In response to rob@rar's question in SnowHot's "Ah-Ha" moment thread, I though I'd expand on one of mine for comment (and/or ridicule). Caveats 1. I am sure this is not the only technique, it just works for me and follows an "Ah-Ha!" moment. 2. I am not an instructor, nor would I want to be seen to pass myself off as one.
Bumps are one of my things. They can offer a great challenge when there's not many other challenges available and I reckon there isn't much better to watch than a good skier zippering a line.
This was around 1996. I was/am reasonably competent, I could hold the fall-line in regular bumps but mostly through momentum and strength. Anyway I went out for a "tune-up" with one of the best instructors I have met (in limited experience of instruction) - Thierry Copreau, ESF Morzine.
Anyway, the "Ah-Ha!" moment was when he asked, "Show me how to turn on one bump. After all, if you can't turn on one, how can you expect to turn on many?"
The lightbulb goes on, "Ah-Ha!". A good question.
Now, I'd read my Sunday Times "We learned to ski" section on "Avalement" turns in bumps and believed that that was what I was doing. But I hadn't considered its deconstruction into a single turn.
So, with TC supporting my pole (poles are almost necessary for this) we set about doing one single turn on one single bump.
Preparation
Start with your skis on the apex of one bump with your skis pointing across the fall line.
Skis together One of the few times where this is necessary. The idea being that one essential element is that your skis can swivel as one on the apex of the bump.
Avalement Literally, to swallow. You bring your legs up as you crest the apex so that the bump is completely absorbed by them. Design faults in the human nervous system mean that until you get used to it, this feels as though you are grossly over-absorbing. In most people I observe skiing, absorption is happening at maybe 20% of what's required.
Fluidity comes with practice. For this single turn though I think you ideally want to be crouched to the point that as you pass over the bump and extend into the trough, your hips follow a straight line down the hill.
Anticipation The idea is that you position yourself so that as your skis slide forward and pass over the apex, they naturally rotate on the top of the bump and you extend into the trough with your skis pointing the other way. In order for them to naturally change direction like this you need to anticipate the turn by extending the arm on the side you want to turn to, out to that side. You don't want to rotate your torso (if you're starting from the fall line) but because your skis are already pointing across the fall line and you are extending your arm in the opposite direction, you end up a little like a wound up spring, ready to trigger the rotation.
Poles Almost essential. Your inside of the turn pole (held in your extended arm) is planted just beside your inside of turn boot.
So for the exercise...which involves a little commitment from both the instructor and the instructee.
Instructor supports the pole and allows the instructee to angulate a little edge into the bump.
Instructee pushes forward a tiny little bit - and provided all the parts are properly lined up - naturally sweeps down the front of the bump extending into the trough and with skis rotated in opposite direction.
Ah-Ha!
A little edge set, more absorption and repeat in opposing directions as required until knackered.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
David Murdoch, good write up. It's still very much forms the progression in many ski schools today.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
David Murdoch, Just to clarify, which part of the bump / turn are you calling the apex ?
And to continue useful bump help: the very best bit of advice I've ever had WRT skiing moguls was to ignore the bump and focus on the hole! 'look for the hole/trough with your toes' was actually what he said. What a difference.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
first thing to say is that moguls are probably my weakest element of skiing... but this rings true for me. i'd spent ages with people telling me to absorb the bump and pivot on top of it, but it was when i got the idea of driving my ski tips into the hole on the other side that i started to ski them with some semblance of technique
there was one run where i was really letting rip in bumps and that ended with me tearing my ACL. tend to avoid them if i can now
Wow, this could turn in to a 'bumps theory' thread
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
THANK YOU!
This is amazing!
or should I say AH-HA!
After all it is free
After all it is free
I agree. The trick is to turn 'one bump at a time'.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
david@mediacopy, the "flat" bit on "top" - or if not flat, the area where you'd stand if you were standing straight upright on it.
Whitegold, indeed, cos then any bump becomes that one bump and you can ski any line fluidly.
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Snowhot,
David Murdoch wrote:
Avalement Literally, to swallow. You bring your legs up as you crest the apex so that the bump is completely absorbed by them. Design faults in the human nervous system mean that until you get used to it, this feels as though you are grossly over-absorbing. In most people I observe skiing, absorption is happening at maybe 20% of what's required.
b) full range of motion including standing as tall as you can without a)
Quote:
Top of a BOSU or top of a mogul with tip&tail in air, what's the difference?
make sense now?
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
comprex, Makes perfect sense. Now we'll see if I can actually put it into practice.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
SnowHot, sorry, bee/bonnet.
Last weekend I was talking to a guy who was surprised that I thought his Voelkl 6*s were a good ski, apparently they chatter at speed then I saw him walk away to sell them, every step he took had that little heel pull inwards as his ankles stopped bending.
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
David Murdoch, thanks mate, appreciated.
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
David Murdoch, nice one, good explanation, will have to give it a go sometime.
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
For the record I'm printing this out to keep it handy when I'm getting geared up for bumps.
I am impressed with the simplicity of this explanation, and very grateful.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
SnowHot, come ski with Pierre, eh and he'll show you the other way to do it, flexibility not required.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
comprex, I want to have lessons with this guy when I get home.... he works at my home resort... and is friends with a young friend of mine...
comprex, I want to have lessons with this guy when I get home....
Ah, young Reilly. He's pretty awesome, isn't he!
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
David Murdoch, nice keks
After all it is free
After all it is free
skimottaret,
I've asked him this loads.... I think it a fantasy..
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Nice write up. Moving on from one bump I think a top tip is to look ahead 2 or 3 bumps or at least the next one. As with many aspects of skiing and other sports - "head up, stop looking at your toes" - can make a world of difference.
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veeeight wrote:
Quote:
comprex, I want to have lessons with this guy when I get home....
Ah, young Reilly. He's pretty awesome, isn't he!
Yeah... friend of a young guy I know... I ski with that kid and his brother and Mum sometimes and he used my coach a bit..
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
waynos, oh absolutely - just like in gates your mind should be well ahead, letting "muscle memory" deal with what your body is up to IMHO
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
David Murdoch wrote:
After 3 pints of strong continental lager and a few of ropey red...the result of the coaching described above can be seen here...
Some of you may have seen this before.
Apologies.
This was a great demonstration.
I had drinks last night with Pierre, of EpicSki. He's known for his profound skills in moguls.
Listening to him is inspiring.
His method is:
Slow your feet down, take your time. Make it flow instead of hitting each mogul.
I can hardly wait to ski with him!
This winter!!
This is a video I took from the chair at ABasin last spring during Mogul Practice
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
SnowHot, ohhhhh, I soooo wish I could do that. Wicked! You will have fun keeping up with him!
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
David Murdoch wrote:
After 3 pints of strong continental lager and a few of ropey red...the result of the coaching described above can be seen here...
Some of you may have seen this before.
Apologies.
i'm going to take a somewhat "contrarian" view"!
first of all the skiing in the video is very good. i would like to point out two things. look at the turns closest to the camera and i ask you whether any of these involved the top of the bump! second, these are small moguls.
teaching folks to turn on the top of a bump is indeed common, it is indeed easy in small bumps, and can lead to an ah-hah moment.
i often query my students by asking.........."what is on the other side of the top of a bump?"
my answer? the steepest terrain on the mountain, a very deep trough, and a very narrow trough.
look back carefully at that wonderful skiing. the skiier in question on the sides and avoided the tops!
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Rusty Guy, hmm, if you are describing my sequence,
1. thank you for your comments and kind words it's always good to hear from you!
2. this was on the side of the Leisse in Tignes - a double black diamond in US terms.
3. The camera angle doesn't accurately represent the size of the bumps IMHO . Leisse has a less steep section in the middle - in general, while not as gnarly as say the Olympic bumps in Deer Valley, they were not small. I think it' slightly confusing that the amazonian photographer in question has sensibly chosen a relatively flat area to stand on for obvious reasons. So all action closest to the camera is slightly unrepresentative of the rest. But a fair point! Observe the higher and lower section for bigger bumps!
At the risk of exposing innocent friends to the SHs criticism, this clip might illustrate conditions better
But you raise another interesting point. From a static start, I submit that my at the start of the thread description is accurate. From a dynamic start however, the point of greatest force is on the side of the bump not the top (otherwise I would guess you'd slide off?) so yes, side action is what we're up to. I could imagine that you could describe this as the effective apex, as opposed to the top.
??
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
JT, skimottaret, here you go...might even be able to dig up some vid if you like...
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
tall, good looking, AND can ski, my ideal woman, bring on the video
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
skimottaret, alas my friend, we were at her wedding a few weeks ago...and a fine old bash 'twas too!
David Murdoch, i'm sure it was a great bash, the good ones never last too long do they I hope her husband skis!!
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
skimottaret, he didn't really when they met but has applied himself with huge dedication. So he is getting there - and manges to enjoy what could otherwise be a tricky old learning curve.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
David Murdoch wrote:
SnowHot, ohhhhh, I soooo wish I could do that. Wicked! You will have fun keeping up with him!
I sooooooooooo wish I could do that too!
For the record..........I won't be trying to keep up whit him. I'll just admire from afar and volunteer to take pics and video!
After all it is free
After all it is free
Helen Beaumont wrote:
Quote:
I hope her husband skis!!
You mean ladies may have husbands who don't
I'm very grateful that my husband skis, but if you've been on The SkiDiva recently you'll find that there are more who don't than you could imagine. Whoda' thunk it!
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
David Murdoch wrote:
[3. The camera angle doesn't accurately represent the size of the bumps IMHO . Leisse has a less steep section in the middle - in general, while not as gnarly as say the Olympic bumps in Deer Valley, they were not small. I think it' slightly confusing that the amazonian photographer in question has sensibly chosen a relatively flat area to stand on for obvious reasons. So all action closest to the camera is slightly unrepresentative of the rest. But a fair point! Observe the higher and lower section for bigger bumps!
video never does a bump run justice.
the skiing in the video is very good.......period.
i teach a great many bump lessons at winter park and will say that at age 52 i am a very, very average bump skiier. with that in mind.......i try to do all i can to avoid........bumps. teach at mary jane for six days straight and your knees will scream!
unless you learn to slip and slide off the sides.
in other words, it's getting to the tops and surviving the ride to the troughs that rock my world. i like to ski the sides.it is my suggestion that you demonstrate the slippery, skiddy, soft line off the sides of contiguous bumps that i so vehemently advocate.
btw.....i got a kick out of the cheerleader on the video. very british!
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Rusty Guy, hmmm, you might be right. Certainly, video never (at least not when I'm driving) does justice. The cheerleader can be seen here-->
FAQ
Poster: A snowHead
then I saw him walk away to sell them, every step he took had that little heel pull inwards as his ankles stopped bending.
it's always good to hear from you!
