 Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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No, this is no drag act.
We're comparing the relative qualities of ski magazines. There's the subjective way of doing it (which can get a bit pretentious and condescending towards the popular market) or the slightly more objective way, which is to measure what the public are actually buying.
One interesting question: which UK ski magazines have ever made a profit? (I believe it's a very short list!)
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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David Goldsmith, I'm not sure which unexciting club thread you started to refer you to, but this one may well cover it - though I almost lost the will to live as I started to plough through. But this is all stuff you have churned through in the club forum. It has no place here. No one wants to stifle discussions on the magazines (including S&B) - so Do Not Respond would be wrong for the thread as a whole - but right for your comments in it, perhaps.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Eh?
Nick, you've completely lost me. Magazines (the topic at hand) are about front covers, logos, articles, design, photography, advertising .... and public appeal, commercial success.
I'm not referring to any 'club thread' whatsoever.
All I'm saying is that there's a tendency in the elite classes of skiing to slag off magazines that sell very healthily (and occasionally make a profit), because certain aspects of the sport must remain ... exclusive, darling.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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Those two US magazines have impressively long histories. They're probably the highest-circulation ski magazines in the world. I have stacks of old copies in the office:
Skiing Magzine: 'ratebase' 400,000, 'audience' 1.2 million
Ski Magazine: 'ratebase' 450,000, 'audience' 1.6 million
They're both part of Time Warner, which also now owns Warren Miller.
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While they offer some interesting articles, I do not think that ski magazines (generally) offer good value for money when you consider their content. Also, while some magazines are quite clearly aimed at 'punters', some of us 'punters' are quite interested in all aspects of skiing. No, I don't heli-ski in Alaska, but I do find well-written articles about this sort of thing interesting. While I don't religiously follow ski racing, I do try to watch world cup skiing when I can and I would like to see more skier profiles etc. in magazines. I also like to read kit/ski reviews as well as where the best restaurants are in Fernie.
IMO there is a place for a magazine that can cover a bit of everything in a monthly issue. Don't other similar mags succeed eg. Cycling Plus?
Also, to all those editors out there, you can't go far wrong by sticking a freebie on the front cover. I would suggest a pair of Hestra gloves 
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I think the best freebie we ever stuck on the ski magazine I worked on was a lip salve. Predictably they were all ripped off the covers by non-buyers.
I recently bought my daughter a girlie magazine that had a pair of sandals in a bag, stuck on the cover. Things are getting very very silly indeed.
Are you sure you don't want a pair of ski boots stuck on the cover?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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conor, See if you can grab a copy of S&B and form your own opinion. Can't guarantee the best restaurant in Fernie being covered (though if you can blag a meal at the Beavertail Lodge you won't go far wrong - otherwise the Old Elevator is worth a look) but I think it touches most else of what you want, these days. The editor has taken into account reader feedback.
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Always a good thing. It's also very profitable to take into account non-reader feedback.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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OK Mr DG. Let's put it simply. Forget the quality. It is an undisputable fact that American ski magazines are thinner and weigh a lot less than they used to. Ski and Board weighs a lot more than it used to. Would you dispute that? Knowing you, as I do, you probably would! Funny, meeting you here rather than on the ski club website, I feel like it's an away match!
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I meant to write indisputable. Don't you have an edit button on this site?
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| I meant to write indisputable. Don't you have an edit button on this site? |
Yes, it's the  button on the right----------------------------------------->
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You know it makes sense.
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Sorry, Fenland Skier (don't mean to be rude - really I don't - but aren't the Fens a bit flat for skiing?) - learner driver here. Never posted (except once, last year) till the last few days. You all seem a friendly lot. I still feel like a Nottingham Forest fan (which I am) in a Chelsea crowd! Mind you, I know a few of you, which makes it easier. Achilles, for example. Good lad. Can't help being a Kiwi. Barcroft, another mate of mine.No idea what his sobriquet is here. Doctor chappie, I believe. And Goldfinch aka Goldsmith. Good skier. Damned good skier. But needs a year away from websites. Do him (and others?) a power of good. Means well. Sometimes. I'd better stop there or I'll be banned and sent back to the City ground where I belong.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I have skied on Lincoln's South Common. Just a couple of runs. But I have done it. I'd guess the Lincolnshire Wolds could be OK in a good winter.
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Poster: A snowHead
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achilles, as a member I do receive and read S & B, and I too particularly like the historical and more geographical articles. However, I still feel there could be more depth and substance to most skiing magazines.
Essentially, I do not think I am getting enough to read from a monthly magazine out of these publications (Fall Line, S & B etc.). I do remember some racing coverage in some of last year's issues of S & B, but not in much depth and not sufficient for a monthly IMO.
I appreciate that these are small specialist publications and maybe that's the problem?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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The Fens are a bit flat for skiing, despite the splendidly named villages of Gedney Hill and Weston Hills there's not a lot of height around these parts, in fact some days it's a struggle to make it above sea level.
We are a friendly bunch mostly, we're also a snow deprived bunch this time of year so there's a few good arguments along the way too.
The goldfish seems to be peeing in a few pools at the moment, maybe a spell in cleaner waters would do him good for a while.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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jacksonhole [crazy name, crazy guy], no, only a fool would dispute an indisputable fact. Are the US magazines losing pages (on a year-on-year comparison, comparing the same months' issues) or is the paper thinner?
Ski and Board has certainly increased in pagination.
Here are some UK ski magazine circulations, verified by the Audit Bureau of Circulations, as quoted by magforum.com [scroll down for table] for January-July 2005:
Daily Mail Ski and Snowboard: 17,846
Ski and Board: 21,005
Snow: 34,300
[Other UK ski magazines are not audited by ABC.]
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Snow is just give away. So there. I have just noticed that on March 6, Alistair welcomed me to snowheads. As I never posted again until now (averaging a rather poor .001 post per whatever), I didn't see his welcome. Alistair, whoever you are, thank for your welcome and forgive my unintentional churlishness. I thought DG was a finch, not a fish. But hey, what do I know about life - wild or otherwise?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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[Edit: the posting below was compiled while jacksonhole was posting the above]
By the way, in comparing the above, the different distribution methods are important:
Daily Mail Ski and Snowboard primarily is a mix of newstand sales and paid subscription sales
Ski and Board is primarily distributed to SCGB members, with some newstand sales
Snow is (I believe) entirely given away in ski-related outlets
Here is some more ABC data, extracted from their website:
Daily Mail Ski and Snowboard: circulation includes 9,487 newstand sales, plus 3094 subscriptions
Ski and Board: circulation includes 18,499 SCGB member copies, plus 2,066 newstand sales
Can't find data for Snow.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Don't bother Dave - it'll be meaningless.
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jacksonhole, David Goldsmith, you just made a p@ssed skier crease up
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I gotta go to bed - this is all far too exciting. At this rate I'll soon be averaging one post a day. Only another thousand or so to write before dawn. On the other hand I may not be back. Arnold has spoken.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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jacksonhole, welcome back to snowHeads  .
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| Snow is just give away. So there. I have just noticed that on March 6, Alistair welcomed me to snowheads. As I never posted again until now (averaging a rather poor .001 post per whatever), I didn't see his welcome. Alistair, whoever you are, thank for your welcome and forgive my unintentional churlishness. I thought DG was a finch, not a fish. But hey, what do I know about life - wild or otherwise? |
You've not reall met SMALLZOOKEEPER yet. He's the fisherman.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Personally I never go to football matches, but if jacksonhole ever offered me the opportunity I'd go for it like a speed skier down a lift shaft.
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You know it makes sense.
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| David Goldsmith wrote: |
| Personally I never go to football matches, but if jacksonhole ever offered me the opportunity I'd go for it like a speed skier down a lift shaft. |
DG you might make a good referee. You would certainly be used to a lot of abuse. Mind you that is mostly in print, though I have yet to attend a SCGB AGM. Things may be different there. 
ps you are unlikely to see Forest playing Chelsea for a while.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Thank you Alastair, for the re-welcome. Thank you Cathy for saying nice things. I have seen plenty of Chelsea Forest matches in my time on earth, including Jimmy Greaves' last game for Chelsea when he got all 4 in their 4-0 win. The last joy Forest had with Chelsea was a 6-0 thrashing about 7 years ago. Ah, the good old days. Anyway, I mustn't linger. Tomorrow the entire magazine has to be finished - off to the printers Friday and straight on to issue 2! Just thought I'd stop work for a breather. Very therapeutic!
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Poster: A snowHead
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David Goldsmith, I am worried about you. I have worked out that your 10,821 posts here equal something like three months of your life solidly on the site. Plus who knows how many months on the SCGB site. You need to get out more. Let's go to Chile and Argentina, you and I, and get some fresh air and face shots into our lungs. Typing is bad for you. Skiing is the cure! Now I really must do some more typing. Can't have blank pages in Ski+Board! Night all!
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| ..... Let's go to Chile and Argentina, you and I, and get some fresh air and face shots into our lungs. .... |
Unfortunately, unless you will be travelling by ship (or you're both very good swimmers) that will be a bit tricky. 
(David's message Wed Aug 02, 2006 6:06 pm refers).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| Now I really must do some more typing. Can't have blank pages in Ski+Board! Night all! |
How about an A-Z guide to skiing curiosities? Extinct resorts, odd ski technologies, strange characters, that sort of thing.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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You wanna write it, FS? It would have to be for next year now as we are full for this year! But sounds fun. Tell me, what's this mega-snowhead, super-snowhead thingy?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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I'm a relatively newbie to the sport and still learning, only been back into it for about 5 years now but I do like reading about the quirkier side of life, my A-Z would be missing more letters than it has i'm afraid.
mega- and super- are tags awarded when you contribute to the costs of running snowheads (although you can decline them if you're the shy type), other tags like Freerider and Hors Piste are based on the number of posts you've made.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| You wanna write it, FS? It would have to be for next year now as we are full for this year! But sounds fun. Tell me, what's this mega-snowhead, super-snowhead thingy? |
Answers the question, why don't monthly magazines carry very much racing information?
Don't worry jacksonhole, it won't stop me from 'possibly' buying your ski mag, I'm not that interested in ski racing. (I also understand that you *could* have allowed space in your future issues to put live data as an when you get it, the cynic in me suggests you haven't...)
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While I have browsed Ski & Board I can't say I have ever been tempted to buy it. It still strikes me as too much of a club mag and I can't see myself being a member of SCGB. It would be interesting to see if membership subs were dropped £20 & the magazine axed would there be too much uproar?
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| jacksonhole wrote: |
| David Goldsmith, I am worried about you. |
Well, join the club. It's £49 per annum and you get regular magazines on how to worry in the most exotic mountainous locations. Our agony aunt is Annie Wilson - here to help with any emotional and personal issues.
| Quote: |
| I have worked out that your 10,821 posts here equal something like three months of your life solidly on the site. |
Oh my god. I think I've spent less time 'solidly on the toilet'.
| Quote: |
| Skiing is the cure! |
Thank you, Doctor. I was worried (sic) that you were going to recommend a lobotomy. How many times should I take this drug per day?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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parlor, (I also understand that you *could* have allowed space in your future issues to put live data as an when you get it, the cynic in me suggests you haven't...) Didn't really understand this Parlor but I suspect it was a criticism of some kind? If you could explain what you meant I might be able to respond!
David G. - keep taking the tablets my dear. The lobotomy is only a last resort. Which resort? Dunno really. Achilles, forgot to react to your remarks about the impossibility of sweeping David off to the Andes. See what you mean. If we went by boat the snow wouldhave melted, but we'd be in time for next summer/winter, if you see what i mean!
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jacksonhole, If space is tight I would not be bothered about racing news either (I now expect a string of posts from people saying how interested they are in ski racing).
It is very good of you to come here and respond to all the comments, positive and negative, about Ski & Board. Most people would decide they did not need that.
I suppose, in mitigation, it is not every job that allows you to take a year out to ski a different resort every day.
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FAQ
