 Poster: A snowHead
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Does anyone know if you can still buy those party-popper streamer things that attach to your skis so when they fall off in deep powder you can still find them - had a near loss last season in which even in only a bit of powder (20 cm or so) my ski more or less totally disapeared following a close-up snow inspection/tasting 
Do they reliably unfurl or are they prone to acting as leashes hence giving you a good chance of getting smacked in the face by a ski? Do they clip off so you don't have to keep re-inserting them into your trousers everytime you (deliberately) take your skis off?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Stuart, I've got some which I bought in snow & rock (where they still sell them) when i bought my skis and couldn't contemplate losing £220 of ski under a lump of snow. I've used them twice and found that they kept unattaching themselves from the binding which was a real pain - hence never used since
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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they're known as "powder traces" and you can buy them more or less anywhere you can buy skis. Never used them myself, although like steve I've had occasion to wish I had done so - took me 20 minutes to find a buried ski.
the ones I have (well, that mrs NBT has) will clip on and off as you wich
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I've some, totally useless and a complete pain. Having your bindings set correctly helps enormously.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I too have had the exhausting (and a little scarey) experience of losing my skis in the snow. They are never usually far away or very deep, just obstinately elusive (like soap in the bath). Surely it is time we started using modern technology. There are Key Finders. So why don't we have Skey Finders?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Funny you should ask, Jonpim. It seems Atomic at least is working on it.
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Hmmm, well I'm not sure whether to bother with the streamers or not now - wonder if losing them in the snow counts under the "loss of ski equipment" bit of the insurance policy!!?
Hi-tech ski finders sound like a good idea, maybe I shall investigate that idea further....
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Buy some key finders and screw them on just behind the back (not front) bindings?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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skanky, actually, you've just given me an idea for it... put a Recco reflector on each ski, and, since we're talking about off piste, just use your avalanche transceiver to find them!
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Wear The Fox Hat, just hope that if you get caught in an avalanche, they don't dig your skis out first. 
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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also I don't think I fancy carrying the recco finder thing in my backpack as I 've heard it's a hefty beast 
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You can't detect Reccos with transceivers - the piece of kit the pisteurs carry to detect Recco is massive relative to a transceiver, not something you'd want to be carrying in your backpack. Don't think the pisteurs would be too chuffed to be called out for a lost ski!
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You know it makes sense.
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How about a flag (a bit like a football corner flag) that's attached to the outside (in case of accidental firing) of the ski, along the side. The rear (base) of the flag is attached using a sprung hinge, and the front (top) is clipped into the front binding. When the boot is removed from the binding, the top of the flag is released and springs upright, thus making it easily spotted. If the ski's upside down, it should flick the ski up so it should stick out of the snow.
It would also make spotting the ski outside of a bust restaurant easy, too.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I find them very reassuring - but mine are home made from some orange 1" polyester ribbon from a chandlers, tied onto the bindings (when I had Look turntables) or the brake, with the end stuffed up the trouser leg. Cost 50p for 2 metres.
When I've used them, I have never had a binding release. When they are back in my room its back to slicing the snow with the tail of the ski, although new shaped skis and raiser bindings don't seem to go far from the site of the fall compared to the old skinny skis. 
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Poster: A snowHead
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As I recall Ortovox made some little blue transmitters for sticking on your skis, findable by avalanche transceiver (presumably a different frequency??). Anyone know anything about them?
BTW skanky, does "bust restaurant" give a new meaning to the phrase "eating out"?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Alan Craggs, I seem to recall they were officially or colloquially known as ski mice. Never caught on though and I’m not clear what the logic ever was, having them on the same frequency as normal transceivers is obviously no going to work out so you’d need another transceiver or dual band.
The reality is too many people have their bindings set too loose, more experienced off piste skiers have their bindings set correctly and while loosing a ski is a concern it’s just not a major concern.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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ise, well that may or may not be so (Ali Ross for example insists on setting his bindings at the lowest possible for his parameters) for experienced skiers, but there is nothing more frustrating and knackering for learner powder skiers than looking for lost skis imo.
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Alan Craggs, I'm massively irritated by people with bindings too loose, there's one piste in particular on the way back to my flat where there's any amount of loose skis flying around. I've had more than one whistle past or had to hop around and avoid them.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Well, don't moan at us! It's the ski techies who set them for us according to our answers about height, weight, skiing ability (and doesn't everyone say "intermediate  ) etc!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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maggi, it's rarely the rental brigade. (although if you lie about your weight, the binding could be set wrong)
Some people screw their bindings down at the end of each season, then forget to do them up again.
And sometimes shops don't do a proper job mounting bindings...
About 4 years ago in Whistler I was skiing with a group of people, including a guy who had just got his new skis from Slush & Rubble. As he made his first run, on nearly every turn, he came out of his skis. I went over to check what was up, and the bindings were sitting at 3, basically totally wound down. The shop had forgotten to set them before he picked them up. I set them up quickly on the slope, so he could ski down, and got him to go into a shop at the resort at lunch to get them set properly - I don't guarantee my binding setting abilities when it's blizzarding at -15c, and you've had to take your gloves off to use the screwdriver...
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| Quote: |
The shop had forgotten to set them before he picked them up
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There you go, techies again!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I once had some off-piste skiing with Patrick Vallancant's school in Argentiere and when asked how tightly bindings should be set, he responded that he secrewed them up to the maximum then added 3 further turns. Not recommended for everybody.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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stuarth, is it possible at all that the SX9s are a longer or stiffer lever for the snow to act on your bindings?
After once landing flat on my back, with the tails buried in the snow (very deep, so no lasting damage to back or skis) and spending the next 45 mins without any leverage whatsoever to get them out, off, or even to flop over bellyside, I agree that having them off is best.
(I managed to find the binding release with the pole tip, under the snow. I did have to replace those pants, however).
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Quote: |
BTW skanky, does "bust restaurant" give a new meaning to the phrase "eating out"?
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Hmmm, must do. Look at the positions of the "e" and "u" on the keyboard. No ordinary typo, that.
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You know it makes sense.
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Back to setting bindings, I still maintain it's usually the ski tech's fault. Last Saturday night at MK Snodome I hired skis. Techie asked my weight (that's all - no other questions) and hearing it was 8 stone 6 pounds said "OK, that's 3.5". When I pointed out my own skis were set to 4.5, he said "We set them lower because it's only a short slope."
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Maggi, that's true - because there are more obstacles, they do set the bindings lower, it also keeps them safer from the insurance point of view, it wasn't just a story mad up by one ski tech.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Wear The Fox Hat, I will bow to your greater knowledge! (I didn't really care one way or the other as I didn't plan to fall down on a slope which is practically flat - but it just seemed a weird thing for him to say!)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| maggi wrote: |
| Back to setting bindings, I still maintain it's usually the ski tech's fault. Last Saturday night at MK Snodome I hired skis. Techie asked my weight (that's all - no other questions) and hearing it was 8 stone 6 pounds said "OK, that's 3.5". When I pointed out my own skis were set to 4.5, he said "We set them lower because it's only a short slope." |
They've a fair point and it's a variation on what I was saying, it's a balance of risks, setting aside the mechanics of the release, then there's the consequences of release/non-release to weigh, at high levels some risk of personal injury exists obviously, at low levels (and one of my personal hates) then the released ski can hurt other people directly or indirectly. The balance of risks would, on an indoor slope, make me agree that a generally lower setting for a hire ski on the indoor slope is better. Round the mountain the decision's different so choosing a lower setting means people are oblivious to the adverse effect on other slope users or choose to ignore it.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I use 'powder streamers' and find them very effective, though it's usually due to Sod's Law - if I have them on the skis stay on, if I don't use them, the skis come off and diappear!
I did use the Ortovox ski mice (with the F1+ Transeiver that can be set to receive the different frequency the mice emit) for about ten years but most modern skis cannot have the mice fitted (because of the lower length and the addition of damping devices the bit of the ski left is usually too thin to take the fixing screws).
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| David@traxvax wrote: |
| I once had some off-piste skiing with Patrick Vallancant's school in Argentiere and when asked how tightly bindings should be set, he responded that he secrewed them up to the maximum then added 3 further turns. Not recommended for everybody. |
Presumably that was someone like FanFan and not the Patrick Vallençant who gave you that advice?
I have some Powder Ribbons but rarely use them although I wouldn't want to lose a ski in deep powder. They loop onto the front binding and then tuck under the cuff of your ski pants. If the ski comes adrift they unfurl and usually a fair portion is left on the surface. Generally when people loose skis in pow they search far to close to where they fall. You often need to climb up 15-20'and dig there.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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What about those little flags that they use on bicycles? Set them perpendicular to the slope off piste and parallel to on piste. They then have the additional advantage that you will not get cut up by people passing too close!
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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There is a whole new area of technology called RFID, essentianally Radio Frequency Identification Devices which is driving the price of of RFID devices (chps) down to cents. These are being used by major retail chains, Walmart etc to locate and identify stock. Putting these things on skis or even building them in during the production process, sounds like a no brainer. Companies like Prada are already using them to identify customers.
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David@traxvax, I think there's a point you've missed. The key driver for RFID adoption is that the tags are cheap, the reader marketplace is orders of magnitude smaller and not (broadly) price sensitive.
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ise, accepted but like all new technologies it will be driven by mass take-up. I am certain this technology will be incorporated in all sorts of equipment. At the moment it's being driven driven by the major retail chains, ie. Walmart are insisting that all their suppliers adopt this technology. How long will it take to move from that, to inclusion in all produced goods? I raised this as a possible pointer for the future and I'll bet that if it does become omnipresent then the price of readers will fall proportionally.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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David@traxvax, take a look at the Atomic link above.
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David@traxvax, no, that's a popular and flawed assumption about technology. It's based on the premise that production cost is purely a function of engineering; that is true for some technology but by no means all. For, example Moore’s law is an example where that is true, it's not a Delphic prophecy but an engineering observation about that particular process. Even in the case of Moore’s law there are some boundary conditions around cost of raw materials that remain fixed regardless of scale of production.
Another flaw, specific to RFID in this circumstance, is the assumption that generic RFID reader technology is appropriate to this application or that it even exists. There’s no particular reason for this to be true.
RFID range is controlled not by the tag but by the reader. In fact, technically, RFID range is a function of the power of the reader or the frequency it operates on. So, low frequency RFID (30-500 kHz) has a range less than 6 feet, that’s no good for this application I suggest or it would be ineffective in practice. High frequency RFID operates in two bands, 850-950 MHz and 2.4-2.5 GHz (sounds familiar  ).
So, already the reader technology isn’t looking quite as ubiquitous as you’d think. It’s not self evident to me that there’s a massive requirement for handheld High frequency RFID, the nature of the deployment is that fixed readers are used, i.e. warehouse tracking, side of road for vehicle tags etc. And, again, this is not a price sensitive area, pricing around the level of desktop computer or cash register would look around right. We’re also potentially into an area where we may have regulatory issues with frequencies.
It’d turn (RFID ski locator) into a fairly specialized piece of kit without much mass-market application, like, for example, transceivers versus PMR’s. PMR’s cost very little while transceivers remain a niche product and pretty expensive considering they are fairly similar pieces of kit.
The fact Atomic have registered really speaks to the US patent system.
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FAQ
