 Poster: A snowHead
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Hi folks, I'm just back from a session at the dry slope trying to get to grips with this carving lark. I'm getting there, I can feel the acceleration as the edge begins to bite - just so long as I'm turning to the right! Turning to the left and I slip down half the slope before I know where I am. My left ankle just refuses to supinate (is that the correct term?). Do any clever snowheads know of any exercises I could do to get my left ankle moving? I'm going to run out of piste if I can only ever turn right 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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ickabodblue, exercises or possibly alignment. Have you had your boot alignment checked? (just a simple suggestion, FWIW)
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Wear The Fox Hat, No I haven't and they are usually so comfy but today I was getting numb feet. I manage to carve turning to the right ok though, would the prob not be the same on both sides if it were the boots?
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ickabodblue, not necessarily. Hopefully CEM or SZK will weigh in here, but let's say that you were slightly bow legged on your left right, when you would turn right, it would be easy to have your right peg out of the way of the left one, but when you went to turn the other way, it would take a bigger move on your part to get your bowed leg over so that the ski was on its inside edge.
(this would be a lot easier to eplain with a diagram!)
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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ickabodblue, pretty much all of us have a stronger side, certainly when we start off. It's of course possible that WTFH is saying is right, but I suspect you'd know if you were sufficiently anatomically unbalanced for it to make a difference. Just a thought, do your shoes wear down at the heel differently on right and left?
More likely though IMHO it's just a basic technique problem. First off, how wide apart are your feet? I can't remember from earlier posts whether you first learned ages ago, or are just getting going - if you first learned 15+ years ago you probably learned to get your feet closer together than is recommended for carving skis. Your feet should be about hip- (or maybe even shoulder-) width apart, to allow you to get the anglulation you need from the lower limbs and stop the inside leg blocking your turn. If you're too close together it's quite difficult (but not impossible) to get the pressure management right.
Things to try then are (stuff that's worked for me in training):
1) ski down without poles and place the palms of your hands on the insides of your knees. Start each turn by pushing the inside knee in the direction you want to go. This forces your inside leg to move towards the centre of the turn and help get the edge engaged.
2) you may have a temptation to just stand on your left leg (I know I tend to stand too heavily on my right), so putting more weight on the inside leg than is advisable when turning left - and so the outer ski will have less downward pressure on it to provide grip during the turn. Try to imagine as you turn that the inside leg has chewing-gum holding it onto the slope, and try lifting the ski against the pull of the gum (but of course keeping it on the matting). Another thing that helps here is thinking of pedalling a bike down the slope - your outer leg extends and the inner leg shortens as you make the turn.
3) when you've got that, use a bungee looped loosely round your knees, such that you can hold it up with moving your knees a bit apart. Ski down keeping the bungee tensioned between the knees. Does the same as 1), but with your arms in a more normal position.
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GrahamN, Thanks for the tips, I am back on tomorrow afternoon while number two son has his lesson and I will give them a try. I learned a long, long, long time ago but have never really progressed much. Now that my kids are into skiing I've taken a couple of lessons and want to move forward. The instructor said that feet were too close together and that I had an "A frame"
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ickabodblue, guessed as much  . Exercise 1) will work well on sorting out the A-frame. If you get a choice of slopes, choose one that allows you to straight-line without getting up too much speed - while you're worrying about this stuff you don't want to be worrying about whether you're going too fast or not. If you only get one slope to play on, which I guess will then be too steep to straight-line comfortably, it will be well worth getting off the lift half way up and only doing the bottom half/third whatever. When I'm trying something new I frequently use only the bottom 20-30m of a slope.
You'll feel a right dork doing this stuff if everyone else is steaming down, and the exercises will feel extremely strange to start with (when you feel you've pushed your knee out too far you'll only just be getting there), but it'll be well worth it.
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GrahamN, I'm used to looking a dork! The bottom 30m or so is quite gentle so I'll let you know how I get on. Thanks a million
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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ickabodblue, Thanks for the question, I have exactly the same problem, and also learned ages ago/keep my feet too close together, although I don't think I have much of an A-frame, if any. Thanks GrahamN, your assessment and advice sound spot on and I shall defo try those exercises. I'm well used to looking like a prune as well! 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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GrahamN,
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I have no instructor qualifications (current or not)
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Well, you put on a jolly good act, if I may say so!
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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ickabodblue, To carve your ski effectively you will need to allow both legs to incline progressively as you move through the arc. Carving is a progressive multi dimensional action (railing tends to be one dimensional, sometimes referred to as park and ride). It may well be that you have a greater range of movement on one side that allows this, but block on your less successful side. This block could be caused by any number of issues in your movements and set up (way you set yourself up for each turn on the skis). If you are a female? The A frame is natural, dont try to "correct it" thats working against nature! Modify your movements to work with it. Also, male or female the A frame can be caused be a late commitment to the new turning ski, therefore the old ski remains in the arc too long (the A frame illusion). To treat the A frame is to treat the symptom. Work on the cause. In real basic terms, to create the desired out come (carve in this case) you need to get both skis progressively tilting in relation to the arc shape (your desired arc shape). Where are the blockages? Work from there. Also worth mentioning that carving on a dry slope it not easy!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Well, I was back on the dry slope today and I tried the things that Graham suggested and can report a significant improvement! Not brilliant by any stretch of the imagination, I still need loads of work but a definate improvement. I noticed also that I do stand heavily on my right foot. So thanks to Graham for the help be it qualified or not! Elbrus - my blockage is at my left ankle I' just wasn't sure what to do about it in practical terms - any advice gratefully received.
WTFH - No I've not had the alignment of my boots checked and as I've said I need all the help I can get! Can anyone recommend someone in the Glasgow area?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ickabodblue, Great, well done you. I'm going to follow the advice too, only problem being that I just don't fancy going to MK - what with the hazards on the sides of the slope and the background screaming. On the other hand, if I don't practise...
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Does the movement stem from the ankles or the knees? Messing about today I discovered that if I stop thinking about my ankles and kinda roll my knees it works better. Am I developing bad habits? - every instructor I've ever had has always said to roll your ankles 
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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ickabodblue, how are your side slips?
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comprex, Not too bad I think. It's my prefered way of getting out of trouble when I'm bottling it!
We practice side slipping on snowflex and I find that a bit more difficult but still manage.
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| ickabodblue wrote: |
comprex, Not too bad I think. It's my prefered way of getting out of trouble when I'm bottling it!
We practice side slipping on snowflex and I find that a bit more difficult but still manage. |
To either side, or is there a strong preference?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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comprex, There is a preference (though i wouldn't say it is strong) to the left
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ickabodblue, so, the question now is:
How is
your edging to stop the slipping of a side slip with ski tips pointed left
different from
your edging to carve left?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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comprex, Ah ha I'll have to think about this ...... it's not is it? and when I'm side slipping I use my knees!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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ickabodblue, different prompts work better for different people. Roll the ankles,,, roll at the knees,,, tip the inside foot,,, move the hip inside. All tend to promote what needs to be done to carve a turn; tip the skis up on edge. Whatever turns the light on.
The only bad habit the knee focus can develop is to encourage a knee angulated position in your turns. Angulated is the position in which your lower leg (knee down) is tipped, and the upper leg (knee up) is not tipped or tipped less. Knee angulated positions are weaker in regard to resisting turn forces, and subject the skier to greater risk of joint injury. Not a big deal at the learning phase, where speeds and tipping angles are low, but it becomes more important to limit the knee angulation as your carved turns transcend into more advanced versions with higher speeds and bigger angles. Then you will need to start focusing on moving your pelvis laterally more, getting it away from over your feet and more toward the inside of the turn, which helps to straighten/align your outside leg and dump the knee angulation.
Not to worry about it too much now though. Focus on the quality of the carves you're making, and getting comfortable with the sensation of the skis doing the bulk of the work.
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FAQ
...but I'm going to the snowdome at the weekend 
