Bit of a rant but just wanted to get some up-to-date recommendations of bootfitters from people.
Basically, I've never had boots that I get on with 100%. Skied since ~3, 30+ years, comfortable everywhere on the mountain where you don't need a harness and rope to access, fairly aggressive skier.
Best pair I've ever had are a pair of 30.5 Atomic's (can't remember model) that I bought 2nd hand (new) on ebay in ~2009, never fitted professionally. They give me grief but at least I can ski all day.
Tried all the usual stuff:
New pair from Chamonix (Sanglard Sports) in 2017 - Scott Cosmos II, a bit soft for my skiing but happy to have a touring pair, they gave me the old 2 sizes smaller treatment (28.5). Trusted the shop, fought through the pain for a couple of weeks to see if they'd bed in but no luck. Annoyingly I broke the mech on one boot whilst charging fairly hard off piste and hitting a tree so didn't get any further with them.
In Feb 2020 I went to Colin at solutions4feet who was helpful, but said they wouldn't recommend selling me anything there due to lack of achilles flexibility, he sent me to Daleboot. £800 later I was hoping this was finally going to work. Almost immediately (pre-2020 madness) had a week in St Anton and they were the most painful pair I have ever worn...
Covid hit, missed a season, have tried and failed to get in touch with Richard to sort them out but I can't get through. Have had a couple more weeks with them and I just can't use them, went back to my old atomics.
I am going to Chamonix this weekend, can people recommend any magic boot wizards that may help?
Failing that, and if I still can't get through to Richard at Daleboot, I'm in Tignes 30th Dec thru 7th Jan. Who's the recommendation there now? Likely a sensible approach now is to tackle this in resort so I can returning to the shop with feedback until we are in a good place...
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
@Spikyhedgehog, snowboarding?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Have you considered working on your achilles flexibility, sounds like that could be the issue....?
@Spikyhedgehog, you have answered your own question.... your lack of available ankle joint RoM if you really want to be comfortable in ski boots fix the root cause of the problem, you can try all the boots in the world, (dale is normally a good starting point for this issue as they can ramp the foot more than in a traditional boot to open up the ankle joint and allow you to utilize what RoM that you have got) but until there is a range of motion at the ankle joint that allows you to stand in a boot and not be in a forced postion where your foot wants to abduct out the side of it then you will always have a level of pain
sanglard won't have given you the "old 2 sizes down treatment" they will have done what every boot fitter does which is measure your feet and start from that
as an example my colleague say a client 10 weeks ago who could not get his forefoot off the ground in a 90:90:90 test, he want away and worked for 6 weeks with a foam roller and muscle gun 15-20 mins every day, when i saw him 3 weeks ago i could hardly believe the difference, neither could he, the boot he couldn't wear for 5 mins he can now wear all day, he admitted it was hard work to do but having suffered all his life he was happy to give it a go
so my recommendation would be get in touch with Richard at Daleboot to make any adjustment to the boot but also do something about the RoM issue before you spend any more money on boots that probably won't be any better
sorry if that sounds harsh, but boot fitters can fix many things, but they cannot fix YOUR body
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Thu 7-12-23 9:20; edited 2 times in total
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
swskier wrote:
Have you considered working on your achilles flexibility, sounds like that could be the issue....?
Could it be they didn't do the "old 2 sizes down treatment" but that your random, unfitted, ebay boots are just 2 sizes too big?
Time to research calf stretches and start doing them perhaps.
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
CEM wrote:
@Spikyhedgehog, you have answered your own question.... your lack of available ankle joint RoM if you really want to be comfortable in ski boots fix the root cause of the problem, you can try all the boots in the world, (dale is normally a good starting point for this issue as they can ramp the foot more than in a traditional boot to open up the ankle joint and allow you to utilize what RoM that you have got) but until there is a range of motion at the ankle joint that allows you to stand in a boot and not be in a forced postion where your foot wants to abduct out the side of it then you will always have a level of pain
sanglard won't have given you the "old 2 sizes down treatment" they will have done what every boot fitter does which is measure your feet and start from that
as an example my colleague say a client 10 weeks ago who could not get his forefoot off the ground in a 90:90:90 test, he want away and worked for 6 weeks with a foam roller and muscle gun 15-20 mins every day, when i saw him 3 weeks ago i could hardly believe the difference, neither could he, the boot he couldn't wear for 5 mins he can now wear all day, he admitted it was hard work to do but having suffered all his life he was happy to give it a go
so my recommendation would be get in touch with Richard at Daleboot to make any adjustment to the boot but also do something about the RoM issue before you spend any more money on boots that probably won't be any better
sorry if that sounds harsh, but boot fitters can fix many things, but they cannot fix YOUR body
Whats a 90 90 90 test?
After all it is free
After all it is free
OK, thanks all. Richard finally got back to me this morning so hopefully we can come up with a plan.
@CEM et al, thanks for the guidance. I know I'm being grumpy, but it's frustrating that my (I agree) boots that are too big are miles better than any approach since then. I honestly am not looking for an easy fix, I would just would like a plan that makes me feel like things are improving, rather than the opposite.
Would you, or anyone else, be able to point me in direction of how I should approach the exercises? Very happy to try! I was under the impression it was not something that it would be possible to fix without serious work. Is this something Richard can advise on and guide me through?
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the ball is for under the arch of the foot, it is important to work this area as well as the calf as the structures of the calf are attached and linked to the plantar fascia under the foot.... for the calves search foam rolling exercises for calves on youtube http://youtube.com/v/MuPVRt6_BV8 is a pretty good introduction to why and how
the last thing you can use is a massage gun which is to supplement the foam roller
it has to be done daily and it will take 3-4 weeks to get a noticeable difference... do the 90:90:90 test and have someone measure how much clearance you have under the ball of the foot at the little toe side then measure again after 3 weeks... trying to see a difference daily is like stepping on the scales every morning
absolute worst case it makes very little difference and then you have to work out other solutions, best case all the pain disappears and you will actually feel better even walking
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Ski the Net with snowHeads
Luckily I have both, will make a start ASAP!
Sorry, I'm fairly clueless, what's a 90:90:90 test? Google throws up a bunch of different things.
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Spikyhedgehog wrote:
Luckily I have both, will make a start ASAP!
Sorry, I'm fairly clueless, what's a 90:90:90 test? Google throws up a bunch of different things.
sit on a chair with your lower leg straight up and down and your foot straight out (think stick man) fee about hip width apart, keep the heels on the floor and life the rest of the foot straight upwards don't let the knees deviate in or out or the foot rotate out, have some meaure (we use fingers) how much gap there is under the ball of the foot on the little toe side, this amount will increase as the flexibility improves
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@CEM, will do. Thank you!
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@Spikyhedgehog, whats your starting score on the 90:90:90
You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
kitenski wrote:
@Spikyhedgehog, whats your starting score on the 90:90:90
I'll open the book with a guess of 'zero'
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
@CEM, what's a "good" score on the 90:90:90?
Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@Spikyhedgehog, I share your pain! I've got very wide feet and it's really difficult to find a comfortable boot. I once had some Nordica's which were great, but tried many different boots since, and nothing comes close. I've tried all forms of boot stretching, wedge inserts, foam, buckle adjustments etc. Colin was unable to help me, and recommended Dale, but I really can't justify £800-£1000 when I only ski once a year. In the meantime I have to settle for a boot that's two sizes too large and tape my feet to avoid blisters! Good luck with your RoM exercises. It will be interesting to see if that fixes the problem. Personally, I like your idea of buying in resort, at least you can keep going back to make adjustments.
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
sugarmoma666 wrote:
@CEM, what's a "good" score on the 90:90:90?
it depends a little on foot size as a longer foot will give a higher result but ideally i want to see 2 fingers gap under the ball of the foot on the little toe side..... 1-1.5 fingers for a small foot, if you can get more than 1 finger then it can be workable with some lifts and a decent footbed, but the closer to ideal or just a little more is going to make skiing (anf a lot of other things) a lot more comfortable
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
jellylegs wrote:
@Spikyhedgehog, I share your pain! I've got very wide feet and it's really difficult to find a comfortable boot. I once had some Nordica's which were great, but tried many different boots since, and nothing comes close. I've tried all forms of boot stretching, wedge inserts, foam, buckle adjustments etc. Colin was unable to help me, and recommended Dale, but I really can't justify £800-£1000 when I only ski once a year. In the meantime I have to settle for a boot that's two sizes too large and tape my feet to avoid blisters! Good luck with your RoM exercises. It will be interesting to see if that fixes the problem. Personally, I like your idea of buying in resort, at least you can keep going back to make adjustments.
Anja was telling me yesterday that the new Faction boots “Phaenom” have a narrow heel but very wide toe box if that’s what you need.
@Spikyhedgehog, I've literally just chucked my Head Mojo boots in the bin from our season in Tignes, they were well comfy, I'd have sent them your way.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
spyderjon wrote:
kitenski wrote:
@Spikyhedgehog, whats your starting score on the 90:90:90
I'll open the book with a guess of 'zero'
I'm around 1 finger, but am making some progress hopefully.
Will stick at it and see how we get on by mid season.
Feels like all the flexiblity comes from stretching everything out afterwards, is that recommended?
george_1 - No way! TBH I wish the rossi's I had from that season didn't eventually disintegrate as they were the best boot I've ever had.
Hey@Spikyhedgehog, how did the exercises work out? Did you stick with the Dale boots or did you go back to the old boots?
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
after 30 years of skiing, i have come to the conclusion there is no such thing as a comfy ski boot, its something i have to put up with if i want to go skiing, mind you, i do suffer from a foot condition called mortons neuroma which doesnt help.
After all it is free
After all it is free
@philusher76, where have you had boots fitted from? Doesn’t sound pleasant!
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Swing by SOLE, we’ll sort it out, stock depending.
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