Whose fault is it?

A snowHead

Hi, first post here so sorry if it's not the correct sub. Is this just a legit accident or is one person at fault here. The snowboarder hits the back of the skier's skis at the 30 second mark. His shadow can be seen

[url=]http://youtube.com/v/XLwcjR4nRxQ[/url]

http://youtube.com/v/XLwcjR4nRxQ

A snowHead

I would say a genuine accident, although the boarder was in more of a position to take avoiding action - so if blame must be cast then they are in the wrong.

A similar thing happened to me last week on Moraine on the Glacier du Pisaillas. A friend and myself were carving down the gentle gradients on the top part. Nice snow, great feelings in the legs we were criss-crossing the slope in a scissors formation. It wasn't busy so we were making full use of the width of the piste and getting over on our edges. Both of us were focussing on trying to maintain good form with bodies ( and eyes... ) down the slope rather than the direction across the slope the skis were actually taking us. Fine until we became unsighted and my friend suddenly appeared out of the corner of my eye as she skied over the front of my skis. I promptly took a tumble while she skied on, both of us unhurt. It was a good reminder to both of us to be more aware of what was going on around us and not get so caught up in the actual skiing that we lost situational awareness. Glad no one was hurt but it was a really good lesson for me.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Skiers fault.

He's coming from behind.

He's tracking the boarder - boarder even cuts across their line (legitimately) at around 23 but they still carry on. You could see the danger a mile off.

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Go pro guy's fault. Not a scintilla of doubt. I thought he was trying to film the boarder. If you pass make sure you stay passed.

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

I see a skier get too close a boarder once, and then do nothing to improve the situation before subsequently hitting the boarder.
Though boarder must have known skier was about and should probably taken more care to position check the skier before cutting across skier’s path.

I also saw two skiers, and probably the one behind the camera also, moving quite quickly through the departure area where perhaps a little more caution could have been exercised.

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Hi- thanks for posting, welcome and is everyone OK? By the username I'm guessing this is in Mammoth?- Looks amazing snow and the skiing and boarding on display is very tidy- I'm impressed by the transitions from soft to pisted- looks effortless.

Given the space it does seem like you three were all very close together- from the start really- then especially in the 10s before the crash. Were you and the skier together? It looked like perhaps you were following the skier and then not expecting the snowboarder to be taking the same line. But he did and at 22/23s ypu were very close when he turned in front- ending up so you were on his blind side- with a drop to his toes- so he was coming back.

So whilst the gopro was 'downhill' I'd think that this was no an unexpected outcome.

If everyone is fine- then I'm really pleased- looks like you were all having a good time. Do you think the person filming became a bit distracted by the act of filming- to the detriment of awareness of what was going on right nearby?

Best wishes, Ed

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From when the boarder set off (about 8s in), the boarder was ahead of and in full view of the skier who was filming. Whereas I can't see that the boarder would have been aware of the skier until about a second before the collision. The skier had over 20s to avoid a collision, and the boarder maybe a second, so it's pretty clear to me where any fault lies.

* From the footage, it looks like the boarder didn't check uphill before setting off, contrary to the FIS code. But based on the footage (looks like a helmet cam), there's no evidence that the skier did either, so on this point I'd be equally critical of both

After all it is free

Literally all that room and you decide to ski that close to others.

Boggling.

Definitely GoPros fault. Comes from behind and with all the space available decides to come within metres of the downhill rider. Why?

Skiers need to recognise that when they approach boarders from the heel side they are in an absolute blind spot, so in fresh snow with a complete lack of ski sound the boarder really would have no clue that the skier is there.

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Here's the Mammoth safety code. GoPro man needs to understand the second point in the list:
"People ahead or downhill of you have the right-of-way. You must avoid them."

It looks like the GoPro skier was more concerned with chasing and videoing his mate than with the safety of others,
and failed to avoid the snowboarder who was clearly ahead and downhill until he barged into his line.

The snowboarder looks pretty good, but they don't "shoulder check", which I'd do, just in case there's a
rude incompetent person where I'm about to turn.

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Definitely the camera wearer's fault. Also...why did they not stop to check on what was presumably their mate?!

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It's always the boarder's fault Laughing

The Filmer ... banged to rights

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

A snowHead

Skier 100%. They have effectively come from behind the snowboarder and crossed in front of them. Skier should have given the boarder a much wider berth.

A snowHead

Skier over taking from behind. Skier fault. IMO.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

Also useful when overtaking someone and passing them from behind to shout "on your left". So at least they're aware.

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@Brian in SLC,
That's OK if they speak English...

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Go Pro guy's double fault. For taking the boarder out and then not checking on him.

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Definitely the skiers fault. You, the uphill, passer need to pass safely, without causing difficulty to the down hill person being passed.

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@Brian in SLC, on a cat track for sure, but out on the hill you'd lose your voice and no one would hear you anyway. This is a powder day, people are obviously focused on ripping it up and not on the rules. A time for increased vigilance. I avoid go pro skiers when I can, and when I am that guy I try to be alone. Filming divides attention in a potentially dangerous way.

After all it is free

@Scooter in Seattle, you do see a surprising number of people crashing when they are videoing themselves skiing along (as they put the footage online) and I can’t help wondering if it would have happened if they weren’t focused on videoing themselves skiing down a piste….

Boarder.

Always the boarder.

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I am sure lots of us have been told not to look at the trees when you are tree skiing but look at the gaps. If you look at what you are trying to avoid, subconsciously your mind will think that is where you want to go, therefore you end up hitting that which you are trying to avoid. There is name for this psychological phenomenon however I cannot find it at the moment.

I have seen similar incidents like the one shown, where there is loads of space but the overtaking skier manages to hit the person below. I think this might explain what happened in this instance.

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Can't see how it's anybody's fault other than the skier, it's almost as if he decided to ski into the boarder

You know it makes sense.

@diaphon, Thank you. "Target fixation" is what I was trying to remember.

I suspect it is a factor in a lot of near misses as well.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I am not a confident cyclist and use "target fixation" when having to cycle through what strikes me as a narrow gap - I look at some bit of leaf or scratch in the middle of the target and avoid looking at the bollards!

A snowHead

Go Pro guy's fault. Didn't allow enough room, especially given he's passing a boarder and they have a huge blind spot. And apparently didn't even check to see if the guy was alright!

A snowHead

The boarder was goofy so not blindsided (because he was turning left) when he was turning towards the skier. So arguably he should have been aware that the skier was about and kept clear. OTOH the skier was the overtaking party, and had ample opportunity higher up to take a clearer route and moderate his speed if need be. So on balance I think the skier was primarily to blame, but both should have been more aware.

As noted above, the skier didn't stop to check how the boarder was. Not good.

Help!!

Whose fault is it?

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