 Poster: A snowHead
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I know many will suggest more lessons, and on my next trip I plan to have more lessons, but I just wondered how skiiers deal with chewed up pistes - the conditions that seem to dominate late afternoon skiing. Though I'm regularly told I ski pretty well for the limited time I've been skiing, I must admit to struggling with this situation. Yes I get down the slopes, but those little hillocks (moguls) that develope during the day give me problems every time. I seem to be in a catch 22 situation; if I flex my knees and tend to a straight line approach I pick up to much speed and end up with aching thighs. If I try traversing with my legs straighter then the hillocks jar my whole body and everthing starts aching, with this tiredness creeps in, I end up getting more scrappy, develope more aches and have to rest. Have others suffered this condition, and if so how have you overcome it.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Fat skis, light feet and good speed.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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SMALLZOOKEEPER, care to expand on the light feet suggestion? I can buy fat skis, and with a certain disdain for personal safety I can manage good speed, but the light feet suggestion leaves me perplexed 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Phil Jordan, Be delicate, ski on eggshells. Suggest your initiation movements rather than force the skis into them. Hey.. sounds good on paper 
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Sun 8-04-07 21:25; edited 1 time in total
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Phil Jordan, is it the moguls or the soft snow you're struggling with? Are you talking about 'proper' moguls which are very closely spaced, or occasional mounds of snow around the piste?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Phil Jordan, yep as Scarpa sais - when it happens I feel great like I am just touching the snow and everything just happens. I am not at all sure how I do it though. Working both legs together and just letting the skis do their thing seems to be the way.
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rob@rar, well true mogul fields ( the sort that seem popular on french black runs) do stump me - can't seem to find a rythm(sp?) but I'm really talking about the soft snow mounds that build up at days end. Must admit I like Scarpa's words, though putting it in to practice could be the stumbling block. Thanks for your replies anyway folks.
Must say I'm a little surprised at the lack of response from one or two of our more tutorly posters on this topic. Am I the only person on the planet to have this problem?
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Phil Jordan, We all seem to have this problem hehehe. Guess we need to work on balance exercises a little. It's like watching someone really good climbing - like ballet on rock. Pure economy of movement and matchless grace.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Phil Jordan, in that case I think I use the opposite approach to the skiing on eggshells analogy. If there's a lot of soft snow on piste with occasional mounds of it piled up (just like conditions of the last few days, for example) I try to power my way through, using edging or pressure to control my line and trying to avoid rotating the skis as much as possible. I either absorb the mounds of snow by flexing my legs or blast my way through them.
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rob@rar, I agree - for the change to the average conditions then power works.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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rob@rar, I think one can extend the 'skiing on eggshells' metaphor past the power issue into even weighting and balance.
As a side example, when walking on a hard floor one steps quietest if the weight transfer is balanced across the entire foot instead of stomping with the heel, say. One can sort of use the amount of to and fro head bob instead of floor noise for feedback when skiing, very similar thinking applies.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Struggling with the same sort of conditions here, in late afternoon, I did find the fatter/heavier skis much more relaxing. However, they're not so good for the early morning conditions.... I am trying to use progressive, smooth, movements as described above, and improving when I am confident. I find that as soon as I get tentative and start rather rushed turns, my weight goes back a bit, and any question of
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Pure economy of movement and matchless grace.
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goes out the window! I think it's a bit like skiing in powder, isn't it? Don't rush the turns. But maybe it also depends on having a pretty solid technique to fall back on - so yes, the lessons next holiday.
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You know it makes sense.
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Phil Jordan, this is what seems to have been challenging me as well this season, especially when combined with poor visibility, so however much I try to "power through" my seeing sense tells me not to. I will follow this thread with equal interest to see what the advice is.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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What challenged me this year was slopes that had not been bashed and were very rutted & chopped up - and frozen hard like that. Not proper moguls but very rough and hard. I found them very difficult to ski, more a matter of just getting down. Is there any particular technique to skiing them - or should they just be avoided?? 
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Poster: A snowHead
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Phil Jordan, my tuppence worth.
You can either use the 'moguls/lumps of snow' to help turn or use them to help control speed by ski 'into' them during your turns
Also. By the end of the day your legs are bound to be tired, which makes everything a lot harder. Try doing the same run, of the type you hate, but do it earlier in the day and do it again and again. Find out what works best for you on a run you are familiar with first and consolidate it. You could also try using a positive pole plant to help with timing and flex.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Cut through them on your edges. Don't get caught back (easier said than done). You'll hardly notice them - you shouldn't let soft lumps dictate to you.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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And remember, your legs are your body's suspension. Try not to think of either flexed legs or straight legs. Instead they need to be able to flex or straighten to absorb whatever they meet. You can try blasting through choppy stuff on your edges, but that implies being rigid - you still need to be able to absorb the lumps and bumps that you will meet. And there's no point in just thinking about flexed legs as that implies your legs are flexed and nothing else - they need to be able to extend as well to fill the dips. Instead, try and thing of the suspension on a car (or better on an off road motorbike). You hardly see the car or bike bouncing up and down - nearly all the up and down movement is at the wheels with the suspension absorbing the bumps rather than transmitting them to the car or bike (or in the case of skiing, your body).
And don't look at the choppy stuff immediately in front of you, instead look a short way ahead and just let your legs respond to what your feet are feeling.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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stiff skis and good wax jobs... and I like Pete's last comment. Let your skis do the work.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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slopes that had not been bashed and were very rutted & chopped up - and frozen hard like that. Not proper moguls but very rough and hard. I found them very difficult to ski, more a matter of just getting down. Is there any particular technique to skiing them - or should they just be avoided??
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Have an extra hour in bed, let the sun do the work of softening the lumps, and ski the south facing slopes first. And don't stop at 12.30 for a long lunch which wastes the best snow at this time of year.
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