 Poster: A snowHead
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How important is the language ability (and native language) of your ski instructor?
Does it depend on your learning style? i.e. if you are not a visual learner, or prefer to be told how to do something, rather than shown how to do something, you need an instructor to teach you in their native language.
I found when I went to LDA in summer, that I understood the French instructions better than the English instructions (French instructors, both spoke good English - should be an acceptable standard). The difference seemed to be that the instructors could explain what you should DO in English and in French (training I'd imagine) but only really explained what you should be FEELING in French. I really needed the FEELING explanation to be happy I'd done what I was supposed to do right.
My French is near native speaking standard - I spent a year at a French University, with all lectures in French with the French 1st and 2nd year students. I have also been coached to a high level in my main sport in French, so am used to taking instructions in French. Therefore I was fine with having a French instructor and instructions in French. I suspect I'd've had more trouble if I'd've had to rely solely on instruction given in English by a French instructor.
I'm not a particularly visual learner - I learn better when something is explained to me in detail. Then I can see what I'm looking for in a demonstration and try it for myself. If I just have to watch and do, I get very confused... My OH is a much better visual learner, so he had no trouble learning to snowboard with a French instructor teaching in English (and managed to get to the ESF "2nd degre" award in 1 week of summer skiing), so I doubt he was handicapped in any way by the instructor being French and not a native level English speaker.
I would prefer to learn in French if I'm in France - I prefer to be able to use my French as much as possible if on holiday in France. But for people who aren't 100% happy learning in a foreign language, is it really important to have an English instructor if you want to learn in English.
On a related note, would I be able to ask to be in a French speaking group with ESF, given that I am English (and will be booking last minute, probably through a tour operator...)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I think for adults, and in particular those who like explanation learning with a native speaker is important. That is why so many people will rave about great instruction from British instructors following less good instruction from French / Swiss instructors etc. It is not (always) the instructors being better, just that the nataive language makes such a difference.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| beanie1 wrote: |
| I think for adults, and in particular those who like explanation learning with a native speaker is important. |
I've yet to have a lesson with a native English speaker - maybe that explains my skiing. My beginner lessons, with a large and mostly French-speaking group, weren't ideal, but the best sessions I've had so far were with a Swiss instructor with limited English who could somehow always manage to get his point across. Admittedly, quite a lot of the time his point was "No snowplough! More parallel!".
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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If someone is a natural athlete it's not such a problem, but for some it can take a number of attempts to explain how to do, say snowplough for example. A native (or pretty much fluent) speaker is more likely to be able to explain how to do something in 2 or 3 different ways.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I think the issue regarding learning styles is an interesting one. If you learn primarily through auditory means, then I'd say that having a native speaker was the most important thing. Indeed for some, the quality of the explanation would be far more important than if the instructor could actually ski!
However if you are a visual learner then the level of technique of the instructor would be the important statistic. It could be almost irrelevent if tehy spoke your language or not.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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As Beanie1 said, the ability to explain in more than 1 way can be crucial - everyone will have different previous experiences to draw on.
I only thought of the question as I am aware that I am such a bad visual learner. I've been reading the instructor threads, and wondering why people didn't really like the ESF. I really liked them, but then thinking about it, I did rely on the French instructions, and would often ask questions in French - fortunately I was in a mixed group.
It seems that a lot of the people who have real trouble with group lessons (or have difficulties with gaining sufficient confidence to progress) are more analytical, and often female.
The male/female divide could be learning style based - or could be that men are more likely (in general) to have a gung-ho attitude and more confidence to just get on and do things, while women are more likely to want to get things right, and fully understand them before they have confidence in their abilities.
Obviously this is a massive generalisation, but it seems to apply in Horse Riding and Fencing as well as skiing.
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I've had skiing lessons for the last two one week holidays with a ski instructor who spoke German and only had literally a few words in English. I also had only had literally a minimal smattering of German. On that basis I think the amount he taught me has been amazing. He even knew I was coming the second year and actually did some evening classes in English to help a little more, but I think he taught me by demonstration and obvious encouragement. As well as learning 'look in my eyes' to stop me looking at the deck. You don't need to be fluent in each others language for understanding to take place. My kids playing with my Swiss friends children are testament to that.
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Have had around 50 lessons/coaching a year for around 10 years... My preferred learning style is thinker/feeler.
Instructors vary from native australians to canadians(english speaking) to canadian (french speaking) to swiss, austrian, italian, american, german.
I find a really good instructor/coach finds a way to get through even if not fluent in the language. The Italian coach I liek to ski with uses a lot of hand signals and demos to get messages across. His english is fine but he does not have the command of technical language he would like to explain technical concepts to me. We spend a lot of lift rides working on what the words are etc. I would still rather have a lesson with him than a native english speaker without his understanding of skiing.
Perfect would be someone with my native language(including english variant) and HIS training, experience and understanding. Reality is there are not that many aussies close to his level of skiing let alone technical understanding (he is an italian national coach).
I also enjoy skiing with native australian speaking coaches. The basis of my ski learning comes from them. The mix of backgrounds and perspectives is part of the learning process.
I'd never write an instructor off as a possible learning experience because of their native language - that is far too narrow a view of the learning process.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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On my first ever skiing trip, to Cervinia, I was taught by an Italian who had about 7 words of English, and I think I struggled as a result. It was all too much 'look at what I do and follow me' style. On the last day of the week he couldn't run our lesson and we had a different guy with perfect English, and the difference was remarkable, because he was able to explain why he was getting us to do certain things etc.
So for me I think being able to speak the same language is very important - unfortunately I just don't seem to learn otherwise. (My English-speaking instructors from LDA last year would probably argue that I was still crap when they were explaining everything to me in English!) 
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jonm, 7 words may be not quite enough. 
I have however seen a very good beginners lesson(much better than average) given by a japanese instructor who spoke some english but not great and struggled to understand most conversations that were not slow or that used any large words. With a smallish vocabulary she had learnt how to communicate very well using signs and only a few words. (I skied with her husband long after watching her teach - and we had a couple of BBQ dinners together so I know quite well how good her english is - and it is not very good)
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I have a friend who's instructed in Japan. She learnt a few words of Japanese - stop, follow me, slo etc. Otherwise it was a case of demonstrating. They were kids, and she did have classes of 30 to 40 people, so even if she could speak Japanese it may not have made much difference!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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30 to 40???????
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skimottaret, absolutely!!! Huge long snakes of kids following her down the mountain...
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