 Poster: A snowHead
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Hiy
What is better for total beginners 2 over 40's and 19 and 21 yr olds. Only trying a long weekend so not sure.
The ski school has offereed private lessons at 83 euros per hour but not sure what to choose and whether to do private or group.
Any advice greatfully received.
Thanks
Ruth
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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minicat,
For such a short period I would definately go for private rather than group. If at all possible I would also try and get a couple of lessons on dry or indooor slope before going so that your first lessons aren't how to put on skis and how to shuffle around before going home. It is nice to see a little of the mountain.
I'm a skier but I guess nowadays with discrimination legislation we have to acknowlede that people do have a freedom to board (So long as they aren't my kids  ).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Which is easier? if any!! 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Skis - two planks instead of one.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Boarding - with skiing you have twice 4 edges instead of 2 so it's twice as complicated.
But seriously - for people who have never been on the piste before, I would say skiing is the better option. Lifts will be much easier. You can stand there without having to worry about falling over forwards or backwards. You'll learn how edge control works and how the ski turns, which can then be translated later on to the board.
But I suppose - it's horses for courses. There are people who find boarding easier as they don't have the complication of two planks and a pair of poles to think about, and can just get on an do it. .
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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minicat,
I believe falling over in boarding can be rather more painful as tipping over a front edge can give you a rather heavy slam. Also you probably need rather more protective gear boarding than skiing which for a weekend may make it less appealing. This is hearsay as I haven't boarded but some of my best friends have spoken to boarders 
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Hi Folks, ever get the feeling that we might have just done this in my ski psychology thread- minicat, you will find that there seems to be concensus towards a feeling that skis are easier, but we also have a few advocates that feel that boarding isn't as difficult as some skiers seem to think it is.
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On balance, boarding is easier and quicker to learn than skiing.
Older people, whose physical skills have peaked, should take up boarding.
Younger people, who learn faster, can choose from either discipline.
Be aware, though, that younger boarders, particularly males, have an above-average accident rate. Bravado and inexperience are among the causes.
Some research indicates that private lessons may, in some cases, be up to 4 times more effective than group lessons. Bear this in mind when deciding for your weekend.
Good luck.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Whitegold, Having seen the learning curve of new boarders I agree with you rather than Megamum. I am surprised that anyone would say different, having seen/heard this issue discussed many times. The number of degrees of freedom of movement and need for leg coordination is way higher at a beginner skier level. Skateboard and surfing skills also transfer well. The accident rate is definitely higher per snow-user day however.
minicat, I might be inclined to wait till you get out there. If the snow is soft and plentiful try boarding, as skiing in soft snow is not easy for beginners. If the snow is hard/icy or sparse, go for skiing. If the four of you can bear each other, definitely go for private lessons.
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I both ski and board (as of this season). As total beginners and with only a weekend to play with, I'd say go for skiing. It took me three days of about two hours each time on the board before I could link turns and get down a slope. From what I see of complete beginners (quite a lot - I work with school groups) and what my instructor told me, this is quite fast progression thanks to the fact that I already ski and am used to the basic sensations of sliding down hills and using edges.
But if you do opt for boarding, invest in wrist guards.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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minicat, if you're good at skateboarding/surfing, then you'll have an advantage if you go for snowboarding.
stoatsbrother, Whitegold, when I look around the slopes, and see how many boarders have little or no technique, then I'm not sure I would agree that it is easier. I think it is easier to "fake" being good on a board, which is why so many youngsters then get into accidents.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Elizabeth B, I think it's very true that most of the boarders you see around the pistes are intermediates rather than anything else. We noticed this last season in CVL after Mr Lizzard had a lesson and started using his edges rather than scraping turns all over the place.
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stoatsbrother, It's not a question of agreeing with Whitegold, or me - as I have said before - I have never tried boarding so am not qualified to make a judgement either way - I was just reporting what appears to my personal opinion to be a concensus of previous threads, in particular my own ones.
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Megamum, sorry - that came out wrong. I still think, as do most people I have skied with who do both, that boarding is faster to get to a decent intermediate level. I have tried boarding in old gear many years ago and it made a dodgy knee hurt so I had to stop, but I am going to give it another crack sometime with soft boots on a poor visibility powder day (ie when it hurts less and no one can see me...). It would be really great to be able to do both well.
Elizabeth B, I think this is more about the reason Vauxhall Novas often seem to be driven badly and erratically, it is about young male driver attitudes rather than the vehicle. I ski more in the US than Europe and I think I see more bad skiiers than boarders there. I think petemillis makes a good point about lifts, and unless minicat is in a poma/t-bar free zone, that might be a good deciding factor.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I wonder if from an 'image' perspective whether Minicat's two young men would prefer snowboarding - From what I've seen on holiday and on the TV I wonder if it would seem 'cooler' than skiing for that sort of age group
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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stoatsbrother, I assume then that boarders take their boards off on a chair lift and hold them?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Megamum, No - they just have 10 seconds of terror at the top, rather than several minutes of been dragged sideways scraping a track as they have various soft bits removed by the t bar. If one falls in front of you it can be fun trying to jump them. I don't always get enough clearance though. 
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Elizabeth B, Well stoatsbrother, had suggested that if the resort didn't have a Poma lift (whatever that is) or a T bar - which I understand, that boarding would be easier. So I assumed perhaps he meant a lift system of gondolas or chairs, the only reason I could think of it being easier would be if the boards were removed on the chair lifts. I hadn't considered the twist and male factors of a T bar.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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A poma lift is like a T-bar, but instead of the T it has a button on the end, and only carries 1 person not 2.
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Elizabeth B, Oh, that's the only sort I've ridden with skis - we call it a teller-lift (sp?) in Switzerland - I call it a button lift - I'll have to call it a poma lift now - I can manage that OK - the T at my resort looks harder and goes up a collasally high steep slope to somewhere I can't see - the ascent looks terrifying - back to my thread aren't we?
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They're often known as button lifts, but Poma are the manufactuer of most (or all??) hence the name.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Elizabeth B, I used to find that confusing, because they make other types of lift as well.
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laundryman, it's a bit like Hoover. They also make washing machines!!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Megamum, this is how boarders deal with chairlifts:
1. Take back foot out, stagger into position at the bottom.
2. Sit down. Hopefully don't then realise that you're on the wrong side and bound to get entangled with your lift-mates at the top, causing widespread anger and fist-waving.
3. Lift safety bar with trepidation. Wriggle about so that you cling to the seat with only one buttock.
4. Wait until the last minute, when the board will run as flat as possible. Push hard. Try to get back foot onto stomp pad while also leaning on front foot. Get confused.
5. Fall down.
My one attempt at a drag lift so far has involved falling off at the bottom and being manhandled back on by the lift op.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Lizzard,
That's pretty much my experience. I like it when it's quiet and I can get a chair to myself. Failing that, I always ensure that I am at one side of the chair not in the middle. I don't mind short drag lifts....I can do them, it's just after a while things start to ache.
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Elizabeth B, solution so far has been to go up with Mr Lizzard, who rides regular - I get to the right edge of the chair with him next to me so that he steers everyone else off to the left, leaving me in a heap on the floor. Unchivalrous but effective.
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You know it makes sense.
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The last few posts look like an argument for beginners on a long weekend to start skiing, rather than boarding. Even fairly idiotic beginner skiers can get up a button lift on their first day but I still feel a sense of triumph getting to the top of even an easy button lift on my board, after several days spread over two years! The falling over factor is a major issue with many older people; they just don't like it. As a slowly improving boarder I can now quite often get off a chairlift without falling over, though I had an anxious ride up yesterday when, for some reason, three skiers suddenly leapt on the same chair as me, though there was no queue. I felt bound to warn them of the danger into which they had put themselves (I had overtaken them on the last bit of the run down, and I can only overtake rubbish skiers) but they just waved their arms and assured me there would be "pas de probleme". Just goes to show how little they knew. If you only have a long weekend, minicat, and unless you have a high pain threshold (or unless the group are already skateboarders or surfers) I would ski. Private lessons. Short skis (max chin height). Just look around you, on the slopes, at the average age of beginner boarders. It's around 13, in this resort, and dropping annually. I wear a helmet, goggles and neoprene face mask so nobody can tell I am 87.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thanks I reckon skiiing would be better as My 19 yr old daughter has broken her scaphoid 9 times and I have broken my metatarsal twice in the last 2 yrs!!
I think we need gold insurance!
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Poster: A snowHead
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minicat, As mentioned above....do consider a couple of lessons in the UK before going....
Tamworth Snowdome do a brilliant one day course called "learn to ski in a day". You won't actually learn to ski but will stand a good chance of getting to a standard where you can get down a green run in control.
I did this years ago and after a few practice sessions at Tamworth afterwards I went to Sierra Nevada and skied blues with confidence.
While learning...do try to maintain a 'can do' attitude as confidence is half the battle in the early stages.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Tamworth Snowdome do a brilliant one day course called "learn to ski in a day".
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I did the "learn to snowboard in a day" course at MK, as a means of deciding whether I wanted to learn boarding or not. I decided I did. Very good course, though 8 hours of boarding for the first time ever left me so stiff I could hardly move for a week.
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The ski school has offereed private lessons at 83 euros per hour but not sure what to choose and whether to do private or group.
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that's quite expensive - in our local ski school out of the major French holidays it's 52 euros for two hours for two people, and a few euros extra for third and fourth person. Which is excellent value. Where, and when, are you going minicat?
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My 19 yr old daughter has broken her scaphoid 9 times
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Hmm. Might be better to ski, then.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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hellfiresliding, My first experience of skiing was that course at Tamworth - Getting down the slope there at the end of the day gave me lots of confidence when I went to flaine for my first experience of real skiing - never looked back.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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pam w, shows what a bargain some of our local places are: 50 CHF/hour (1.6CHF = 1 Euro) regardless of number of people. Group lessons are 22CHF/2 hours or 61 CHF for 3x2 hours.
As a long time boarder just returned to skiing. I would expect that on nice short skis, skiing would be easier to learn than boarding.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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As a long time boarder just returned to skiing. I would expect that on nice short skis, skiing would be easier to learn than boarding.
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Yep, I think so too. Depends what you mean by "learn", of course. Fast learners (courageous AND well coordinated) can be boarding red runs competently by the end of a week whereas very few will ski red runs competently by the end of a week and some can't do it after many years. But most reasonably attentive and not hopelessly uncoordinated learners will be sliding around enjoying themselves on skis after a few days and hurting a lot less than if they spent the same time learning on a board. And enjoying themselves is what it's all about.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Oil and water mode
Go skiboarding - according to the Association Médecins de Montagne it is the safest snow sport too
http://sbmag.wordpress.com/2007/02/13/skiboarding-is-the-safest-snow-sport/
I anticipate the normal flaming on here, but start off on skiboards and depending on the speed you learn, progress up to ski's of course if you find you prefer skiboards then stick to them. I took an over 50 and an over 20 learner up last season both tried "classic" ski school and found it painfull and hard, when I put them on skiboards the learning curve was a lot quicker and less painfull. The skills you learn on skiboards are directly transferrable to ski's. One teaching method involves using a skiboard on one foot and a ski on the other, get to the bottom, head back up and swap feet.
As Pam says by the end of a week with snowboards you could be on reds. I ice and inline skate a lot, so I had a lot of the techniques as skating to skiboarding there is a lot of similarity (hockey stops for example), but after 2 hours with my instructor, I had gone from Blue to Red to Black runs and he said that was all he could teach me about carving..... it really depends on the student how quick the learning curve is.
As far as bindings are concerned, personally I would say dont use fix bindings over 84cm, get release bindings. (all of mine have release bindings)
Whatever happens I hope you have a good time on the slopes.
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Random curveball here on my mums experience aged 60.
Has just retired to a snowy place (Poland) and nearby there's a hill - not too steep but good enough for a slide - just hard work as you have to walk back up.
Her brother persuaded her to have a go on it - firstly with skis and secondly with a board. I can't believe it but she's actually picked the boarding as being easier and preferable to the skiing.
I think its to do with having 1 piece of equipment rather than 4 and that at least your feet are fixed in position and can't go sliding in opposite directions!
Ok its not like a real resort with lifts, or difficult terrain - but I was incredibly impressed.
Latest update is that she can do a heel edge turn and is now starting to practice the toe edge!!!
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mountain mad, no lift? boarding's good - wouldn't like to keep walking uphill in ski boots!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| minicat wrote: |
Hiy
What is better for total beginners 2 over 40's and 19 and 21 yr olds. Only trying a long weekend so not sure.
The ski school has offereed private lessons at 83 euros per hour but not sure what to choose and whether to do private or group.
Any advice greatfully received.
Thanks
Ruth |
83 euros per hour seems very very expensive, where are you going?
Expect to pay around 35-40 euros per hour in France..
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