 Poster: A snowHead
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For those of us on the idle side that dont DIY our holiday
Which TO would you use and why
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Ski Independence.
Because they aren't like a TO, more like a very good travel agent who do everything for you, and are very flexible.
Last edited by Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person on Mon 2-10-06 21:25; edited 1 time in total
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Depends on your budget. Worked a season for Equity and they didn't treat anyone shabbily whilst I was there.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Inghams as i have found them the cheapest
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Wear The Fox Hat wrote: |
| Ski Independence. |
I can agree with this, I have used them once and they were very helpful.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Ski France - good honest value
Mark Warner - quality nosh, usually good accommodation
Inghams - professional, good late deals
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Depends what you want, where you want to go, when you want to book.
For a Late Deal you could risk any of them.
For Switzerland I like Kuoni. Decent hotels, scheduled flights, rail transfers to most resorts and your luggage gets sent on separately once you check it in at the UK airport or Swiss rail station.
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| Latchigo wrote: |
Depends what you want, where you want to go, when you want to book.
For a Late Deal you could risk any of them.
For Switzerland I like Kuoni. Decent hotels, scheduled flights, rail transfers to most resorts and your luggage gets sent on separately once you check it in at the UK airport or Swiss rail station. |
but you pay through the nose with Kuoni and everything you have mentioned above is available with most of the other TO that use Switzerland
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Mark Warner - my brother uses them all the time, good for families, but expensive
Neilson - used them once, no problems and good rep cheap holiday
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Booking DIY can be very straightforward, so maybe don't discount it altogether? I find making my own arrangements a less stressful way to go on holiday because I'm not reliant on being herded around with a flock of other holiday-makers.
I've used a couple of smaller operators who I thought offered a better service than some of the big TOs. Alpine Action (catered chalets in the Trois Vallees) seemed good, and were staffed by people with a bit more epxereince that the stereotypical gap year student.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Personally Ive used Inghams several times both winter and summer and been happy
Some of the others I have used have not been so great and usually for things that could have been avoided. I.e. Getting back to an airport hours before a flight is due to leave or being dumped in a car park at -120c to wait for the next transfer bus
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Chris Brookes, Whenever I have costed it out separately, I have found Kuoni to be cheaper than what I would pay independently for the same deal.
They are a bit cheaper than Swiss Travel Centre and cheaper than Crystal.
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Silver Ski
Ski Olympic
Finlays (a bit posher)
All very similar. Good range of chalets, excellent food, child friendly(ish), fabulous staff, ski hosting, Sunday Transfers. Food better than Mark Warner (IMHO) and not so many punters up their own back bottoms.
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You know it makes sense.
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Inghams are fine.
I wouldn't have too much of a problem with Crytsal or Thomsoms or the rest as long as they tried to do what they said they would do.
There is not much point paying a knock down price and then complaining about a knock-down service.
MW do things well but charge for it. Its not fair to compare them, say, with Neilsons unless the price is pretty much the same
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Latchigo, i guess it depends where you are wanting to go skiing. Years ago we used to use Kuoni to go to Murren but then found Inghams to be much cheaper using the same hotel and flights etc. We have venturd to other ski resorts and looking at both TO's Inghams were cheaper for us.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Ski Miquel and Le Ski both good. Both are quite small independents tho, so your choice of resort is limited. Momentum are a "made-to-measure" specialist who were fine the one time I used them.
I have also used SkiWorld and Ski France: both are cheapish, and you get what you pay for. I wouldn't avoid them, but I wouldn't recommend them either. In particular, the Ski France rep we had was virtually invisible after the first day. And our chalet was a rabbit-hutch with no hot water. Apart from that, no problem! Have used SkiWorld a few times, and the standard of accomodation, food & staff-service is somewhat variable.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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First chocie if you fancy spending most of your holiday sitting on transfer coaches 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Chris Brookes, Indeed. I have not used to Kuoni for Wengen. I used Crystal for Wengen - the Bernerhof the cheapest place in town. The hotel was fine though, despite the price. Crystal were OK too. The transfer was by coach and I am not a big fan of coach transfers.
I have used Kuoni for Grindelwald and Davos a few times.
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First choice and neilson have been fine for me, direct transfers, decent reps, good acomodation and cheap. Ski france were good from memory. Topps travel were bargain basement but v good value and friendly reps.
Crystal seem to have the most appaling transfers with no reps and random waits (bitten twice now, never doing it again no matter the price!)
aj xx
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Don't use TO's, because DIY is easier and cheaper (especially if you want anything other than a simple 7 days arriving on Saturday type trip). If I ever WERE to use a TO again, it would never, under any circumstances be Thomson. They completely screwed up a trip to Les2Alpes for us and then 'lost the contract' with our chosen hotel at Morzine in the same season. Their reps were less use than schoolkids, and their airport connection arrangementds were abysmal. They were not even that cheap! Never, ever again 
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| ajhainey wrote: |
| Crystal seem to have the most appaling transfers with no reps and random waits (bitten twice now, never doing it again no matter the price!) |
The problem with Crystal is that they are big. I don't know the exact figures but they must do between 5- 75kpax in a winter season. This should give economies of scale but in terms of individual resorts they are just another player. Jonny ski lift owner doesn't give a damn about how big they are in Courchevel, all he sees is his own resort. The problem with tourism is that there really are not huge margins to screw out of hotels, lift operators and ski hire businesses so this leaves one major area where costs can be cut by volume - transfers and flights.
You want to move 500 people in four planes on a Saturday from Chambery to various resorts in the Tarentaise. 500 pax? That's ten coaches. The problem is your 35 Val d'Isere pax are spread over 3 planes. That means hanging around at the airport, drop-offs at Moutiers (to fill the coach) and Tignes before you reach your destination then dragging around resort if your hotel is at the end of the run. Maybe a 5 or 6 hour transfer. (remember the brochure transfer time is from leaving the airport to crossing the entrance to resort... it is in the small print in the contract). This means that Crystal can transfer you to resort for a fiver whereas it would cost XYZ Chalets 15 quid to do the same.
Reasonably priced, reliable and quick transfers from airport to hotel are still the key that keeps the TOs in business... at least for those ski resorts that have a properly functioning reservation system online.
Crystal's size means that they can fly out of more destinations than other operators, at the risk of being on a W rotation. The low-costers have eroded this advantage a lot recently.
==
Caveat
I've plucked my figures out of thin air although they are probably fairly realistic
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Well, I used to use FreshTracks quite a lot - but, as SCGB members may know I am a bit unhappy about them at the moment (link to SCGB members only section). Nevertheless, they are a good way of being reasonably sure you will be with skiers of similar standard - and the instructors and guides I have come across on the SCGB holidays have been excellent.
Other than that, and I know it's not a trendy thing to say, I have always got along fine with Thomson - though I accept davidof's comment on transfers.
This year, DIY/snowheads events for me.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Garfield wrote: |
| For those of us on the idle side that dont DIY our holiday |
My experience is that using a TO is more hard work than DIY. Choosing resort and accomodation is a similar exercise (you may have more of both to choose from if you DIY, but it's easy enough to cut it down, especially if you can get a few personal recommendations). Booking the flight is an e-mail, booking the hotel and transfer (car hire or minibus) e-mail or a web page. Job done. You've got a better flight, much better transfer, the hotel/apartment of your choice, and probably a lot cheaper than a TO (if you're going in school hols, anyway).
In my experience, even the simplest TO holiday involves several 'phone calls to half wits on the end of the 'phone, mistakes in the booking which have to be corrected, appallingly early flights, horrendous tranfers, irritating reps pushing things you don't want to buy.
No doubt some or all of these problems can be overcome by using an upmarket TO or paying supplements, but the cost difference becomes even worse, and it won't be any better than the same hol booked DIY.
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richmond, Agreed. Of course, if anything goes wrong, you have to unscramble the mess yourself. No ABTA/ATOL bonding - though you might get some come-back through your credit card. That said, I have never had a problem.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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achilles, I think that financial loss (if hotel or airline goes bust) is a reasonable gamble. For other, practical, problems, I'd rather be on my own than rely on a TO.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Skivolution: Good mid-priced chalets in Courchevel with excellent coaching included - although some rooms can be a bit small.
Frontier Ski: Canada specialists. Very knowledgable and very helpful.
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richmond, I've pretty much to that conclusion. You can also be more sure of what you are getting. One thing that I don't like for Freshtracks holidays is the tendency to arrange separate eating arrangements and contract meals.
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You know it makes sense.
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davidof, those are all the reasons why I started to go DIY rather than with a TO. Once I was actually in the resort things were fine, and I rarely had need to trouble the resort rep other than to find out the (ludicrously early) time of departure at the end of the week. It was the getting to and from the resort that was often a terrible way to start or end my holiday. Although DIY transfers are more expensive, I no longer dread them like I used to.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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So far used snowbiz who were excellent and Erma Low who again have been very helpful. Happy with both 
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Poster: A snowHead
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| rob@rar.org.uk wrote: |
| Although DIY transfers are more expensive, I no longer dread them like I used to. |
And of course the options for private transfers are expanding as some enterprising Brits and French have realized that the market exists.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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achilles, richmond, In fact (assuming you have reasonable holiday travel insurance) you are BETTER off booking direct with the hotel.
Firstly you may negotiate a better room rate (particularly if you are staying 'non standard' dates. (This may not be possible through a TO). Secondly, if you have any issues with the hotel you are their DIRECT customer, not one of a group 'managed' by a rep.
Third, as achilles, says you are not subject to any 'second class' status and are free to eat what you like when you like.
Most important of all, your contract with the hotel is direct. Only if the Hotel goes bust will you have a problem. We booked (through Thomson) to stay at the hotel Tremplin in Morzine, because it was right by the slopes. 4 weeks before departure Thomson informed us that they had 'lost the contract' with the Tremplin and we had been re-located to the Viking (a much less favourable location that we had already rejected). We cancelled with Thomson and made our own last-minute arrangements. Had we booked the Tremplin direct this would never have happened. All we got back from Thomson was a refund of our deposits, nothing for the hassle of having to re-book at the last minute
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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We've used Inghams and have been happy enough with them; we started doing DIY this year in Val Thorens, partly because we were looking for a better transfer and partly so we could get the accomodation we wanted.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Never had a problem with any TO, either with transfers or hotel. Crystal's reps have probably been the worst, in that we just haven't seen them at all, but we don't use the reps for anything anyway. Perhaps we've just been lucky 
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| davidof wrote: |
| rob@rar.org.uk wrote: |
| Although DIY transfers are more expensive, I no longer dread them like I used to. |
And of course the options for private transfers are expanding as some enterprising Brits and French have realized that the market exists. |
Yes, although the costs that I've seen for people who are already doing this are a bit eye-watering.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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rob@rar.org.uk in some areas (Tyrol for example) 'semi-private' transfers are available; a minibus of about 6 or 8 people is taken to the resort. Not quite as convenient as private transfer, but cheaper, and massively better than TO transfers. Transfers alone would put me off using a standard TO.
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To be fair, the Freshtracks holidays usually have dedicated transfer arrangements, a big plus.
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| richmond wrote: |
| rob@rar.org.uk in some areas (Tyrol for example) 'semi-private' transfers are available; a minibus of about 6 or 8 people is taken to the resort. Not quite as convenient as private transfer, but cheaper, and massively better than TO transfers. Transfers alone would put me off using a standard TO. |
Last time I travelled with a TO they were just beginning to offer this service (to the Trois Vallees resorts), but it was quite a lot more than our budget allowed so never got to take advantage of it.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Esprit if you have children.
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| richmond wrote: |
| rob@rar.org.uk in some areas (Tyrol for example) 'semi-private' transfers are available; a minibus of about 6 or 8 people is taken to the resort. Not quite as convenient as private transfer, but cheaper, and massively better than TO transfers. Transfers alone would put me off using a standard TO. |
Andy Cleaver has been doing this for Chamonix and the Arve resorts for a good 6 or 7 years (maybe more). I used Andy as a business customer (that is as a business organizing transfers for guests) and found him to be very professional and reliable. For example a shared transfer from Geneva to Chamonix is
44 euros or Chambery to Courchevel it is €66.00
http://www.a-t-s.net/
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