 Poster: A snowHead
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Anyone got any idea where s the oldest working ski lift in the world is
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Depends how you define a ski lift. The cog railways in Switzerland (e.g. Wengen-Kleine Scheidegg, and Zermatt-Gornergrat) are the oldest lifts used for downhill skiing - though they weren't built for that purpose.
The Parsennbahn in Davos (I think the old cattle wagon is still going!) is a very old funicular railway for skiers. Cablecars tend to have long working lives too, compared to chairlifts and draglifts, but that's a grey area for me. I've not been to St Anton for a few years, but the Galzig cablecar (if it's still in commission) deserves a gold watch - I can't imagine any other cablecar of equivalent vintage that's done so much uplift for skiers!
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Sat 13-11-04 19:42; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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The Poma at our local dry-slope is surely a contender for this 
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It wouldn't qualify, but I can remember using the White Lady T bar when I was 13, which was in 1965 I think - (getting senile!) The Cas T bar was there then, but has been moved since.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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easiski, I think you'll find that the Coire Cas T-bar (which would date from 1961 or 1962) is still doing sterling service, with its noisy old engine. I believe it was built just after the top section of the White Lady chairlift, and therefore pre-dated the lower section of the chairlift (the chairs now, of course, replaced with the funicular).
The Cas is a remarkable old lift. I spent more time on that T-bar than any other lift when I worked on the 'gorm in the mid-1970s. It's a great snow-holding gully.
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Does it still count as the same cable car if the cable has been replaced three times, and the car twice?
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Kramer, sounds like a well known freshers' philosophy question -
After its famous voyage the Argos goes on several more voyages and after each some timbers are replaced, till none of the original is left. Finally someone finds all the discarded timbers and builds a boat. Which is really Jason's Argos?
Last edited by Then you can post your own questions or snow reports... on Wed 28-06-06 12:05; edited 1 time in total
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Obviously, the one that still floats. The discarded timbers must all have been discarded for a reason, therefore the boat constructed from them would be very unlikely to be seaworthy. 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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snowball, Argos was the son of Zeus and Niobe. Another Argos was Odysseus's dog, who recognised him after 19 years -- which was more than his wife did.
Jason's ship was the Argo. 
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laundryman, Groan, Yes, you're right, and Argos is also an (ancient) Greek town 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I'd say if there's any element of a lift remaining - pylons, stations, whatever (even, arguably, just its alignment if the whole shooting match has been replaced) - then the lift dates from its inauguration from point A to point B.
In the case of the Wengen or Zermatt cog railways, much of the original civil engineering remains - bridges, tunnels, stations etc. even if (as I guess) all the tracks and trains would have been replaced by now.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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David Goldsmith, there are still a few passenger wagons that are quite old on the WAB that are used when things get really busy, I'll see if I can find out how old they are but I think the oldest may be the beautifully restored coaches on the Jungfrau Bahn, they have some of the original coaches and an engine that had its motors replace that I think date back to its original opening in 1912
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David Goldsmith, Bit slow here. The Corrie Cas T bar used to start further down the mountain than it now does. It started by going up the nasty little hill that's now between it and the finish of the Car Park T bar. They moved the start of it around ????? anyway between my racing there in 65 and working there in 80.
At any rate it FEELS old!
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You know it makes sense.
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Just been looking through October issue of ski and board, in an article about the "steeps of Alagne" it mentions 2 lifts a "very ancient cable car" up to Punta Indren and "basket lift where you run along behind and leap in" which I think goes from the Valle Bors to the cable car up tp Punta Indren. These sound like old lifts from the description any ideas as to how old?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Some of the older cablecars in the Alps date from the 1950s (and perhaps earlier, I'm not sure), so they might go back that far.
This is a lovely site for old lifts: Chairlift.org.
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Poster: A snowHead
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David Goldsmith, small cable car from Leukerbad is 1952, and another one a bit up the valley is 1956. Tiny, groany and noisy - rather you than me. The first cable car to Kleine Matterhorn is 1962, so relatively young!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| easiski wrote: |
| The first cable car to Kleine Matterhorn is 1962, so relatively young! |
If you mean the cablecar up to Furi, it's not generally used now because of the glossy new Matterhorn Express gondola, though it was still there last time I visited.
The cablecar from Hohtali to Stockhorn is older, I think. I happened to ask the liftie how old it was and I'm pretty sure he dated it to the Fifties.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| David Goldsmith wrote: |
The Parsennbahn in Davos (I think the old cattle wagon is still going!) is a very old funicular railway for skiers. |
I think you are getting confused in your dotage. The Parsennbahn has been replaced by a Gondola. It is the Schatzalpbahn that is really old.
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I staggered into this from a unrelated google search, so apologies for bumping up an ancient thread! The Cas Tow didn't move very far, it was raised onto a steel rig to combat heavy drifting which has become less of an issue with the removal of the upper level of the middle station. You can see the old drive base directly below the present rig.
The oldest operating Ski Lift in Scotland though is the Meall Odhar T-bar, which will reach it's half century next year having been built in 1957, five years before the formation of the Glenshee Chairlift Company and construction of the Cairnwell Chairlift which opened in December 1962. Yes the single seater Chairs in operation in Scotland today are BOTH newer installations than the former White Lady Chairlift which was a detachable double. Mindless bit of Trivia, the Sunnyside T-bar was built in the autumn of 1963, there was sufficient snow to operate it on a grand total of SEVEN days the following season! 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| easiski wrote: |
| It wouldn't qualify, but I can remember using the White Lady T bar when I was 13, which was in 1965 I think - (getting senile!) The Cas T bar was there then, but has been moved since. |
The White Lady Tow now has the White Lady Chairlifts Drive... so where does that leave the philosophers!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| snowball wrote: |
Kramer, sounds like a well known freshers' philosophy question -
After its famous voyage the Argos goes on several more voyages and after each some timbers are replaced. Finally someone finds all the discarded timbers and builds a boat. Which is really Jason's Argos? |
legally the the former.. morally the latter.. but never argue with lawyers
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Russell, can't vouch for the actual antiquity of the thing, but there is (was?) a single chair lift in Bardonecchia, Italy which takes you up to the 'alternative' ski area on Jafferau - I actually think it's better than the main area. Anyway, if the rickety, rusty, creaking chair ISN'T the oldest bit of mountain transport, it must be closely related. VERY scary! 
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brian
brian
Guest
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| Winterhighland wrote: |
| easiski wrote: |
| It wouldn't qualify, but I can remember using the White Lady T bar when I was 13, which was in 1965 I think - (getting senile!) The Cas T bar was there then, but has been moved since. |
The White Lady Tow now has the White Lady Chairlifts Drive... so where does that leave the philosophers! |
Does that mean the dreaded White Lady whine is no more ? 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| David Goldsmith wrote: |
| The cablecar from Hohtali to Stockhorn is older, I think. I happened to ask the liftie how old it was and I'm pretty sure he dated it to the Fifties. |
When I was in Zermatt last season I heard that that lift might have to be decommissioned in the next season or two. The only access to the Tritji T-bar (which may never run again due to glacier shrinkage) area would then be via Rote Nase cablecar. Anything above that would have to be hiked...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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The Brevent, Chamonix. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| davidof wrote: |
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
The Parsennbahn in Davos (I think the old cattle wagon is still going!) is a very old funicular railway for skiers. |
I think you are getting confused in your dotage. The Parsennbahn has been replaced by a Gondola. It is the Schatzalpbahn that is really old. |
and if that is not so old as they have now replaced it!
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Martin Bell, is that the access to the Tritji bumps?
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You know it makes sense.
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Yes, therefore, last season, the famous Triftji Bumps contest was moved to Furggsattel. End of an era.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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The funicular from Lauterbrunnen to Grutschalp was opened in 1891 and stopped running sadly in April 06. (Murren - Switzerland)
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Poster: A snowHead
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This claims to be the world's oldest, but it wasn't originally built as a ski lift.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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HOw about the bizarre bucket bacl from the top of Alagna? Sorry, too much wine to recollect the proper names. If it's not the oldest it's certainly the scariest in my book. Apart, of course, from the "fantasticable"...
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Martin Bell, that is a shame. Especially as the year before last, I declined to ski the Triftji bumps, saying that I was tired, and that they'll always be there the next time.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Kramer, you will still be able to ski the Triftji Bumps, you just won't be able to do laps on them using the T-Bar. Each time, you'll have to descend to Gant, and come back up via Hohtalli and Rote Nase.
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from what i know the first chair lifts were put in Montgenevre by the british army.
if anyone knows any different i'd be interested to know as this may be hearsay i'm not sure!
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| RobW wrote: |
| davidof wrote: |
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
The Parsennbahn in Davos (I think the old cattle wagon is still going!) is a very old funicular railway for skiers. |
I think you are getting confused in your dotage. The Parsennbahn has been replaced by a Gondola. It is the Schatzalpbahn that is really old. |
The Parsennbahn hasn't been replaced by a Gondola - at least it hadn't at Easter when we were there!
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Interesting photos Rob. The were talking for ages about putting a gondola in to speed up access and I had heard they had updated the lift but they have obviously replaced the old cable driven wagons with a high speed funicular (can you confirm?).
They also have talked about putting a gondola in down to the bottom of the Klosters valley to improve access for people coming up from Zurich, any idea if this has happened.
Sorry about the confusion but I still think David G must have been thinking about the older Schatzalp line which has also had a makeover recently. Certainly the Parsennbahn doesn't seem to count and I would say Mount Washington has it as a tourist lift.
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| davidof wrote: |
| The were talking for ages about putting a gondola in to speed up access and I had heard they had updated the lift but they have obviously replaced the old cable driven wagons with a high speed funicular (can you confirm?). |
The bottom half is certainly far quicker than the top: must have at least double the capacity. The 6-pack parallel to the top section means that the top section didn't run everyday we were there (but did run in worse weather than the chair could cope with.
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| They also have talked about putting a gondola in down to the bottom of the Klosters valley to improve access for people coming up from Zurich, any idea if this has happened. |
No sign of anything. They certainly could do with something as it's a long run from Weisfluhjoch (top of Parsennbahn) down to Schifer, but if you take the runs below there you are committed to going all the way to the valley floor and then catching the train back up to Klosters: from where there only the cable car back up. A gondola from (say) Kublis up to Schifer would make a lot of sense.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Morzines telepherique 1st opened in 1934 and one built on 1961 is still operating.
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