 Poster: A snowHead
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This just popped up in my NewsFeed
The EU’s new visa-waiver system Etias (the European Travel Information and Authorisation System) is set to be delayed again with its rollout now scheduled for 2024.
Details of the exact month when it will be operational have not been given but a press announcement is due later today (February 27).
The scheme, which will require non-EU citizens (other than those who need full visas even for short visits) to apply on a website for pre-approval to visit the EU, was previously due to launch in November 2023, having been already delayed several times. It had been initially announced as expected in 2021, then by the end of 2022 and then in the first part of 2023.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Worth pointing out that this is not really about EU, but Schengen zone, membership. Yes, it's not incorrect to call it "The EU's" new system, but it's not only EU countries that will be adopting it (e.g. Switzerland will as well).
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Is this the system which is meant to track the 90-days?
Talking to boy earlier, who reckons he'll be on 84 days when he gets home, how this gets tracked now? You'd be hard pushed to count the stamps in passport
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Boris wrote: |
Is this the system which is meant to track the 90-days?
Talking to boy earlier, who reckons he'll be on 84 days when he gets home, how this gets tracked now? You'd be hard pushed to count the stamps in passport |
They scan your passport as well.
Any count will be the computer says no - rather than Border force getting the abacus out.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Quote: |
They scan your passport as well.
Any count will be the computer says no - rather than Border force getting the abacus out.
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I don't think there is a single computer system behind this - otherwise why would they need the ETIAS. For example Does the Greek system talk to the Portugese?
Just note that Bulgaria and Andora are two popular skiing areas not in Shengen so the 90 days limit does not apply to them. Ireland is also outside of Shengen but it is not a famed skiing destination
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@ousekjarr, our passports weren't stamped back out on one of our previous trips either. Think it was Autumn 2021. And what if you have a new passport? There must be something on the computer system to count up the 90/180 days.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Hells Bells, that's one of the reasons why you have to have a minimum of 3 months validity on your passport to enter the EU - so that you will exit before the passport expires and/or you reach the 90 day limit.
There is no grand system - if they suspect that you've overstayed, the onus is on you to prove you haven't by producing the stamps. If you don't have them, you're out.
The grand system to tighten up on this and remove the need to stamp passports and count days where there is any doubt is ETIAS...
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So basically, I just need to get into France and then go under cover 
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Does anyone know whether U.K. passport holders with Schengen residency are exempt from this?
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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I think @ousekjarr is right, there is no grand system. There are just the stamps in your passport, and if they think you have not got it right that is all the evidence you have. Even if you have passed an unmanned border.
@Hells Bells's computer system is ETIAS which is still awaited. However in the nature of bureaucracies they are making it too complicated to work - at the moment they stamp people in and out without fingerprinting so why can't they under ETIAS? As many have commented the crux is the car crossings, it may be easy to process people one-by-one at airports but a carfull makes more sense if they just scan passports.
Last edited by And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports. on Mon 27-02-23 22:49; edited 1 time in total
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You know it makes sense.
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Just to be clear it’s the EES (electronic entry system) that will track your entry/exit and your 90 days. ETIAS is a visa waiver system. This is still due in “late 2023” - new date to be announced in march.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Top answer, thanks!
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Boris wrote: |
Is this the system which is meant to track the 90-days?
Talking to boy earlier, who reckons he'll be on 84 days when he gets home, how this gets tracked now? You'd be hard pushed to count the stamps in passport |
I was close to my 90 days last year, I had calculated 85, and I did ask an officer at Swiss border control if she could verify my calculations. She started flicking through pages and counting stamps but gave up as I was missing stamps - and admitted they have no way of knowing. Her view was they would provide a temporary visa to someone in my situation if it was uncertain at time of entry.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@telford_mike, The link is courtesy of the legal bods on the "British in Austria" website.
Based on previous experience with various airlines not understanding the Covid rules and post-Brexit passport rules, it might be a good idea to have the link on your phone or tablet just in case the Ryanair/Easyjet/BA/Jet2 etc. check-in and boarding gate personnel haven't been correctly informed of the ETIAS rules and demand to see your ETIAS approval.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Boris wrote: |
Is this the system which is meant to track the 90-days?
Talking to boy earlier, who reckons he'll be on 84 days when he gets home, how this gets tracked now? You'd be hard pushed to count the stamps in passport |
No, that’s the EES. That has also been delayed from May 23 to “the end of the year”. Article in the Times today.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| quinton wrote: |
@telford_mike, The link is courtesy of the legal bods on the "British in Austria" website.
Based on previous experience with various airlines not understanding the Covid rules and post-Brexit passport rules, it might be a good idea to have the link on your phone or tablet just in case the Ryanair/Easyjet/BA/Jet2 etc. check-in and boarding gate personnel haven't been correctly informed of the ETIAS rules and demand to see your ETIAS approval. |
Or just get one and avoid any issues - €7 for three years.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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wait is UK also out from Schengen? or it was always so?
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| turms2 wrote: |
| wait is UK also out from Schengen? or it was always so? |
UK has always been outside the Schengen zone (as is the Republic of Ireland due to the long standing Common Travel Area agreement that pre-dates both British and Irish membership of the EU and is not dependent on it).
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@turms2, the UK was never in Schengen (but pre-Brexit UK citizens had freedom of movement within the EU).
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We may had had Freedom of Movement but you still had to queue to get your passport checked to enter the EU if you came from outside the Schengen zone.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| andy from embsay wrote: |
| quinton wrote: |
@telford_mike, The link is courtesy of the legal bods on the "British in Austria" website.
Based on previous experience with various airlines not understanding the Covid rules and post-Brexit passport rules, it might be a good idea to have the link on your phone or tablet just in case the Ryanair/Easyjet/BA/Jet2 etc. check-in and boarding gate personnel haven't been correctly informed of the ETIAS rules and demand to see your ETIAS approval. |
Or just get one and avoid any issues - €7 for three years. |
That was my thought, not that I leave the Schengen zone very often.
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| telford_mike wrote: |
| Does anyone know whether U.K. passport holders with Schengen residency are exempt from this? |
Yes, we are.
The visa calculator link posted yesterday doesn't say so, but I see that @quinton has now posted another link that clarifies. In any case, it's pretty self-evident that they couldn't use the '90/180 day in Schengen' rule for someone spending all or most of their time in their Schengen country of residence.
We have noticed that in the last two or three years the Swiss airport passport control have been insisting on seeing our residency permits as well; we now hand them over automatically with the passport, whereas historically, i.e. in pre-Brexit times with FoM, it was very rare that we'd be asked to show them.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@andy from embsay, "Or just get one and avoid any issues - €7 for three years."
This is not an option for people living in the EU/Schengen as you have to provide your current address - which would need to be outside the EU - and your current employment status, employer, travel itinerary and planned length of stay etc. Applying for ETIAS when you already have a Residence Permit and/or visa would only alert the Border Control to something possibly being untoward.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Tue 28-02-23 19:32; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Ah, ok @quinton - wasn’t aware of what info is required when applying for ETIAS. What happens if I move into Schengen during the 3 years?
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You don't need to use it anymore....
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You know it makes sense.
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If you travel from Ireland to Shengen, do you get your passport stamped?
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| johnE wrote: |
| If you travel from Ireland to Shengen, do you get your passport stamped? |
If you're an Irish Passport holder then why would your passport be stamped? Although not in Schengen Ireland is in the EU so Irish citizens are not subject to the 90 days in 180 days rule applicable to non EU countries' citizens. Before Brexit when the UK was a member of the EU although the UK wasn't in Schengen we didn't get our passports stamped on entering the Schengen zone.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Quote: |
If you travel from Ireland to Shengen, do you get your passport stamped?
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No - if you hold and Irish or EU passport.
Yes - if you hold a non-EU "third country" passport - e.g. UK, USA, Canada etc.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Hurdy wrote: |
| You don't need to use it anymore.... |
But you don’t “use it” - it’s connected to your passport. So in the example given border guards would apparently be suspicious of someone with an ETIAS and a Schengen address.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
Hurdy wrote:
You don't need to use it anymore....
But you don’t “use it” - it’s connected to your passport. So in the example given border guards would apparently be suspicious of someone with an ETIAS and a Schengen address.
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You wouldn't need to use the ETIAS and when you show them your residence permit for whichever EU country you live in they will understand why.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| quinton wrote: |
@andy from embsay, "Or just get one and avoid any issues - €7 for three years."
This is not an option for people living in the EU/Schengen as you have to provide your current address - which would need to be outside the EU - and your current employment status, employer, travel itinerary and planned length of stay etc. Applying for ETIAS when you already have a Residence Permit and/or visa would only alert the Border Control to something possibly being untoward. |
When would you provide all that info (itinerary, length of stay etc)? I thought ETIAS is a visa waiver scheme which will permit multiple entries over a 3 yr period?
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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So in summary, it’s a nightmare, and nobody knows exactly how it’s going to work (if it ever does).
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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One of the concerns with ETIAS is the concept of you declaring every trip in advance including your country of entry to the EU. Diversions from e.g. Innsbruck to Munich could become a little interesting...
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| ousekjarr wrote: |
| One of the concerns with ETIAS is the concept of you declaring every trip in advance including your country of entry to the EU. Diversions from e.g. Innsbruck to Munich could become a little interesting... |
Is that correct though? I see you have to provide your intended first point of entry but nothing about subsequent trips? This (from ETIAS website) suggests you don’t.
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Though according to ETIAS.com :
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| While you can start applying for an ETIAS before you have confirmed your travel plans, keep in mind that you will need to indicate the EU country you plan on visiting first. However, after authorisation is given, you may instead travel to any of the other 30 countries covered under the ETIAS system. |
So it sounds like the first country indication is just about who processes the application on behalf of the EU...
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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< snap > 
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FAQ
