 Poster: A snowHead
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I've just got off the phone having decided to double check the cover for race training with a particular company who's definition of Winter Sports, as copied 10 seconds ago from their web site is:
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Winter sports - big foot skiing, cat skiing, cross country skiing, curling, glacier walking, glacier skiing, heli-skiing,
husky dog sledding (organised and non-competitive with an experienced local driver), ice diving (with a qualified
instructor at all times), ice hockey, ice skating, mono skiing, Nordic skiing, off-piste skiing and snow boarding,
parapenting (with a qualified instructor at all times), skiing, ski biking, ski-boarding, ski-doos*, ski-joering
(non-competive), ski racing (non FIS), ski touring, sledging, snow biking, snow blading, snow boarding, |
You will note that it clearly says ski racing (non FIS) is included.
Here's the thing. Having heard a few of the guys here use them, I decided to try again for a quote for my seasonal insurance. I then double checked about the race training (I have an email from the same outfit saying it's NOT covered).
After much double checking by the call centre guy with his supervisor the answer came back NO NOT COVERED. To cut a long story shot they suggest that it's to cover end of week ski school races. The phone guy said also that his supervisor thought that Ski Racing is different to Race Training.
He also said (although they did change their minds a few times) that Ski Instructors are not covered at all. God know how they manage that if it's true.
rob@rar, skimottaret, GrahamN, beanie1 you may want to give your insurer a call.
 Slightly Miffed
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| david@mediacopy wrote: |
| He also said (although they did change their minds a few times) that Ski Instructors are not covered at all. |
Presumably that's when they are teaching in a professional (ie being paid) sense?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks for posting this... so a week with say snoworks wont be covered? yikes 
In a similar vein I also quizzed them on the phone last season about BASI courses and was told then that as long as they are less than 14 days you are covered, not so sure now...
david@mediacopy, when you are teaching abroad who do you recommend to use for an insurer? If say you do a week with interski and you get hurt i wonder what would happen. Might be a good idea to do a thread on Insurance for Instructors
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david@mediacopy, happy birthday by the way. Is this DT? I'm with them on their worldwide Premier Plus policy and I thought (too) that say I did a week's race training with Snoworks say, or any BASI courses, (well at my level anyway) I thought that I would be covered, although I probably would have done the Carre Neige like rob@rar says he does as well as an "extra".
So.....yes, I think we need an Insurance for Instructors thread like skimottaret says. It would definitely be useful.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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skimottaret, With Interski you are covered on their insurance (fogg) for medical stuff, and I assume professional, under their employers liability insurance stuff.
When I've needed to get cover while teaching I've used SnowCard who seem excellent. I've just discovered and had confirmed that Ski Club will cover instructors while working too as they (or their underwriters) don't see it being a greater risk, which is cool. They also cover multiple return trips home on their season policy too which for this season is the decider too. Their racing definition seems clear enough (although the instance above did) but I've just dropped an email over to double check it covers race training. As long as I get a sensible answer back that will do it for me.
I'd probably stick with SnowCard for multi trip stuff (maybe) but the ski club does look slightly better value.
rob@rar, Maybe, but hard to say. they were not especially clear on the subject and changed their minds during the conversation. I think that you probably will be covered as long as you are not teaching, which is fair enough, but given the conversation I'd not bet my house on it.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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VolklAttivaS5, Cheers 
Are you fully recovered ? And have you been back on a board yet ?
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Another insurer to consider could be Click4quote. There is an advert on page 2 of the latest SSE magazine. I used them for a couple of seasons.
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david@mediacopy, pretty sure my insurance also states - "ski instructor courses of less than 2 weeks in duration" so don't see how they can claim instructors are not covered. What he may have meant is if you are working as an instructor at the time, which i could understand.
The ts & cs seem catergorically clear to me, and will have been written by lawyers not a call centre supervisor. If they were ever to kick up a stink I'd get my lawyer on the case (family member so no cost to me).
Thanks for the note though!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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rob@rar, do you go for the Carre Neige everytime you ski as well as your DT policy? Or just on the race training weeks in case you have a nasty crash?
I've only done Carre Neige once as only been offered it once too, last year in Tignes when I just had a naff cheapie annual travel insurance policy with winter sports cover then just for the basics and I had only been skiing 3 weeks then anyway, so.....didn't know much about Carre Neige and this, that, and the other then so, for the cost over 6 days I thought I might as well.
Now I've got a "proper" quality policy with DT, could you tell me why you go for the Carre Neige as well? I will probably do that as well as I said, but would be interested in your reasons why you do it.
david@mediacopy, aye yes, all sorted thanks. Not been back on a board though-I will be back on one first week of Dec here and there. I will let you know how I get on. I will take it to some nice gentle runs and just start over and practice. Just had my braces off today! Feels very strange but I'm very pleased I had them done. Only had it on 11 months so quite amazed at the difference in that time. 
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beanie1, quite. I'm incredibly surprised about this, and it seems a clear case of misrepresentation to me. As they are specific about non-FIS, that implies that they understand about different levels of racing, and the training involved.
I was also talking to them yesterday about coverage for ski-touring (covered) and ski-mountaineering (non covered), yet glacier hiking and abseiling is covered automatically, and you can get cover for rock-climbing (up to HVS level) with an additional premium of £28. They seemed very clued up and checked with an underwriter before giving an answer, which was to agree that this was a grey area, but give them details of the route and expected terrain and they'd get back with a decision on a case by case basis on which side of the line the expected jaunt lay. That I have to say is probably pretty fair.
I'm still staggered about the view on race training - as I (and skimottaret) specifically checked on that before taking the insurance out. And yes it does explicitly say Ski Instructor COURSES are covered. Everything I've heard about them previous to this has made them sound a professional and straightforward outfit, but this rather queers their pitch in my eyes.
Last edited by Ski the Net with snowHeads  on Thu 13-11-08 20:51; edited 1 time in total
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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VolklAttivaS5, the carre neige and carte neige has been covered a few times do a search but the short answer is that it gets you off the hill, to hospital and to home with zero paperwork and without any hassle. I got meat wagoned off last year and they were brilliant. my UK travel policy never paid out for the medical bills though.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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skimottaret, ah ok, I will have a look on here then. Didn't know there were two!
Why didn't your policy pay the medical bills?
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GrahamN, david@mediacopy, when i spoke with them last year the guy i chatted to was very knowledgable about winter sports and had a complete grasp of the situation. (he asked if i was doing Eurotest training, had a FIS license etc. ) He was very clear on what was and wasnt covered. Perhaps they only have a few subject area specialists in the call centres and you just got the average Joe.???
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You know it makes sense.
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VolklAttivaS5, sorry long story and quite unique for variou reasons so i wont get into it here
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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skimottaret, ah ok fair enough.
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Poster: A snowHead
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rob@rar, it's ok re my question to you above-I have gleaned the information from another thread in Jan where you said you have Carte Neige, the annual one not the daily Carre Neige.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| rob@rar, do you go for the Carre Neige everytime you ski as well as your DT policy? |
I get the Carte Neige - the annual policy - not Carre Neige. Costs fifty-something euros IIRC. I normally get mine in the tourist office in Tignes which tends to be the first place I ski each season. They have all my details on the Carte Neige database so it's simple to process. If you get Carte Neige make sure you use your home address in the UK as that is where they will pay for you to be repatriated to if you have a bad accident.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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VolklAttivaS5, posts crossed.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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rob@rar, no worries. Thanks for that anyway. I'm just having a proper look into it now as I was unsure last time what was what. Thing is, when I go to Tignes soon for 3 weeks, the Carre Neige for 21 days say, will be 2,70 euro per day so that's 56,70 euro in total for Carre Neige. Better off having the annual Carte Neige then for 50 something euros.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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VolklAttivaS5, no, Carte Neige is a worldwide policy, although I doubt pisteurs in other countries would deal with it in the same way as French resorts.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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rob@rar, I was a bit confused so I took that bit out of my post presuming that it covered just French resorts. So the Carre Neige is French resorts only? And the Carte Neige covers all resorts? Even better if it is because for the annual cost of the Carte Neige I have a week in Meribel as well anyway and from what your saying it will cover me in Austria too later on this season?
Last edited by You'll need to Register first of course. on Thu 13-11-08 21:51; edited 1 time in total
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Sorry Rob,
Where would be the best place to buy the annual carte neige then in BSM or Les Arcs?
Sounds like a good idea to buy the annual one for this season..
Cheers
bb
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Ooh, actually the Carre Neige for 10-21 days is 27 euros it says on the Carre Neige PDF. Still better value to have the annual Carte Neige though. Pity the names are so similar, no wonder people get confused.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| bertie bassett wrote: |
Sorry Rob,
Where would be the best place to buy the annual carte neige then in BSM or Les Arcs?
Sounds like a good idea to buy the annual one for this season..
Cheers
bb |
Not sure about that. I've previously bought the Carte Neige from the Les Arcs Ski Race Club through a friend who is linked to them, but for the last few years I've skied pre-season in Tignes so it was easier to buy there. I suppose you could ask at the Tourist Office?
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Ooh, actually the Carre Neige for 10-21 days is 27 euros it says on the Carre Neige PDF. Still better value to have the annual Carte Neige though. Pity the names are so similar, no wonder people get confused. |
I'd guess that the lift pass office would just charge you the standard daily rate for the duration of whatever lift pass you buy.
If you're skiing in Tignes for three weeks is it cheaper for you to buy a season pass there?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
I'd guess that the lift pass office would just charge you the standard daily rate for the duration of whatever lift pass you buy.
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Hmmm. Yes probably. So if I turn up and ask for 20 days, they will probably charge me 2,70 euro for those 20 days or if I asked for a 6 day pass, then 2,70 euro per day for those 6 days, difficult to know for sure until I get there I suppose. I will nip down to the lift pass office on the first Saturday afternoon. Is there one in the Maison de Tignes Rob? Skiworld sorted out the last one for me, they will probably offer to do it again I expect as well but of course last time it was Carre Neige they arranged at the same time as the pass, not Carte Neige. I will have to arrange that myself.
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| If you're skiing in Tignes for three weeks is it cheaper for you to buy a season pass there? |
Do you mean a season ski pass or do you mean sort out the annual Carte Neige whilst in Tignes? I thought you had to get the Carte Neige in a resort anyway, I didn't think you could buy it online?
Re the ski pass, I don't know whether to buy a 20 day Espace Killy pass upfront, if I have an accident after 1 week I don't know if I'd be able to get the unused bit of the ski pass back or not......do you know the answer to that?
I did wonder if a EK season pass would be better value, one of them is 999 euro, a 20 day pass is going to be 458 euro as far as I can work out. But I probably wouldn't be back there that long this season to get the benefit of the full season pass so I will go for the 20 day pass.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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VolklAttivaS5, How are you calculating the 20 day pass ? I work it out at 417 euro.
Buy a 15 day pass, then ask for 2 and 1 day "prolongation" passes at 9 euro per day. The pricelist is here.
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That's what I did, I priced a 15 day pass (413 euro on the list I used below) then added (5 days x 9 euro). I used this price list from the Tignes website though http://www.tignes.net/GB_tarifs_0809.html and then click on the Adobe link down the bottom of the page entitled Tous les tarifs hiver 08.09 (63Kb).
Seems to be a different list to the one you linked me to. Do you know why it's showing as more on the Tignes website?
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You know it makes sense.
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VolklAttivaS5, You are not going there in Hiver, you are going there in Avant Saison.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Poster: A snowHead
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VolklAttivaS5, The extra section is there if you look at the French page.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Is there one in the Maison de Tignes |
I bought the Carte Neige in Maison de Tignes and the lift pass at the lift pass office. Hell will freeze over before I let a tour operator sort my lift pass out again.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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rob@rar, ok I will go down to the Maison then as it's a short walk from my accomodation. Thanks Rob.
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Hell will freeze over before I let a tour operator sort my lift pass out again.
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Why what happened? That was the first time I'd done it, (always got my own lift pass before direct from the lift pass office). I did mine through Skiworld last year because the rep came round on the bus from Geneva to sort them all out and I deliberately asked how much it was thinking they might add a bit on or something for them and I had checked how much the lift pass cost before I flew out. It was the same price and they sorted out the Carre Neige too so thought, well let them sort it out then. Besides they bring the passes up to the chalet on the Sat evening at dinner time so we had it for the course starting at 9.00 the next morning. Saved me going out and getting it. The only thing that was a pain is that they wouldn't accept Maestro for it, had to pay with Visa or Mastercard.
One thing I would never do again is get a lift pass online before going out to the resort. What a nightmare that was. I only did it because I wanted a 2 week pass and needed a photo for it, so thought better to organise it before. I didn't know they take your photo at the lift pass office-never again I will always go direct in future.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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VolklAttivaS5, it was a long time ago and was the final cockup that saw me go DIY rather than TO. I got stiffed on the exchange rate they used to buy the pass on my credit card, and despite the 'guarantee' that the pass would be at our hotel by 8.30am it didn't turn up until nearly 10am. The rep, from Skiworld IIRC, was still pi$$ed as far as I could tell. A complaint to the resort manager elicited a shrug of the shoulders.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| VolklAttivaS5 wrote: |
| Where's the lift pass office in Le Lac then? |
The one I use if I'm in Le Lac is at Maison de Tignes. It's an outside window on the snowfront facing the Aeroski lift.
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Actually what I can do, is nip over to VC on the bus and get both the pass and the Carte Neige from the STGM office.
Anyway, cheers for your help I have gone off the topic of the thread. Again. I do that a lot.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Oops posts crossed.
Ah cool, I can do both in Le Lac then, save that bus!
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GrahamN, I'm annoyed enough to report them to whatever insurance ombudsman (or whatever) as it clearly seems to be mis-selling.
Perhaps one thing to bear in mind is that I spoke to them at around 6pm or so, so maybe the calls were being handled by a different team. The guy I spoke to said racing is not covered as his first response, and I then had to draw his attention to the Winter Sports definition on their web site, and cue lots of twoing and throwing between him and the supervisor . . . However in the end the guy was quite specific about racing / race training (and that they are different).
At the end of the conversation I suggested that if what he said IS the case then they should be contacting everyone who holds a Winter Sports policy and explain the position with race training as their description is clearly mis-leading.
To be honest I've had this sort of discussion with this company before and their standard response seems to be "the computer says no".
beanie1, The T&Cs do seem very clear, hence my post. The reason I made the call was that I'd already had an email from them explicitly saying that race training isn't covered, but at the same time reading here that loads of you guys use them. This prompted me to visit the site and check the definitions on their web site and it seemed clear that racing is covered.
The problem with insurance is that when you REALLY need it, you need it badly, and it has to work.
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FAQ
Anyway, thanks for that. 
