First time posting, but have used the site to gather information in the past and found it quite helpful, thought it would be worth leaving a little review on my recent snow train experience in it’s current set up which might be useful for those looking to book next year, or even better somebody from Eurostar might spot and be able to improve it in places!
23/24 SCHEDULE:
Outbound:
- Passport UK & French passport control check in
Depart London St Pancras at 09:01
Arrive Lille 11:22
(Change train in Lille - passport control already done in London)
12:29 Depart Lille
16:23 Chambery
17:06 Albertville
17:40 Moutiers
18:03 Aime - La Plagne
18:14 Landry
18:25 Arrive Bourg St Maurice
Return:
- No passport control
Depart Bourg St Maurice 08:09
08:20 Landry
08:32 Aime - La Plagne
08:50 - Moutiers
09:25 - Albertville
10:16 - Chambery
14:32 - Lille Europe
(Change train and go through French & UK passport control)
15:35 Depart Lille
15:57 Arrive London St Pancras
Both outbound and return trains had a stop at Charles De Gaulle Airport for a crew change only.
OUR PLAN:
Our plan was to use the ski train to reach a ski resort for the first time without the need for a road transfer, and to reach our accommodation fully by rail. This lead us to Les Arc 1600 as the only option, catching the Ski Train to Bourg St Maurice and then using the funicular to get up the mountain and arrive within walking distance of our accommodation.
LONDON > LES ARC 1600
We arrived an hour before departure at St Pancras and entered the usual triage style check-in process at the Eurostar terminal, check in seems dealt with on an urgency based system which for us, was speedy and without incident, those with skis were picked out and brought forward to help with scanners / loading the train (not too sure of the reason as I didn’t have skis)
First train to Lille went as planned, we arrived into Lille on time where you need to move over to the connecting train (an old red Thalys one). There isn’t much in Lille station, a Paul and a small stationary type shop, however there is a Westfield shopping centre opposite with a large Carrefour
and other lunch options inside. We opted to walk over there with cases in tow to grab a picnic lunch for the next leg and would recommend - it took around 30 minutes to all in to walk over, shop and return.
We boarded the train from Lille and staff were on hand to pile up cases and skis on top of tables and seats at the end of carriage, this seemed a slight shame as a lot of the more spacious table seats are used up for storage which wasn’t the case on the traditional Eurostar train over from London which maybe had a little more natural storage / was a longer train. Legroom was OK (in standard class) I was expecting an old European train to be quite generous but it was alright, helpful that it’s much easier to stretch legs than a flight
The atmosphere was great on the train as you’d expect full of people heading to the slopes, the cafe bar filled up towards the end of the journey, running out of a few beer options as people got into the swing of things, but it all seemed pretty good natured rather than rowdy.
We arrived on time into Bourg St Maurice, and had a very narrow window to catch the next funicular up to 1600 (free return ticket with train ticket - also included in ski pass), it’s a bit of a trek to the funicular with some mandatory stairs, about 1km walk however we managed to exit from the southern end allowing us to get over an make it, just! I think theres a shuttle bus from the other end of the station but went for the walking option.
This allowed us to check in to our airbnb, but importantly get some basic supplies and ski gear before the rental and only mini market shut at 7.30pm. Very tight but just managed.
LES ARC 1600 > LONDON
Keen to avoid road transfer, we had one option to make the 08:09 departure which was the first 7 minute funicular departing at 07:30, I think the following departure is 07:50. This was all fine but once down the mountain the gate that was previously open allowing us to exit from the southern end of Bourg St Maurice was now locked, and the free shuttle bus was nowhere to be seen. This meant a slightly painful walk the full length of the pretty long platform, before heading all the way back up to embark, we’d assumed this might be for a ticket check at least but unfortunately not, it was a pointless detour avoidable by opening a gate (note we followed the sign at the southern end directing us to the Eurostar service!)
We boarded a very dirty train, I overheard another passenger remark they could cobble together a croissant from all the crumbs everywhere, I lowered my tray table to a damp tissue and some plastic rubbish which was pretty gross. I’d guess the inbound train on the Saturday doesn’t get cleaned before heading off on the Sunday.
Arrival to Lille was on time, and this time required passport control. In it’s current state with an hour change I didn’t mind using the connection to get through immigration as it allowed a more casual embarkation in the morning, had we had to complete this at Bourg St Maurice we’d be unable to use the funicular and would be looking at a taxi down for an earlier arrival.
The changeover in Lille caused a pretty big queue in the terminal, and having to drag all cases around the station was pretty tiring, it would be ideal if they could be left on the platform, put onto the connecting train, or ideally handled by Eurostar staff like an airline connection. This became a gripe when we were told there was no escalator down to the platform only stairs, seemed pretty dangerous watching a few hundred people clamber down with heavy cases and ski gear.
It pretty much took the full hour to connect in Lille and we were back on our way to London arriving roughly on time.
PRICE:
Our tickets were £99 each way per person, this included 2 carry on and ski gear. This seemed extremely competitive vs a flight and usual private road transfers. I highly doubt you can find return flights with baggage and a transfer to arc 1600 for less that £198 return PP.
TIMING:
I was quite optimistic about the train offering a decent competition to flying, at least for the door to door time of arc 1600. Generally I find people underestimate the time of getting to airports, check in, the flight, baggage collection and then transfers so actually the train isn’t too much longer. I think the arrival time is the big problem for the Eurostar at the moment, at least in the case of Arc 1600 most things shut at 7.30pm and we were lucky to make it up quickly, I imagine if you’re transferring to another resort, ski collection and grocery may have to be left til the following day. I think a solution would be an earlier departure time, I don’t think most would mind a 07:30 / 08:00 departure arriving 16:30 / 17:00, would be more helpful for ski collection etc which is usually achievable on a fly / transfer option.
LUGGAGE:
We only took 1 bag each but I couldn’t help feeling like I’d really had to lug it about a lot more than flying. A big problem is the stations don’t have trolleys, and I’m amazed at how those with ski’s, families with kids or the more elderly can manage.
SCHEDULE:
The Saturday departure and Sunday return make finding ski accommodation slightly tricky which usual operates sat/sat or sun/sun - we picked up an airbnb to get around this. I’d heard that operators were offering sat/sat accommodation then transferring customers elsewhere for 1 night which isn’t ideal. Also ski passes tend to also follow a sat / sat pricing so we had to add another day on, which obviously is great to get more skiing, but the pricing for adding 1 extra day isn’t optimal.
OVERALL OPINION:
I’d rate the ski train 6/10 overall. The price was great, and we were anticipating a little bit of faff / adventure taking the train so the experience was definitely positive. I think it’s getting great press as it pushes the green agenda, but the service felt very clunky and bodged together and ultimately not a viable competitor to flying and road transfer just yet. It has the potential to be a contender, bringing back quicker direct trains and maybe timing them properly on days to line up with the usual ski accommodation schedule and I’d be tempted to use it again.
Any questions let me know and I’ll try and respond quickly!
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@welloffpiste, thanks for sharing as this is incredibly helpful. I may look at a solo trip late Feb and this reassures me that despite clunky gear to carry, it may well be preferable to driving (which is my usual choice). If you don't mind, would you share which platforms you used to purchase the rail tickets?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Thanks for sharing this. I found it very interesting, although disappointing to see your rating of 6/10. It seems that this is related getting on and off the train at Bourg? For sure they need to have lifts at the funicular end of the platform.
re the return journey, tour ops like Inghams and Travelski have been offering accom in Bourg in their inclusive packages to remove the issue of the early start on the way back. I'd probably suggest that if you did choose to do it again. At £198, London to resort, it is excellent value IMO.
FWIW I only went one way in December, but you can see my thoughts here:
Thanks for the replies. The 6/10 stems from a few factors when comparing to flying from inconvenient arrival times, the Sat - Sun schedule impacting accommodation (at least I struggled to find traditional ski chalets & apartments catering for these days) , and the general DIY feeling of the service - I can see historically they did offer a direct train which would probably kill 2 birds with one stone by arriving earlier, and removing the need to move luggage. It does feel like if they had a think they could probably make the transfers slicker and more comfortable for the passengers, trolleys and luggage storage maybe.
I love the idea of using the train generally, but for a resort further from the station requiring a bit of road transfer too like Tignes (time & cost) I don't think it's an amazing alternative unless it offers some benefit which could be arriving earlier - however my opinion is also based on preferring to arrive in daylight (hard but doable mostly) and classing the travel day as a bit of a faff day too where you can get unpacked, collect ski's, passes and a bit of groceries sorted leaving day 1 of skiing completely hassle free.
The option of moving kit for one nights stay elsewhere does feel like an avoidable inconvenience - I would prefer to stay an extra night in the same place with earlier transfer for sure, most return ski flights are pretty early, so doing similar would be comparable. I'm guessing Inghams & travelski etc are having to do it for accommodation availability rather than convenience. Without a package, moving for one night also adds stealthy costs if you're booking yourself reducing the value a bit, same with the extra day on the ski pass. I think in reality flying with transfers overall would have been a bit cheaper for the uplift that I paid on accommodation this time round. But the trip was more proof of concept of full rail travel rather than approaching purely for the cheapest possible option overall. If dictated by budget, the tickets at face value are super reasonable, but I'm not sure how the hidden costs stack up incurred by the scheduling - in a perfect world they'd offer sat & sun depart and return both ways competing a bit closer to flight flexibility and then it's definitely cheaper!
Tickets were purchased directly from Eurostar website.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Interesting take @welloffpiste. I have travelled to Les Arcs for 9 years by train every year. It seems this years Travelski offering is clunky compared to just booking it yourself. I paid £220pp for 6 of us to get Eurostar to Paris then TGV from Paris to Bourg for this coming March. 7 day holiday with 6 days skiing. No faffing on the accomodation required. So Travelski will be competing with self bookers in the future if they keep up this clunky Lille changeover and extra night accom. I cannot see them doing that next year.
@welloffpiste, great post. Would love to do the train in some ways but way too clunky for me in it's current guise and with our current situation - compared to driving.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Anyone heard if this service will run next season? When are tickets likely to go on sale if they do run the service?
After all it is free
After all it is free
@rob@rar, ticket went on sale at the end of August for this season
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
@nbt, thanks.
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Ski the Net with snowHeads
Macker13 wrote:
Interesting take @welloffpiste. I have travelled to Les Arcs for 9 years by train every year. It seems this years Travelski offering is clunky compared to just booking it yourself. I paid £220pp for 6 of us to get Eurostar to Paris then TGV from Paris to Bourg for this coming March. 7 day holiday with 6 days skiing. No faffing on the accomodation required. So Travelski will be competing with self bookers in the future if they keep up this clunky Lille changeover and extra night accom. I cannot see them doing that next year.
Exactly this.
PLEASE JUST BRING BACK THE OLD SKI TRAIN!
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
@welloffpiste, I had a look at using the Eurostar ski train but decided in the end that it was more hassle and less convenient than self booking train travel via Paris. From the sounds of it, I was right, which is a shame.
When I travel by train I hop over to London on the Friday evening, stay in a cheapish hotel, then catch an early train. Never mind arriving in daylight, I'm skiing in the afternoon
It does involve transferring from Paris Gare du Nord to Gare de Lyon, which I do by the RER. There's plenty of escalators, so no carrying luggage up and down stairs.
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