 Poster: A snowHead
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I suspect there are threads on this already and if so my apologies, please feel free to merge or point me to them.
So, youngest daughter has suddenly decided she'd like to work a ski season this year, after her A-Levels. Preferably Austria (we've skied there a lot plus she's already trying to learn some German!), open to anything really, as long as it gives her time off to ski.
Obviously Brexit (boooo. I'll leave it at that) has made the whole right to work thing tougher, but can anyone tell me - is it a non-starter, or are there organisations/employers that are still happy to take Brits and do all the work permit stuff?
Any pointers welcome!
Thanks
RC
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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It is possible but I suspect very difficult for someone with no history of working in Austria. I was talking to the secretary/office manager about this just this week. We have one colleague who is a UK passport holder and non resident and this is the second time she has managed to get a work permit and visa. The authorities required a lot of input from the office including dates she had worked for us previously, why it had to be her, why we couldn't just get an Austrian instructor etc. I made the comment that the office manager wouldn't do the work for someone who had no experience (even if we knew them as many of our UK instructors over the years have previously been clients of the ski school including me and my son) and she said there would be no chance.
Maybe there are agencies now that are setting up wannabe seasonaires but I've not heard of anyone getting any work that way.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@ratechaser,
Work as what?
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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I think a number of businesses here in the 3V (so France not Austria) have been prepared to go through the rigmarole of employing Brits and getting visas, but it’s a costly exercise for them, and my guess is the employment market for 18 year olds is small. Tim Wall in La Tania definitely did it for staff at Pub Le Ski Lodge last winter as we asked a staff member about it. I think your best bet might be to look at the resorts with a high level of British visitors a history of and currently British owned and run businesses, and approach them directly. (I.e. in Val d’Isere, Meribel and the like). I sat on a chairlift the other day with a bunch of young seasonaires who were all English (chatting about Pony Club  ). I didn’t gain the impression that they were dual nationality or had an Irish granny but I think they were probably graduates. I have noticed many Brits working in bars have proper French language skills.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Do they not hate us British in the EU, maybe that's an over generalisation but there's at least some truth to it.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
maybe that's an over generalisation
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Yes, it is. Of course some people hate the Brits, like some Brits hate the EU. But most are more discerning. My French friends regret Britain's departure very much. But that's no consolation to unskilled British youngsters, who speak little or nothing of the relevant language, but would like to spend a season working in the Alps. Like my grandson. He has worked in pubs, mostly on food preparation and washing up! He has a good mark in GCSE French but these days it seems you can get one of those, if you are academically inclined, whilst being completely unable to hold the simplest of conversations! He's planning to go to Australia, but right now is deeply immerged in A level Chemistry.
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| Ram80 wrote: |
| Do they not hate us British in the EU, maybe that's an over generalisation but there's at least some truth to it. |
Not at all, at least in France. They may hate the fact that our money is no longer supporting the EU and the potential ramifications for their own contributions but they don't hate us on a personal level. Other than Macron, of course.
The French owner of three ski shops in my part of the 3Vs openly tells me that he far prefers British customers to French ones. My understanding is that many French restaurateurs in "mixed nationality" tourist areas feel the same.
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I get the impression that restaurants etc often prefer Brit customers to Parisians. But that's not saying much.... 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Quote: |
Do they not hate us British in the EU,
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@Ram80
Not at all. Well, not in my experience of trans-European travel for work and living in Switzerland and France...
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| Kenzie wrote: |
@ratechaser,
Work as what? |
Basically anything - she's already got about 18 months experience at the sharp end of hospitality (golf club and pub work) and she can hold her own well, so was thinking bar work, but really chalet hosting, maybe even repping. She's a very competent skier, so maybe even kiddy ski school teacher? She's likely to want to go with a friend so ideally both doing the same thing.
Put it this way, while I'm supportive, I'm also not bankrolling a 'gap yah' for her, so she has to find something to pay the bills...
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
kiddy ski school teacher
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I think all ski instructors need appropriate qualifications. Child care/nannying maybe, but would need good German for that, I imagine.
It's a shame that the opportunities for seasons doing what was basically "poo-poo work" for the British catered chalet companies have dried up. Lots of school leavers learnt a lot, and had a good time, doing that. There's some argument that they were "exploited" but I reckon that's rubbish. They were bright and hard working kids, with some initiative. They were able to earn their keep and a LOT of ski time. How many kids doing low-wage jobs in the UK can even keep a roof over their heads, let alone pursue an expensive hobby for many hours a week.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| pam w wrote: |
| Quote: |
kiddy ski school teacher
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I think all ski instructors need appropriate qualifications. Child care/nannying maybe, but would need good German for that, I imagine.
It's a shame that the opportunities for seasons doing what was basically "poo-poo work" for the British catered chalet companies have dried up. Lots of school leavers learnt a lot, and had a good time, doing that. There's some argument that they were "exploited" but I reckon that's rubbish. They were bright and hard working kids, with some initiative. They were able to earn their keep and a LOT of ski time. How many kids doing low-wage jobs in the UK can even keep a roof over their heads, let alone pursue an expensive hobby for many hours a week. |
Exactly this - she has her head screwed on and tends to view as an opportunity, what others might see as exploitation. Damn shame if there are no more opportunities out there.
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The chalets were operating with disregard for local rules, and of course the loss of free movement, with Brexit, just hastened a process which was already underway. I don't think any of the kids doing those jobs saw themselves as "exploited" - they were mostly well-educated and had choices! They were not like illegal Albanian immigrants in the UK being forced to work in car washes and stacked up 10 to a bed in seedy lodgings.
Though some of the lodgings were rather seedy..... 
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You know it makes sense.
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Still a number of.good companies do chalet holidays in 3v and Val d'Isere employing Brits, and getting them visas
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Back in 2010 I started working a couple of ski seasons, the first one was in Les Arcs where I repped for Crystal. Back then the rep team just in Les Arcs was 14, with a similar number for the chalet team. So hundreds of staff across all of the French resorts, pretty much all UK residents. Who is doing these jobs now, and how? Surely it’s still happening, just a bit more difficult to get visas?
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Dav wrote: |
| Back in 2010 I started working a couple of ski seasons, the first one was in Les Arcs where I repped for Crystal. Back then the rep team just in Les Arcs was 14, with a similar number for the chalet team. So hundreds of staff across all of the French resorts, pretty much all UK residents. Who is doing these jobs now, and how? Surely it’s still happening, just a bit more difficult to get visas? |
The reps have been largely replaced by U.K. call centres. This year for example, Crystal have one rep for the whole of Switzerland (I often see him on the train). Most of the catered chalets have ceased to exist.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| ratechaser wrote: |
| Kenzie wrote: |
@ratechaser,
Work as what? |
Basically anything - she's already got about 18 months experience at the sharp end of hospitality (golf club and pub work) and she can hold her own well, so was thinking bar work, but really chalet hosting, maybe even repping. She's a very competent skier, so maybe even kiddy ski school teacher? She's likely to want to go with a friend so ideally both doing the same thing.
Put it this way, while I'm supportive, I'm also not bankrolling a 'gap yah' for her, so she has to find something to pay the bills... |
As Frosty says (and he has personal experience - his son) there are UK tour operators prepared to pay for work visas for the correct staff. I would recommend a teenage gap-yearer to look at chalet-hotel or chalet work. How is her French?
What is she looking to do for the rest of her gap? Just ask as I've done a fair bit of travelling on the 'cheap' around the world as well as being an ex-seasonnaire.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Crystal have plenty of reps in Austria. We've just got back Hinterglemm (today!) and ours was Finnish. The previous one was from the Netherlands. No English accents but did hear a broad Irish one.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@maggi, exactly, at the start of December I was sharing a minivan transfer from Munich airport to the Zillertal with a guy who was going to be repping for Crystal. He was from Ireland, so no problems for him.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
So hundreds of staff across all of the French resorts, pretty much all UK residents. Who is doing these jobs now, and how?
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Scandis, Dutch, Irish, and Brits with a second passport. It's not exactly the kind of job that it's hard to fill, plenty of young people wanting the ski season experience. It's also not a job that requires a huge amount of expertise or qualifications so there's a large pool of suitable candidates. Plus most of the Scandis and Dutch speak better English than us now 
From a visa point of view NZ or Canada may be more straightforward options now.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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I feel for you; my daughter wanted to do the same and a good friend of mine who runs a chalet rental business in Switzerland was more than happy to take her. This was intended for a LONG time but Brexit killed it. For those already in resort it’s possible to remain but there are hoops to jump through (another British friend who runs a ski school in Switzerland would lose her right to live/work there if she left the country for more than 90 days).
For those wondering who is now doing all the jobs that Brits used to do it’s now mostly Greeks and Scandinavians and a small number of individuals who were already in-resort and for whom their employers could (and were prepared to) secure a visa.
I think Canada/NZ/US are the best options now I’m afraid. My daughter still wants to do a season but is looking at Canada and potentially trying to get her ski instructor qualification whilst there too.
I’m a Brit, resident in Germany and with a permanent visa but that only entitles me to live/work in Germany, not the EU. It’s all a great shame as far as I’m concerned.
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As most have mentioned, France seems to be the main place where visas are being sorted for Brits. I haven't come across anyone in the Zillertal so far this season that has been sponsored for a visa by their employee. Brits were either already here, or have an Irish passport.
Canada via the working holiday visa is likely the easiest/best bet. Mind you, employee housing would be your next hurdle....
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@ratechaser, I think you will find Austria is a no go, far too many hoops to jump through to be worth it. Germany has a scheme (under 35 I think) whereby non EU people can get a temporary visa to look for work, I believe for 6 months. Not sure what the exact restrictions are, dont think bar work counts, but certainly around Munich easy to find work especially if you speak a bit of German. We had a Canadian guy in the office last week on exactly this scheme, we are giving him a bit of part time work and he has already sorted a full time job with an IT company. He and his partner speak no German and have been here for a couple of weeks.
The issue, as with most places, is finding affordable accommodation and paying for health insurance, whether that would leave enough to be able to go skiing a couple of days a week in another question.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Blackblade wrote: |
I feel for you; my daughter wanted to do the same and a good friend of mine who runs a chalet rental business in Switzerland was more than happy to take her. This was intended for a LONG time but Brexit killed it. For those already in resort it’s possible to remain but there are hoops to jump through (another British friend who runs a ski school in Switzerland would lose her right to live/work there if she left the country for more than 90 days).
For those wondering who is now doing all the jobs that Brits used to do it’s now mostly Greeks and Scandinavians and a small number of individuals who were already in-resort and for whom their employers could (and were prepared to) secure a visa.
I think Canada/NZ/US are the best options now I’m afraid. My daughter still wants to do a season but is looking at Canada and potentially trying to get her ski instructor qualification whilst there too.
I’m a Brit, resident in Germany and with a permanent visa but that only entitles me to live/work in Germany, not the EU. It’s all a great shame as far as I’m concerned. |
Thank you. From what I'm reading here it does sound like Austria might be a non starter which is indeed a great shame - her French is non existent, she is trying to learn German because she loves skiing in Austria so much.
Interesting points about Canada - there is someone she knows that is out there this year for the season, so if that is an easier route, then maybe... will have to have a word with the parents about how that got sorted out.
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| Dav wrote: |
| Back in 2010 I started working a couple of ski seasons, the first one was in Les Arcs where I repped for Crystal. Back then the rep team just in Les Arcs was 14, with a similar number for the chalet team. So hundreds of staff across all of the French resorts, pretty much all UK residents. Who is doing these jobs now, and how? Surely it’s still happening, just a bit more difficult to get visas? |
In resort we currently have 2 Irish, one Italian and a Czech, last season mainly Irish. Lst time I looked Crystal were only asking for EU passport holders.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Andorra or Switzerland?
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In Cervinia, at Xmas, all the Crystal reps we came across were Irish...
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You know it makes sense.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Quote: |
In Cervinia, at Xmas, all the Crystal reps we came across were Irish..
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We met Irish people working in Pila, too. Makes sense!
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Poster: A snowHead
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Canada pretty tough if you are under 21 according to my niece who is a ski instructor out there. Also places like Whistler etc accommodation is really hard to find so if you can't drive that is another barrier.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Orange200 wrote: |
| Andorra or Switzerland? |
Yes, lots of Brits (and South Americans) working in Andorra with no EU passport because it’s not in the EU. Work here would mainly be bar/restaurant or ski instructing (if she’s qualified). My stepson is on his second season instructing.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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I’m currently in 3V and was chatting to an English lady who lives and works here full time.
She said the English owned companies very rarely employ the French. They have to by law advertise the job.
The French like to work hard and save hard where the English like to work and party.
Go to the likes of Meribel and there are more English workers than French.
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