Just started my Ski lessons this past week and am loving it and off to Canada in January.
Just a simple question, what is the difference between parallel turns and carving??
Thanks
Anette
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Welcome to snowHeads Anette
Old fashioned parallel turns involved getting your weight off the skis and spinning (skidding) them around underneath u, keeping them parallel as u did so (obviously). This was neccessary because the old skis were competely straight.
When carving, the skies do remain parallel but the technique uses the curved edge of modern skis to get the ski to do the turn for u.
Not that there aren't situations where skidding your skis is appropriate these days, but the carving turn is just one, rather efficient, way to turn.
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Anette, It's not a simple question. A parallel turn is a turn in which your skis are parallel - that's fairly obvious of course. However carving is basically doing a turn when your skis are on their edges, now this could be more or less on the edge (and you can carve a snowplough turn (sorry Admin), and/or be on their edges for more or less of the duration of the turn. Sorry - it's a bit complicated if you've only just started learning. Thus a parallel turn can be carved, or not; and a carved turn can be parallel, or not. They are neither mutually exclusive nor mutually inclusive.
I knew I was bound to get something wrong on this one
I see your point, technically, but I've never actually heard anyone refer to carving when they didn't mean using the same edges of both skis. A snowplough uses opposite edges (please don't say I'm wrong on that ).
btw. Anette if in doubt, listen to Easiski not me
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Ah young admin, but what if you only use one ski ? Then one edge you have, and parallel it is
Yoda, but can a curved edge ever truely be parallel?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
FenlandSkier, well I hope the tracks that my train went round two days ago were
After all it is free
After all it is free
On parallel curves - Two curves are parallel if every normal to one curve is a normal to the other curve and the distance between where the normals cut the two curves is a constant.
Although parallel curves are at a fixed distance apart they can look rather different.
Not sure if that helps my point or not I think for a ski on edge where the radius changes it does but for a constant turn it doesn't. hmmm, more beer, more reading methinks.
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FenlandSkier, two skis each turning at a constant radius are parallel; they're describing arcs of concentric circles, and they meet the requirements set out in your quotes.
I think we may be over analysing.
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
richmond, I've read a thread about this before: arcs can't be concentric on skis...beer please
Perhaps the question should be "what's the difference between skidded and carved turns?"
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
Anette, easiski is right of course (she's a top-notch professional instructor), but I'd like to simplify a bit (I'm an average recreational skier).
Roughly speaking, if you're carving, the skis will generally be parallel (ignore the mathematical niceties above!) and the skis (and you) at any instant will be moving in the same direction as they are pointing. If the skis are moving down the hill at an angle to the way they are pointing, they may still be parallel, but you'll be partly "slipping".
Generally speaking, carving (when the technique is perfected) is very efficient but requires a fair amount of room. An advanced skier will incorporate slipping to negotiate tight spots - there's nothing wrong with it.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Anette,
Welcome to 's
Admin's first answer ticks all the right boxes for me but how do fish carve?
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
Hmmm, surely if you apply unequal pressure to your skis while carving, the degree of flex will be different - and if you get it perfectly right, they will describe parallel arcs?
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
AlexF, in which case you'd need to put nore pressure on the inside ski...oh no, not again
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Anette, You poor thing - what must have seemed like a simple question to a beginner (and an excellent first post BTW), has opened yet another can of worms!
laundryman, thanks for the vote of confidence. bFrom another thread I was beginning to wonder if I was just a young (boy?) hooning around for my own pleasure and telling lies into the bargain.
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
I'm a novice (only been once, and I ski like a rally driver!).
I'm taking some lessons over the next few weeks ahead of a trip to Austria at the end of next month, and have been trying to figure the difference between carving and parallel, as I'd like to stop skiing like a rally driver! I've read lots about the ski position, ski edges and using the curvature of the skis to make the turn, as opposed to just skidding, which all makes a lot of sense (especially if you take a few seconds to study the shape of ski's and the impact on the shape of putting weight on the central position).
However, there also appears to be a significant difference in the body position required of each technique (not that you can refer to what I currently do as a technique!). When Parallel skidding, my whole body turns in broadly equal terms which presumably makes short-turns incredibly hard work. When Parallel Carving, it appears that the upper body stays pretty much the same throughout the turn, largely pointing down the slope, and the legs just go from side to side (bringing the upper body closer to the ground depending on the severity of the turn).
Have I got this about right?
One of my problems last time I went skiing, was the natural inclination to lean back rather than forward, and as my upper body is constantly on the move, it's hard to retain stable positioning, which creates some rocking, which means at some points you naturally lean a little back, which means you fall over! Am I right in assuming that when carving, because the upper body pretty much stays where it is, stability is greatly improved and the chances of falling over greatly reduced?
Of course, as a newbie, I could just be talking rubbish!
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:
old skis were competely straight.
But the weren't. They were shaped, just not as shaped. It was possible to carve on them, but you got far less turns per run because they were straight(er)
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Token74 wrote:
I'm a novice (only been once, and I ski like a rally driver!).
I'm taking some lessons over the next few weeks ahead of a trip to Austria at the end of next month, and have been trying to figure the difference between carving and parallel, as I'd like to stop skiing like a rally driver! I've read lots about the ski position, ski edges and using the curvature of the skis to make the turn, as opposed to just skidding, which all makes a lot of sense (especially if you take a few seconds to study the shape of ski's and the impact on the shape of putting weight on the central position).
However, there also appears to be a significant difference in the body position required of each technique (not that you can refer to what I currently do as a technique!). When Parallel skidding, my whole body turns in broadly equal terms which presumably makes short-turns incredibly hard work. When Parallel Carving, it appears that the upper body stays pretty much the same throughout the turn, largely pointing down the slope, and the legs just go from side to side (bringing the upper body closer to the ground depending on the severity of the turn).
Have I got this about right?
One of my problems last time I went skiing, was the natural inclination to lean back rather than forward, and as my upper body is constantly on the move, it's hard to retain stable positioning, which creates some rocking, which means at some points you naturally lean a little back, which means you fall over! Am I right in assuming that when carving, because the upper body pretty much stays where it is, stability is greatly improved and the chances of falling over greatly reduced?
Of course, as a newbie, I could just be talking rubbish!
your upper body should not be turning round with the skis, your upper body should remain pointing down the fall line throughout the turns. But Im no instructer.
But the weren't. They were shaped, just not as shaped. It was possible to carve on them, but you got far less turns per run because they were straight(er)
I was going to say something about "straight" skis too but from a slightly different tack
To carve a turn, your skis (or turning ski for the snowplough), need to be on edge, not slip sideways AND they must create an arc. With "modern" carving/more shaped skis the natural arc is more accentuated - essentially stick most current skis on an edge at any speed and it creates an arc. Take some old time skis - like the Dynastar Course GS with the tomato on the front (some of you will know what I am talking about - basically straight, stiff planks for those who don't) and it would be nigh on impossible to carve a turn at slow speeds as you couldn't create that arc because you need force to flex the ski. However with decent speed (or too many pies and a slower speed ) it would be possible to create the arc required and carve perfectly well.
I think what has also changed with the advent of "carving" skis is the terminology and technique too - now people talk about carving as something which must involve both skis, more equally weighted etc. It is perfectly possible to carve a turn on just your downhill ski with the uphill ski not contributing a lot (similar to the snowplough really where the non-turning ski is effectively a stabilizer).
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Thu 8-01-15 13:36; edited 1 time in total
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Ah, the Dynastar Course GS! I loved those skis - fast, stable and bloody hard work to turn! I must get into the roofspace of my garage and see how the old 203cm beauties are getting on!
I'm taking some lessons over the next few weeks ahead of a trip to Austria at the end of next month, and have been trying to figure the difference between carving and parallel, as I'd like to stop skiing like a rally driver! I've read lots about the ski position, ski edges and using the curvature of the skis to make the turn, as opposed to just skidding, which all makes a lot of sense (especially if you take a few seconds to study the shape of ski's and the impact on the shape of putting weight on the central position).
There's nothing wrong with sliding turns, it's what 99% of the people on the hill are doing most of the time - I don't think I've ever seen someone carve down a steep black!
However, there also appears to be a significant difference in the body position required of each technique (not that you can refer to what I currently do as a technique!). When Parallel skidding, my whole body turns in broadly equal terms which presumably makes short-turns incredibly hard work. When Parallel Carving, it appears that the upper body stays pretty much the same throughout the turn, largely pointing down the slope, and the legs just go from side to side (bringing the upper body closer to the ground depending on the severity of the turn).
Have I got this about right?
More or less, yes.
A carved turn is all down to the skis. Your weight bends the skis, making them curved. Put your knees in to the hill so you're on the edges and as gravity pulls you down the hill, the curved edges describe an arc that you turn around. A carved turn is like a car going around a corner normally. You turn the wheel, the front wheels follow an arc and the rear wheels basically follow the same arc and you find yourself facing in a different direction.
A slipping turn is part down to the ski carving and part down to you forcing it by slipping the tails of the skis. Going back to the car analogy this is like going round a corner on ice and losing the rear end. You turn the wheel, the front wheels start to turn but instead of following them the rears loose grip and you spin. You still end up facing in a different direction, but a lot quicker. And probably in a ditch in the car.
Other than that the technique is basically the same 'good skiing' technique.
Token74 wrote:
One of my problems last time I went skiing, was the natural inclination to lean back rather than forward, and as my upper body is constantly on the move, it's hard to retain stable positioning, which creates some rocking, which means at some points you naturally lean a little back, which means you fall over! Am I right in assuming that when carving, because the upper body pretty much stays where it is, stability is greatly improved and the chances of falling over greatly reduced?
This is the wrong way around. There are 3 basic skiing turns everyone learns; snowplow, parallel and carving, with snowplow being the simplest/first to pick up and carving the hardest/last.
From the sounds of it you've mastered the snowplow and are mastering parallel turns - and trying to get over the same 'hump' as everyone else, getting over the front of the skis. A carving turn isn't really something that helps you get forward, more something you can do once you've learn to get forward, though trying a few might help you get forward.
Pick a nice green (so you're not going fast and can just bail at any time without injury) and point down the slope. Once moving, and with your weight forward tilt (just) your knees towards the slope, rolling your skis on to one of the edges and you should start turning that way. Roll your knees back and over the other way, on to the other edge and you should start turning back, through down hill untill you're turning the other way.
Still on a green try the same again while leaning back. It won't go very well
This isn't some carving turn magic it's just that the front edges are the ones that really 'do the steering' in all turns, just like the front wheels of your car - how many vehicles (other than forklifts) steer with the rear wheels?
Keep skiing - it will come.[/url]
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
A common thing I find - when talking to people I know about skiing and proper posture etc... is when I say to my friends/people I know to 'bend your knees more' they immediately forget that there is indeed a knee joint in ones leg and all bending seems to take place from the waist resulting in a very gorilla like posture and sticky out bums.
A simple way to describe a bent knee, I've found over the years is to tell them to put their knee over the front of their boot, miraculously the same illusive knee joint seems to remember it does exist and now it works in a bending fashion as it always has up until that point.
After all it is free
After all it is free
easiski wrote:
pizza & fries...
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
Have a look at Ally Ross videos - starts you off on how to get on the edges to initiate the turn. www.skibetterwithali.co.uk - there's even an app now
Worked for me anyhow - I won't attempt to describe it here as the other posts have done it much better than me.
Also have a look at the Ski School vids mentioned above - really good covering absolute beginners up - free on You Tube too.
They do an iphone and android app too. Have a good time whatever you do!
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