 Poster: A snowHead
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They are also both only 1.5hours from Innsbruck.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Astontech wrote: |
| afterski wrote: |
Obergurgl and Avoriaz for snow in the village, Lech (if you are less cost conscious).
One thing to consider is do you want a pretty place? Avoriaz is not pretty. Les Deux Alps and Alps D'Huez are not pretty either but are very high. |
Are Obergurgl and Lech pretty? Good for beginners? |
Both Obergurgl and Lech are good for beginners. In many ways Lech would be a perfect choice, snow sure and pretty however it cant be in anyway described as cheap (5 star resort with 5 star prices) and access is not easy, Zürich is probably the most convenient airport but you would be looking at around a 3 hour transfer more if the weather is poor. Obergurgl is a good beginners spot and very snow sure but because it is so high it can be exposed in bad weather (more common in mid winter) - especially miserable for those in ski school. It is also not the easiest place to get to, at the end of a long valley. Transfer from Innsbruck is reasonable (guess 1.5 to 2 hours) however there are not many flights to Innsbruck and it is more prone to disruption than other airports due to its location so not good for a short trip. Transfers from Munich or Zürich are long.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@afterski, the trouble with flying to Innsbruck is that there are very few flights there. Most require you to change somewhere and they are in the middle of the day. For example, I just checked and there are no direct flights from Birmingham on weekdays. I suspect this is the case for most UK airports. On the other hand there are lots of flights to Geneva. For a long weekend we would take Friday afternoon off and take an 18:00 flight from Luton and come back on the 21:00 on Monday so getting 3 days skiing for one and half days of holiday.
Since I was looking up flight availabilty I just looked at Birmingham - Geneva in January. Out on the Friday night back on the Monday, £50 return. I think I'll just go but since I've now retired I'll book the morning flight and get the train to Bourg st Maurice £10 more on the flight but a big saving by using the train 
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| johnE wrote: |
@Astontech, only 3 nights. Are you adding a weeknd to this or is it just a long weekend?
I now see why you want a short transfer - ski on the last day and get a late flight home. I've done this to Les Arcs (2:30 drive back), Crolles (skied in Charmrouse, which may be a reasnoble choice but a long transfer, and Les Sept Laux) and Gressony (fly to Turin or Malpensa and from there it is a quick transfer)
Make sure you are not trying to do a transfer on a Saturday |
Thansk for all the comments Layne!
3 nights i am planning as i have a NYE party in London I need to get back for. I could push it and arrive back NYE but that complicates things and we have a family commitment on the 26th
We are treating this really as a very short trip to test the waters for my gf. Does she like it? Is it worth booking her on the 2 week trip in Feb?
Cost I am not too bothered about if it isn't great value, I understand it is a busy time and therefore expensive.
We just want to go somewhere that has guaranteed snow so we can throw ourselves into it, we will arrive at resort around 4pmish I would imagine.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Astontech wrote: |
| T Bar wrote: |
If there are lots of potential times available I kind of agree with the other posters. I would be more inclined to go pre Christmas or early Jan for earlyish season skiing.
Personally I would if going low season always wait to see where conditions are good rather than trying to anticipate where will have good conditions.
If I had to choose somewhere rather than book late I might go for high Austria like Obergurgl or Obertauern rather than Chamonix which has a low base and possibly not best suited for a beginner.
Though in my experience truly enthusiastic beginners will probably enjoy most places |
Thanks for the insight!
Where would you recommend that is beginner friendly, close to an airport and preferably a picturesque town with good food (to help win my gf over to the idea of coming more often lol) if we were to push to the third week in Jan? |
Third week in January should be more reliable, and always cheaper though in a poor snow year you can still be unlucky..
I would be inclined to get flights early and wait a while to choose the resort from the airport, when snow is assured.
Airports with resorts reasonably close are:
Innsbruck where the whole of Tyrol is on your doorstep and you can see slopes from the runway, though the airport can be prone to closure in bad weather.
Geneva though if you are forced to travel at the weekend the Airport can be so overburdened that more time is lost at the airport than is saved by being fairly close to some resorts.
Turin which is convenient for several Italian and French resorts.
Zurich
If you state which airport is easiest to fly to there are resort choices at each.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
| 3 nights i am planning as i have a NYE party in London I need to get back for |
I hope your party friends are very appreciative. I doubt if many on the forum would scarifice skiing to attend a party.
Returning on December 30th will not be easy. It will be a very busy transfer day between the Christmas and New Year weeks.
Go mid January, the slopes will be quieter, the cost less and for a short visit consider getting a hotel.
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| johnE wrote: |
@Astontech, only 3 nights. Are you adding a weeknd to this or is it just a long weekend?
I now see why you want a short transfer - ski on the last day and get a late flight home. I've done this to Les Arcs (2:30 drive back), Crolles (skied in Charmrouse, which may be a reasnoble choice but a long transfer, and Les Sept Laux) and Gressony (fly to Turin or Malpensa and from there it is a quick transfer)
Make sure you are not trying to do a transfer on a Saturday |
Good idea!
My transfer back home will be a Saturday, is that going to be a problem?
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Maybe think about Scandinavia? The resorts are much smaller than most of the main ones in the Alps, but as beginners you maybe don't need a big place. Snow is a certainty and some of the transfer times in Finland are under 30 mins. The cost of food and drinks in the resort is high, but the lift passes are lower. The problem might be the availability of flights if going independently, as I think a lot are given over to tour operators.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| T Bar wrote: |
| Astontech wrote: |
| T Bar wrote: |
If there are lots of potential times available I kind of agree with the other posters. I would be more inclined to go pre Christmas or early Jan for earlyish season skiing.
Personally I would if going low season always wait to see where conditions are good rather than trying to anticipate where will have good conditions.
If I had to choose somewhere rather than book late I might go for high Austria like Obergurgl or Obertauern rather than Chamonix which has a low base and possibly not best suited for a beginner.
Though in my experience truly enthusiastic beginners will probably enjoy most places |
Thanks for the insight!
Where would you recommend that is beginner friendly, close to an airport and preferably a picturesque town with good food (to help win my gf over to the idea of coming more often lol) if we were to push to the third week in Jan? |
Third week in January should be more reliable, and always cheaper though in a poor snow year you can still be unlucky..
I would be inclined to get flights early and wait a while to choose the resort from the airport, when snow is assured.
Airports with resorts reasonably close are:
Innsbruck where the whole of Tyrol is on your doorstep and you can see slopes from the runway, though the airport can be prone to closure in bad weather.
Geneva though if you are forced to travel at the weekend the Airport can be so overburdened that more time is lost at the airport than is saved by being fairly close to some resorts.
Turin which is convenient for several Italian and French resorts.
Zurich
If you state which airport is easiest to fly to there are resort choices at each. |
Geneva seems to be by far the easiest, flying wed 27th, return sat 30th
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| Astontech wrote: |
| We are treating this really as a very short trip to test the waters for my gf. Does she like it? Is it worth booking her on the 2 week trip in Feb? |
When are you booking the Feb trip. Feb is peak season. If you don't book it until after the short trip it will be expensive and you may struggle with availability. Why a two week trip and not two one weekers?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Temesvar wrote: |
| Maybe think about Scandinavia? The resorts are much smaller than most of the main ones in the Alps, but as beginners you maybe don't need a big place. Snow is a certainty and some of the transfer times in Finland are under 30 mins. The cost of food and drinks in the resort is high, but the lift passes are lower. The problem might be the availability of flights if going independently, as I think a lot are given over to tour operators. |
Interesting! Any resorts come to mind?
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Are those evening flights?
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You know it makes sense.
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Apart from New Year the four weeks of French school hols from early Feb - to early March are the very worst weeks, and coincide with British half term hols.
January after new year, or 9 March onwards are the best times
For Austria, there are also weeks to avoid, especially Fasching
Your girl friend will know exactly what she thinks of skiing (and possibly you.....) after a "learn to ski in a day" course at a Snowdome. You are not allowed on the slopes until you have been passed as competent to use the drag lift.
We are really evangelistic on SHs about getting people into enjoying skiing - all the advice you've had here might sound negative in places but it arises from a good deal of experience. For three days, to be honest, a beginner can do fine with a decent instructor, some good luck with the weather and two or three slopes! Preferably without having to walk more than 150 metres in ski boots and definitely without having to clomp on and off a crowded bus.
The worst thing you can do with a beginner is to push them too hard - even if your girl friend is keen and athletic, she will probably be happier in her comfort zone and will learn faster if not terrified.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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@Astontech, I think you are trying to squeeze too much in here, much better to do things properly in February. You might be better off simply looking to do a winter break in an attractive resort rather than trying (probably unsuccessfully) to get some ski lessons. Short breaks work for those who can ski not if you want lessons. Maybe look to go to Wengen or Grindelwald or even Zermatt (both easy to get to from Zürich and Geneva OK too) take in the atmosphere, jump on the trains, watch other folk skiing etc, hopefully you could try tobogganing, if there is not so much snow you can still go for walks and soak up the atmosphere. With just a couple of days you risk putting your girlfriend off for good. If she enjoys the trip then she will look forward to a "proper" skiing holiday later in the winter.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Good advice. The radio of "faffing:skiing" can seem very high to a beginner, even on a week's holiday, and on such a short trip the ratio - and the cost - will be sky high, even if you find you can book private lessons at that very busy time.
You really can learn a great deal in a Snowdome and the "learn in a day" courses for complete beginners are a good laugh (I did one for snowboarding, nearly killed me as I was twice the age of any of the others!).
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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We wil look to get a few days of learning in at the Snowdome for sure.
I am not too bothered about the cost, I have some money that has to be spent by the end of the year, if not on Skiing, it'll be on some other trip.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| munich_irish wrote: |
| Astontech wrote: |
| afterski wrote: |
Obergurgl and Avoriaz for snow in the village, Lech (if you are less cost conscious).
One thing to consider is do you want a pretty place? Avoriaz is not pretty. Les Deux Alps and Alps D'Huez are not pretty either but are very high. |
Are Obergurgl and Lech pretty? Good for beginners? |
Both Obergurgl and Lech are good for beginners. In many ways Lech would be a perfect choice, snow sure and pretty however it cant be in anyway described as cheap (5 star resort with 5 star prices) and access is not easy, Zürich is probably the most convenient airport but you would be looking at around a 3 hour transfer more if the weather is poor. Obergurgl is a good beginners spot and very snow sure but because it is so high it can be exposed in bad weather (more common in mid winter) - especially miserable for those in ski school. It is also not the easiest place to get to, at the end of a long valley. Transfer from Innsbruck is reasonable (guess 1.5 to 2 hours) however there are not many flights to Innsbruck and it is more prone to disruption than other airports due to its location so not good for a short trip. Transfers from Munich or Zürich are long. |
Private transfer Innsbruck-Lech is normally 1.15 hour. But finding something in Lech for just 3 nights during this week is gonna be difficult.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Astontech wrote: |
Geneva seems to be by far the easiest, flying wed 27th, return sat 30th |
Loads of resorts accessible from Geneva, though unless your flight back is late you may not be able to ski much or at all on Saturday, the airport can be very slow and the roads from some resorts busy on a Saturday, though I'm not familiar with them all.
Courmayeur has great food and is attractive from your criteria.
The Portes de Soleil has some attractive resorts but is a little low if the snows is poor.
St Gervais is very pleasant though again low if the snow is poor but very close to the airport.
Never been to Villars or les Diablerets but have heard good things and the latter has very high skiing.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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https://www.pierreetvacances.com/gb-en They do lots of accommodation options and a don’t pay anything u til a few days beforehand which is handy for bad snow conditions. Lots of avoriaz options.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Astontech wrote: |
| Temesvar wrote: |
| Maybe think about Scandinavia? The resorts are much smaller than most of the main ones in the Alps, but as beginners you maybe don't need a big place. Snow is a certainty and some of the transfer times in Finland are under 30 mins. The cost of food and drinks in the resort is high, but the lift passes are lower. The problem might be the availability of flights if going independently, as I think a lot are given over to tour operators. |
Interesting! Any resorts come to mind? |
I have only been to Ruka, which was our kids' first ski trip and they loved it - it's very beginner friendly whilst having some harder slopes as you progress. The airport transfer from Kuusamo is 20-30 minutes. I have heard I think Yllas also has a very local airport, but you should double check that. If you do go, I would suggest staying in the main parts of Ruka Village or Ruka Valley, which are close to the restaurants, bars and lifts. They also have cabins out in the woods, which look very quaint and romantic, but are a long walk from anywhere and you have to rely on the ski bus.
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@Astontech,
Since you say you have cash to spend before the end of the year what about going with a tour operator (let them take the strain) for a full week before Christmas?
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| Kenzie wrote: |
@Astontech,
Since you say you have cash to spend before the end of the year what about going with a tour operator (let them take the strain) for a full week before Christmas? |
My gf's holiday allowance is the problem then. She has 24-1st off, hence being an ideal time to go.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Astontech, train to BSM and off to smaller resorts from there - St Foy, La Rosiere, etc
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@mooney058, the poor bloke has enough to figure out without having to figure out the complexity of training it - not sure that makes sense for a short trip either.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Layne wrote: |
| @mooney058, the poor bloke has enough to figure out without having to figure out the complexity of training it - not sure that makes sense for a short trip either. |
Almost decided on Avoriaz. Seems beginner friendly, reasonably easy to get to, ski in ski out, can ski for 3 days if we get a late flight back on the Saturday. Think we will opt to hire a car to give us the flexibility in choosing when we head off as well as a faster transfer.
Can get a tutor, equipment, accommodation and pass through their official website.
Anything else I should be considering?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| surferrosa wrote: |
| Look at Montgenevre in the southern French Alps. Short transfer from Turin (1 hour 15 mins) and is usually snow sure. It sits at 1800m and is in a pass which catches fronts from both the south and west. I've been once over NYs and the snow was perfect so we've booked again for this NYs too. Obviously there's no guarantees though. It's also great for beginners with good ski schools and lots of gentle blues and greens. The only downside is if you're looking for lively apres this is not the resort for you. |
+1 for Montgenevre. Great resort for beginners. There are gently Greens and Blues from up high, so beginners actually feel like they are seeing more of the mountain that just the usual nursery slopes.
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| Astontech wrote: |
| johnE wrote: |
@Astontech, This is not directed at you personally but why the short transfer time and what mode of transfer are you looking at?
Airports tend to be builtt where there is a good amount of flat ground and not near mountains where there is a great risk of weather disruption. Skiing is generally in the mountains where weather disruption is welcome as it provides the snow.
Airports tend to be built near population centres. Population centres tend to be on flat land where building is easy. Population centres don't like snow as it disrupts transport. Skiing tend to want slopes and snow.
The higher mountains tend to be further away from airports (Chamonix is an exception here)
To me after I've spent upto 90 minutes driving to the airport, 30 minutes parking and getting into the building, 20 minutes at security, an hour waiting for the plane. 2 hours sitting on it, 40 minutes queuing at passport control, 20 minutes getting car hire then the difference between 1:30 and 2:30 getting to the resort is irrelevant.
Even then the difference in the mode of transport can make a big difference: a helicopter to Courcheval, a taxi (often called a private transfer on this forum), a coach or the train can make a big difference to the price and the time.
As others have suggested, if you are trying to organise the trip yourself then visit the resort websites for accommodation, or look at the travel operators for learn to ski weeks. They often do good packages with discounted lessons and lift passes and deal with the tricky bits such as transfers for you.
For beginners I would have a serious look at Alpe d'Huez and fly to Grenoble or Chambery with a TO.
BTW are you thinking of travelling on Dec 23rd or 30th? |
This is super helpful thanks!!
Short transfer time is wanted as we are only doing 3 nights this first time and dont want an extra 2-2.5 hours transfer. We live 20-25 mins from the airport now and we would get a taxi to the resort.
I was thinking 27-30th, but am now considering doing it the third week in Jan, as people have said, I should probably worry mroe abotu where I am going to go - any suggestions on that would be great! |
Ok 3rd week of Jan makes things much easier in that you have a high chance of getting snow everywhere by then.
If short transfer matters to you (and I feel the same way for weekend trips) then there are lots of decent options from Geneva within 1 to 1.5 hours - I'd say Les Carroz/Megeve/St Gervais/Les Contamines/Morzine are all nice places with good beginner runs, relatively attractive, short transfers. Taxi to resort is fine for all those but worth knowing that the drives are easy and hire car would work out cheaper. If you fancy somewhere more bustling/lively Morzine. Plush/glitzy Megeve. Quiet and villagey Les Contamines. I think any of them would work well.
If you decide to go in late Dec then I would leave it to last minute and follow the snow.
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You know it makes sense.
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If you're going christmas / new-year then Kaprun is as close as I can come to what you're after. The resort is modest altitude, so snow in resort is possible but far from guaranteed. But with nursery slopes from resort level right up to the glacier, snow is guaranteed. Pretty town (castle, church on hill, river) spectacular scenery from top of glacier. Road transfer circa 90 mins from Salzburg, public transport links are also good but will take a bit longer. Munich airport can be preferable because of flight connections/times, but is 3 hours.
The excellent slopes on the Maiskogl mean Kaprun is a good choice later on too.
A few weeks later, and your list of choices becomes huge. Kitzbühel is a fantastic pretty town, ticks all the other boxes (rail transport is excellent) but pricey!
Zell am See, Niederau, Oberau (Wildschonal), Alpbach are rated well for beginners toand are pretty.
Personally I would sacrifice having pretty town a bit and focus more on beginner friendly. Bramberg, Neukirchen, St Johann in Tyrol (make sure in Tyrol!), are all great beginner resorts with shortish transfers. Altenmarkt is an outside choice - but make sure you can get to the slope easily (hotel shuttle maybe).
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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1. Lech (Austria)
2. Avoriaz (France)
3. Sestriere (Italy)
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Poster: A snowHead
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3 days in Christmas week doesn’t sound like a good introduction to skiing, IMHO. Lots of faffing, no time to learn or improve, crowds queues (and crazy skiers) everywhere. Awful value for money even if that doesn’t seem to bother you.
End of January sooo much better. Less cost and people, more snow, and take a full week to learn. Consider Austria for pretty villages, Italy for bella figura and great food. You can do a lot worse than Avoriaz also.
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FAQ
