Hi everyone -
This time last year we were worrying about lack of snow - now there seems to be so much that that the avalanche risk in Tignes is posted as high. I know - we can't have it all and it's lovely to see the slopes with so much snow on them. We don't ski 'off piste' much - basically just to have a play beside the pistes or to maybe cut across from one piste to another.
We're off to Tignes on Saturday for a week and I'd just like to know from everyone what the risk is to people like us - are the warnings, although of course to be observed by everyone, more directed at dedicated, serious off piste skiers?
Thanks - i know I'm a worry wort!
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
loatie, I rarely go of piste but I would say you have every right to be worried. I would stick to the piste until the level reaches 3. I have heard rumours that some resorts are very unwilling to post a level 5 and thus level 4 is very dangerous.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
We don't ski 'off piste' much - basically just to have a play beside the pistes or to maybe cut across from one piste to another.
People have died within feet of a piste, it's like being "half pregnant", you are either off piste or not. If you are off piste you should take the necessary precautions, prevention being best!
cheers,
Greg
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Although the analogy a little bit pregnant is often used - its not always the case. There may be areas that are just a little bit off piste that are perfectly safe even in a time of relatively high avy risk - however if you don't know enough and have enough experience to identify what these may be then the only sensible approach is not to chance it.
So is it the case that on-piste is pretty safe in this respect?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
loatie, I think you have a positive attitude. To worry about the snow conditions is far safer than blindly skiing without any concern for your surroundings. I would add that there is so much snow around now, that fun can be had without taking yourself anywhere dangerous. Have a great time.
After all it is free
After all it is free
loatie, I was in Tignes on saturday when there was a lot of snow and a guy in my chalet was hit by an avalanche when risk was at 4. He was off piste but 'only' 300 metres from the pistes. He was very lucky and the patrollers got to him in time, but he was very stupid as far as where he was and didnt have the correct equipment.
If risk is 3 or higher think very carefully about where you ski. Crossing between pistes can be dangerous....if worried stay on piste...
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Jonpim wrote:
loatie, just Be Careful.
According to SCGB 4 people are now known to have died in the Alps in the last week[/url].
Maybe what you mean is "according to the ski club which copied some of this information from the front page of Pistehors.com" ?
Last edited by You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net. on Mon 10-12-07 19:33; edited 2 times in total
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
We ventured "off piste" (the same as you describe) in Tignes today, waist deep powder.
But we all ski with Tranceivers, shovels, probes and the knowledge of how to use them. But all in all I'd say you'll be ok.
Not alot of the lifts are open at the minute..
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Thanks very much for all your comments so far - i really do appreciate them. I am the most reluctant and cautious 'off piste' skier in our family and always worry about the risks more than the others (probably an age/mother thing!!) so it's great to be able to show that my fears are not unfounded. Cheers
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
loatie, If you're on a gentle slope and also skiing nowhere near the base of a steep snow covered mountain face I'd have thought the avalanche risk would be low, my uneducated opinion.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Quote:
He was off piste but 'only' 300 metres from the pistes.
300 meter is hardly "a little bit" off-piste. Depending on the terrain, it could be half way down the valley.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
davidof, I see that they've forgotten to credit you again.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
loatie, one big issue to worry about is the sheer number of people who completely ignore the warnings and go off-piste anyway - and they say things like "we all ski with Tranceivers, shovels, probes and the knowledge of how to use them" . Amazing how "tracked out" a resort can look even on a high risk day. All it does is give others the impression that all must be OK... when it isn't. Get a local guide. You'll have a better day.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Elizabeth B wrote:
davidof, I see that they've forgotten to credit you again.
Well I think there is the greater good of getting the message out there . I guess I'm not as in favour as Warren.
Regarding Tignes - avalanche risk about 3 to 4 at the moment but the poor weather is probably keeping a lot of people on the open runs. Wait till things clear on Thursday !!!
By Saturday the risk should be down to 2 to 3. I would advise (as I note others above have already stated) that if you have no knowledge you should not leave the marked and open ski runs when either the Checkerboard (yellow/black) or Black flag are flying. That is, only consider off piste skiing on your own when the Yellow flag is flying at the bottom of ski lifts.
I accept that cutting across, say the bottom of the Perce neige to the Merles will not put you in any danger because you are on a plateau but skiing just off piste on any of the reds and blacks and on the steeper pitches of the blues is dangerous.
While reading the article on the avalanch death, there's this passge:
"...closed due to lack of snow and for this reason the slopes above would not have been blasted by the piste patrol. "
It's implying that before any piste is open, the slope directly above it will be blasted...
I can see that's a very good pratice, but is it always the case?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
abc wrote:
While reading the article on the avalanch death, there's this passge:
"...closed due to lack of snow and for this reason the slopes above would not have been blasted by the piste patrol. "
It's implying that before any piste is open, the slope directly above it will be blasted...
I can see that's a very good pratice, but is it always the case?
All the resorts that I've skied in seem very well organised for protecting pistes which are underneath avalanche prone slopes. Avalanche fences, gazex canons, catex cables and blasting are all used as appropriate. I think I've only ever seen avalanche debris on piste once, and that was from a pisteur blast before the piste was opened. I think on-piste avalanche deaths are incredibly rare - IIRC there was one about a decade ago (in Val Thorens?). Resorts take piste protection as their highest priority so if in doubt they keep the piste closed.
Regarding Tignes - avalanche risk about 3 to 4 at the moment but the poor weather is probably keeping a lot of people on the open runs. Wait till things clear on Thursday !!!
Those are the kinds of days that I really don't envy the piste security guys. The chances of having to dig out dead bodies from the snow is very much higher than normal when everyone gets into a powder frenzy after a few days of being in lock down from poor weather.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
As I have said before on this board many times,
More snowsporters DIE when the Lawine/Avalanche rating is posted at 3 then any other rating.
If you choose to go out in Level 4 or 5 you better inform your insurance company & also let the local mountain rescue services not to risk there lives rescuing you in the event you get swept away & buried
The SCGB doesnt mention the other 2 fatalities in just the Tirol in Austria. I expect this to greatly increase in the next few weeks as we go into High Season.
The SCGB doesnt mention the other 2 fatalities in just the Tirol in Austria. I expect this to greatly increase in the next few weeks as we go into High Season.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
stanton, this time last year you were telling everyone to stay at home as there was no snow, now you're telling us to stay at home as there's too much snow. I'm beginning to think you have a secret agenda of trying to have the pistes to yourself.
Generally I would agree about not going off-piste, but like others have said I really can't recall when someone was killed on piste
After all it is free
After all it is free
is it worth risking your life for? a couple of days powder isnt worth it, if your putting your life on the line.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
don't they do free off piste safety training sessions at tignes? sure i read something about that.... anyway, if they do, maybe now is the prefect time to avail yourself of this
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Bode Swiller wrote:
loatie, one big issue to worry about is the sheer number of people who completely ignore the warnings and go off-piste anyway - and they say things like "we all ski with Tranceivers, shovels, probes and the knowledge of how to use them" . Amazing how "tracked out" a resort can look even on a high risk day. All it does is give others the impression that all must be OK... when it isn't. Get a local guide. You'll have a better day.
That's a little unfair, you have no idea about my skiing ability.
I would've said the 'off piste' I skiied today was very low risk, and I'm sure any guide would agree.
Get a local guide, if you want to have a substantial excursion I'd say.
I can't see how 50 metres off piste on the same slope/conditions/face is high avalanche risk and the piste is low..
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Christopher wrote:
is it worth risking your life for? a couple of days powder isnt worth it, if your putting your life on the line.
You could say the same about things like Scuba diving, Skydiving anything like that. Even driving really..
It's all down to the person at the end of the day.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Christopher wrote:
is it worth risking your life for? a couple of days powder isnt worth it, if your putting your life on the line.
It's not worth risking one's life for, any more than crossing the street!
Children do get killed crossing the street, or adults skiing off-piste. But would you forbid your children from crossing the street, EVER? Of course not, you'll teach them how to look out for traffic. The same an off-piste skier learns how to read the slope.
People who say NEVER to ski off-piste is basically saying "nobody is capable of learning to read the slope" (any better than children ever learn to cross the street). Yet some of those same people are willing to go on a guided off-piste excursion, never give a moment's thought to how the guides get to be such god like figure: by learning, the same way every other skier can.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Spikyhedgehog wrote:
That's a little unfair, you have no idea about my skiing ability.
I would've said the 'off piste' I skiied today was very low risk, and I'm sure any guide would agree.
Get a local guide, if you want to have a substantial excursion I'd say.
I can't see how 50 metres off piste on the same slope/conditions/face is high avalanche risk and the piste is low..
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
France had there biggest avalanche fatalities during a season two years ago and that was when aprrox 1.5-2 metres of snow fell at the end of Feb beginning of March. Half that amount of snow has just fallen in Val D'Isere in the last 4 days. Avalanche risk is at 4 now. Even the best guides can make an error. I now Evolution lost a guide when I was there in 2006 , week of the 6th of March 2006 and I think around 5 other skiers were killed that week just in Val. You need to way up the risk , if they are saying the snow is unstable say risk 4 or 5 then I wouldn't be going. Call me a coward , but we had two days guided in Val last year , avalanche risk was 2 , we followed procedure , listended to the guide , the snow was great , best i had ever skied in and the risk was low , and I got to go skiing the next day with my seven year old son.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Can anyone point me to a Tarentaise Avalanche bulletin available on line?
Have a look at This video clip to get a feeling of the power of an avalanche
Lucky guys
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Christopher wrote:
is it worth risking your life for? a couple of days powder isnt worth it, if your putting your life on the line.
This person has never skied powder.
No, seriously be safe out there kids. The beauty of this time of the year and these conditions is you don't have to go silly to enjoy amazing snow.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
I'd agree - stay on piste until the risk is 3. I don't ski off piste much, but ISTR that somebody was killed last year in Courchevel on a very small area between two busy easy pistes. 50 metres may mean the difference between the danger of being hit by an avalanche set off by somebody else skiing off piste higher up and not being hit by that avalanche. It doesn't just mean the risk of you setting something off that gets you. The pistes are pistes for a reason.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Martin Nicholas wrote:
Can anyone point me to a Tarentaise Avalanche bulletin available on line?
The Savoie Bulletin from MeteoFrance is here. The HAT website is also useful for a commentary, in English, on conditions.
loatie, one big issue to worry about is the sheer number of people who completely ignore the warnings and go off-piste anyway - and they say things like "we all ski with Tranceivers, shovels, probes and the knowledge of how to use them" . Amazing how "tracked out" a resort can look even on a high risk day. All it does is give others the impression that all must be OK... when it isn't. Get a local guide. You'll have a better day.
That's a little unfair, you have no idea about my skiing ability.
I would've said the 'off piste' I skiied today was very low risk, and I'm sure any guide would agree.
Get a local guide, if you want to have a substantial excursion I'd say.
I can't see how 50 metres off piste on the same slope/conditions/face is high avalanche risk and the piste is low..
Hope we get the chance to exchange posts at the end of the season! Listen to yourself... "I would've said", "I'm sure any guide would agree" (Oh yeah?), "I can't see..." (No, you can't). People who assume make an ASS of U and ME. You're a classic example of a certain attitude that prevails in the mountains today... got a small amount of knowledge, got all the gear, think you can ski, think you're qualified to advise others that "you'll be OK". Get a guide for ANY excursion if you really want to get the most from your day. That's the best advice anyone could give anyone on here. Best of luck.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Boris wrote:
stanton, this time last year you were telling everyone to stay at home as there was no snow, now you're telling us to stay at home as there's too much snow. I'm beginning to think you have a secret agenda of trying to have the pistes to yourself.
Generally I would agree about not going off-piste, but like others have said I really can't recall when someone was killed on piste
Last year,I was saying how it was. No BS.
This year its so far the best early season snowfall in many decades. All I am saying is that folk should take care and not think it is safe out there when there is a lot of snow.
Anywhere in the mountains can be dangerous winter or summer
Spikyhedgehog, don't sweat Mr Bode Swiller the guy is an absolute back bottom...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
parlor, you need to rearrange the words a bit there as I can't tell if you're calling me an ars*hole or the other bloke.
After all it is free
After all it is free
Bode Swiller, actually, I think everyone knows who I mean.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
parlor, but you can't articulate why. What, is everyone here Mystic Meg?
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Bode Swiller, it's because you write rubbish, you're the worlds biggest neigh-sayer and who the hell are you? Post some stoke, shut up and get over it. Re-arrange those words. And if that wasn't clear, yes. I am calling YOU Bode Swiller a toss pot, ça-va?
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
. Amazing how "tracked out" a resort can look even on a high risk day. All it does is give others the impression that all must be OK... when it isn't. Get a local guide. You'll have a better day.
. I guess I'm not as in favour as Warren. 
!!!
