be good enough or should I go and complain?
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bertie bassett wrote:
Interesting...

I ordered some 'snow tyres' from Micheldever last week, and based largely on this thread went for the Vredsteins, and asked for the snowtrac. They've actually fitted the Quatrac 2, which would appear to be an all-season tyre. It does have the M&S designation however.

Will that be good enough or should I go and complain?

Did you ask for winter tyres generally, or the Snowtrac specifically? I wouldn't be happy with the Quadtrac tyre if I wanted a winter tyre specifically for snow performance. Vredstein's own website damns the Quadtrac with faint praise ("adequate winter tyre"). If your place in Micheldever can't get hold of winter tyres for you try some online dealers such as tyremen.co.uk or mytyres.co.uk
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
rob@rar wrote:
bertie bassett wrote:
Interesting...

I ordered some 'snow tyres' from Micheldever last week, and based largely on this thread went for the Vredsteins, and asked for the snowtrac. They've actually fitted the Quatrac 2, which would appear to be an all-season tyre. It does have the M&S designation however.

Will that be good enough or should I go and complain?

Did you ask for winter tyres generally, or the Snowtrac specifically? I wouldn't be happy with the Quadtrac tyre if I wanted a winter tyre specifically for snow performance. Vredstein's own website damns the Quadtrac with faint praise ("adequate winter tyre"). If your place in Micheldever can't get hold of winter tyres for you try some online dealers such as tyremen.co.uk or mytyres.co.uk


I definitely asked for the snowtrac specifically!!

Ok I am going to get annoyed now...
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bertie bassett,

The word "snow tyres" can be confusing as to me and others it means tyres designed just for snow whereas "winter tyres" are designed for winter conditions. The two terms are often interchanged esp by the Americans. It's best to use the term "winter tyres" when seeking a tyre to drive to the alps from the UK.

You have all season tyres not winter tyres here is a comparison of the two tyres in german (scroll down for results, the lower the score the better the performance).

http://www.oeamtc.at/refresh/frameset.php?p=http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_seiten/reifentests/winter2006/185_60_14/uebersicht.htm

There isn't a massive difference between the two but the Snowtrac 2 is the slighty better tyre during winter conditions. According to this link http://www.vredestein.com/File_Banden/2006/Testen/DUITS-TESTLEAFLET%20QUATRAC%202.pdf?UserSessionID=96414912 the Quatrac 2 has a 'snowflake in a mountain' symbol so they will be accepted as winter tyres.
IMHO if your tyres have this symbol then it's not worth complaning, I doubt you would get very far and you wouldn't gain a lot. The all season tyre probably performs better over the range of use a 'UK resident who drives to the alps' would have anyway.
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bertie bassett, Complaining time for sure.
Quadtrac is neither a good summer tyre or a good winter tyre. 'Adequate' at both? I wouldn't want it.
More importantly, it's not what you ordered.
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bertie bassett wrote:
I definitely asked for the snowtrac specifically!!

Snowtrac or WinTrac (which might be a bit more capable at higher speeds, eg the drive to/from the Tarentaise).
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rob@rar, Looks like Wintrac Xtreme has about the same winter capabilities as Snowtrac 2, but better at higher speeds.
http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandgroepen.asp?BandgroepID=2&BandtypeID=7&UsersessionID=68579829
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rob@rar wrote:
bertie bassett wrote:
I definitely asked for the snowtrac specifically!!

Snowtrac or WinTrac (which might be a bit more capable at higher speeds, eg the drive to/from the Tarentaise).


Maybe it's a sizing issue... having now dug through the Vredestein website I can't seem to find anything better than what they've fitted for 195 / 65 R15s

It's even more complicated than buying ski-poles wink
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bertie bassett,

Here are the ÖAMTC (Austrian AA equiv.) 2008 results for 195 / 65 R15s

http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/download/document/auto/WR08_195_65.pdf

If it's a winter tyre you are after (i.e. you will be running summer tyres during the summer) then one of the 4 top left tyres give the best performance.


Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Thu 11-12-08 8:40; edited 1 time in total
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bertie bassett, Snowtrac 2 is made in 195/65R15
http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandtypes.asp?BandgroepID=2&BandtoepassingID=0&BandtypeID=10&PageID=2&Rimsize=15&UserSessionID=24723017

As is Snowtrac 3
http://www.vredestein.com/Banden_Bandtypes.asp?BandgroepID=2&BandtoepassingID=0&BandtypeID=68&PageID=2&Rimsize=15&UserSessionID=24723017


Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads on Thu 11-12-08 8:33; edited 1 time in total
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