 Poster: A snowHead
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@swskier, Thanks.
I'm an obsessive sort of a bollox and know that it would take over my holiday, while I became addicted and fixated on trying to improve my scores.....despite best intentions. 
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Old Fartbag wrote: |
| .....As it is, I get 6 days per year, usually spent with my Daughter and/or a group I might meet in resort.....so cossetting myself in a "Carv Bubble", instead of enjoying the company I'm skiing with, is not something that appeals..... |
You're probably right, we just use it for a quick couple of hours in the morning, and we also, which would not go down too well with your group, ski the same piste, well that's what my Mrs prefers. That said there's nothing to say you can't get good scores on other pistes, which I've been doing recently, as you get to recognise what might offer great carving potential.
Anyway, I'm up for a backside spanking on Friday morning as I've just arranged to ski with a Swedish couple who are very good piste skiers, for sure I'd probably get them in the forest and elsewhere along with skinning up. And from initial looks (he likes his lunches) you wouldn't think they'd be too good, but they live out here the whole season, and they're in their mid 50, and still take private instruction every now and again, anyway I've yet to come across an average / intermediate Swedish skier 
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| Quote: |
His advice was to start off skiing every steepish slope as if it was steeper than it looked.
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I always do that anyway, I suspect. When I joined a ski class in La Plagne when hubby had to go home, the other skiers (from our chalet) were rather better than I was and I said to the instructor that if I was too slow for the class, I'd drop out. He said I was more likely to be too fast, and made me follow immediately in his tracks down a steepish red run. I struggled to keep the distance between us steady - and got the point! A grizzled ESF old boy.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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[/quote] Yupp, I'll second that. And skiing more slowly in perfect control is much more difficult than going fast. Go for precise round turns, vary them, speed up, slow down, try to feel that you're always able to control the ski and not the other way around.[/quote]
S's not Zig Zags or J's. Change the Radius of your turns when you vary your speed but keep them consistant, appropriate for the terrain and be aware of other skiers!
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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@Weathercam, might that be because few “skiing” Swedes just ski 6 days a year?
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| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| @zikomo, @Dave of the Marmottes, Honestly, I see no reason to doubt the 80kph. It's really not that fast. |
I guess it's a matter of perspective, personally I consider 22m per second on a public piste pretty punchy. If you have a reaction and action time of half a second how are you going to avoid a faller in front of you?
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@Dave of the Marmottes, Has anyone suggested that this should be a normal speed for a busy piste? Of course not, but haven't you ever skied on pistes long and wide, and empty, enough to see that it's clear a good 100m or more in front of you?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Weathercam, Nice.
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My Ski Tracks history for last 38 days shows most days max speed would be mid-60's sometimes (perhaps snowy/bad vis) a lot less with the odd low 70's. I did crack 80 or 80.1 to be precise on one day (which was HT funnily enough). That of course is accepting that Ski Tracks measurements should be treated with caution. Also needs to be said the missus does drag us back a little but I think that would only up the km's travelled a tad rather than the speed.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Quote: |
As ever, it's about finding if there's a problem before trying to fix it. Best advice - go out with an instructor, do the sort of skiing that's pushing your envelope and ask them specifically to look out for any issues that may be boot related.
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The question seems to have sparked some interesting discussion but it seems to all come back to getting expert input to my actual skiing. The last few years I have been working very hard to improve my technique knowing I have lots of childhood habits that I slip back into, I have been doing the type of drills you suggest. I know I will never be consistently good as I have limited time to practice. I am also not the type of person who blames equipment, I just like to understand how it is meant to feel and work.
Thanks, I will definitely get my skiing checked before buying new boots
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| @zikomo, @Dave of the Marmottes, Honestly, I see no reason to doubt the 80kph. It's really not that fast. |
I guess it's a matter of perspective, personally I consider 22m per second on a public piste pretty punchy. If you have a reaction and action time of half a second how are you going to avoid a faller in front of you? |
I may have caused a distraction with the speed thing, that is not something I do regularly but I was on a smooth wide curving run out at the bottom of a red run that was completely empty other than me. I would not do that if any other skier was likely to be affected. The S9s gave me the confidence and control I needed in that situation. In other places on the piste and in busy areas I obviously ski differently
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| Artengit wrote: |
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| @zikomo, @Dave of the Marmottes, Honestly, I see no reason to doubt the 80kph. It's really not that fast. |
I guess it's a matter of perspective, personally I consider 22m per second on a public piste pretty punchy. If you have a reaction and action time of half a second how are you going to avoid a faller in front of you? |
I may have caused a distraction with the speed thing, that is not something I do regularly but I was on a smooth wide curving run out at the bottom of a red run that was completely empty other than me. I would not do that if any other skier was likely to be affected. The S9s gave me the confidence and control I needed in that situation. In other places on the piste and in busy areas I obviously ski differently |
Once explained - It seems reasonable to me......and is something most of us have done if on a quiet piste.
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You know it makes sense.
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| Weathercam wrote: |
I went flat out no turns down this today (easy blue) trying to get to the OH who was on it further down and I needed to get to her before she took the lift up again.
Though this was yesterday but it was just as busy today
And I've only just looked out of curiosity, 85kph
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Your hand is not even touching the ground. Please try harder…
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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I'm just amused that Gnarly McTourface has a new shiny gadget and suddenly he's full Jean- Pierre Pistencarver.
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Poster: A snowHead
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Weathercam, a freshly groomed and otherwise empty piste is quite pleasant in its own right.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@under a new name,
If you say so..
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Old Fartbag wrote: |
dangerously fast skiers than usual
It was a testosterone fuelled dangerous game to them.
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A number of years ago I felt that the best way to find out how good a skier you were was to try and get faster and faster - my own personal record was 116.8kmh according to both Messrs Garmin and Strave (in my defence, it was a completely empty piste, just groomed in Fieberbrunn, and a m8 went down before me to make sure there were no surprises...
However, the following year I thought I'd take some lessons to find out what this new fangled carving nonsense was (I hadn't had a lesson since the 80s, and then it was only 2!). The instructor felt I was barely in control, and any turns I did were like handbrake turns!
So rather than think "pah, what does this whippersnapper of an ESF bloke know! I'll show him!" I did more lessons, and do one first thing every year.
Now I feel rather a lot safer both for me and everyone else, and don't have to scrub my underpants after every run. Not only that but my max speed this year (empty run!) was a heady 67kmh!
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Slow is pro.
..Nick
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@Leonard Smalls, Here is a good test. Stick your head out of the window of your car while its doing 70mph. The come back and tell us how it felt the same as the speed you measured yourself doing on piste! I really think measuring speed at all anywhere except in a dedicated speed trap is both meaningless and dangerous.
Great story though and happy for you that you are finding new sensations and experiences. It is a never ending journey!
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| under a new name wrote: |
| @Weathercam, a freshly groomed and otherwise empty piste is quite pleasant in its own right. |
I concur.
And another session as described above this morning carving the corduroy with the OH - though still could not surpass that feeling (and score) that I achieved last week, and later in the session when pure carving was getting more difficult I had an idea.
I waited near the top of a long run for my experiment to appear, and sure enough he came into view, already motoring I gave chase to him, and he was going fast, but I was interested in seeing what sort of control/turns he was doing, especially as the groomed piste had disappeared and all that was left were piles of nigh on scraped windblown snow that were hard to get an edge on, so I joined in the sliding putting speed before control, but still aware of other skiers.
Following him was interesting in that his skis were nigh on flat to the piste, sliding out of the scant turns he made with very little discernable style. In the end, I backed off but continued to carry on skiing (sliding) not bothering with the edges as I wanted to see what my score would be at the end of skiing like that, and yes indeed it was a crap score of 105 averaging 61.4 kph over 2.4km topping out at 85kph - Balance 35, Edging 50, Rotary 64, Pressure 44.
Compare that to my best run of 143 of the morning an hour or so earlier where the av speed was 47.5 and max 57.4 but edging 83 - but better corduroy for sure.
So just shows you don't have to go quick to get better.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Raceplate, poster above claimed 116.8kph which is more than 70mph.
The only way to really know how fast you are going is a calibrated speed gun. I have done that, it’s very interesting how different speeds feel when you are on skis.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Weathercam wrote: |
Anyway good to have another string to the bow and see what a Billy Punter like you could do with their time when there's no fresh to be had rather than just sliding down the piste 
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I've actually spent a reasonable amount of time this season already working on skiing "properly" on pistes helped by a grown up decision to buy a 94mm utility ski (as well as being on some SLs). I guess if someone gave me a Carv I'd try it but buying into the whole Strava like cult probably isn't for me.
Having said that some rockered driftiness is still one of the best uses of an appropriate piste and of course a footbed can't measure the smile on your face.
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Thu 2-02-23 17:21; edited 1 time in total
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Read on FB (don't judge lol) that "11 skiers died over the Christmas New yrs holiday in Austria. All skiing fast and loosing control. 2 17yr old friends on one day, a 12 Yr old Dutch girl. All so sad". Forgetting it's almost unreadable it sounds like a load of poppycock to me. But perhaps some elements are true. Or maybe the whole thing. Can anyone enlighten me?
I sometimes think all this talk of out of control skiers is a bit OTT. Yes, there are occasionally some but I am not seeing carnage and deaths on a regular basis as sometimes it seems to get painted.
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As perhaps an illustration of the weird/mixed messages, a post in the same thread is "my wife's in Tignes at the mo and had two collisions so far by skiers going too fast and not in control. Lucky she wasn't injured". If they are skiing fast and out of control and collide with you, you must have some kind of injury surely. And I know I'm tempting fate here but I haven't had a collision for years and even then it was pretty slow paced light coming together. Not saying it never happens of course.
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You know it makes sense.
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My mate was pushed into a pair of 130 flex something or others. Strong skier, carves well on piste and is extremely handy in the powder!
After a couple of weeks working said boots concluded they were too stiff. He sort advice from a young gnarly freeride dude regarding appropriate flex grade. Young Ollie was horrified that mate was trying to make friends with a 130 flex!
Mate returned to retailer to negotiate a switch to a lower specification boot.
Very simply retailer had pushed out the product he had in stock.......stuff the customer he doesn't matter! Be very careful what unscrupulous retailers shove out!!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| zikomo wrote: |
| @Raceplate, poster above claimed 116.8kph which is more than 70mph. |
Yes, and his post makes it clear that at the time, he was in the "craziest of punters" category that I referred to.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| Layne wrote: |
R
I sometimes think all this talk of out of control skiers is a bit OTT. Yes, there are occasionally some but I am not seeing carnage and deaths on a regular basis as sometimes it seems to get painted. |
Not really even the best (those who literally wrote the book) get killed.
https://snowbrains.com/snowboarder-found-guilty-for-hit-and-run-crash-that-killed-famous-ski-instructor-at-eldora-mountain-resort-co/
If you stand at the side of almost any piste (or safer observe from a lift) you can usually identify a number of people who are not in great control yet travelling fast enough to hurt others. Add to that poor or nonexistent understanding of the skier's code and your only one "sorry mate I hit an icy patch/it was an accident" from the ER.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Raceplate wrote: |
| zikomo wrote: |
| @Raceplate, poster above claimed 116.8kph which is more than 70mph. |
Yes, and his post makes it clear that at the time, he was in the "craziest of punters" category that I referred to. |
Yes I read his post. Did you actually read mine? I was suggesting that some of the speeds mentioned here are almost definitely massively inflated. And I did not make any criticism of this particular poster quite the opposite. So not really sure what you are getting at.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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If the OP is interested in speed then boot stiffness doesn't matter. You just need to stop turning, and of course don't stand up on the course.
Actually you don't need boots at all, or skis: I once photographed a man breaking a world record on an air mattress at about 130km/h, albeit on a speed ski course and properly timed.
Consumer GPS is notoriously inaccurate in some circumstances. There's zero point in trying to tell that to anyone who has not seen a fair few properly timed skiers. Even if they're not as quick (or good) as they think, they can certainly achieve dangerous speeds at a resort. Which is why we have to have speed cops.
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Carv: each to their own. How does a machine switch its "scoring" when on a bump field, or in crud, or crust, or powder? Are they "teaching" (calibrated to) an Austrian skier or a US skier? The styles are massively different. With snowboarding it's worse - how you pressure a board varies depending on the board's design as well as your style. Craig rode very differently from Terje: which is "correct"? How does that work, exactly? I'm not slagging the thing, I'm trying to understand what it is trying to do.
I'm pretty sure an expert skier could produce good form which these devices "mark down", rather like an expert track driver would be marked down by someone who instructs learner drivers, or professional riders would be marked down by instructor types with fixed orthodoxies.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@phil_w, I think the Carv thingie is very much limited to firm, smooth pistes.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Not playing it down (those injuries leading to death are fcking horrific) but that is one death. FB seemed to think there were 11 in one country over Xmas/NY.
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| If you stand at the side of almost any piste (or safer observe from a lift) you can usually identify a number of people who are not in great control yet travelling fast enough to hurt others. |
Mmmm... is that not the nature of the beast. Can it be expected that everyone always has great control and/or travels at speeds that will not hurt others - which in essence means eliminating any collision whatsoever. I mean as I say I do try and I hope others do - and touch wood that has happened but I can't hand on heart say I never push the envelope sometimes. I guess when I do I try to make sure I am well away from others or have enough in the bank. The other thing of course is I have been at it for 30 years but a lot of folk are obviously are a lot less experienced - and in some cases young and fearless.
I don't know I guess one of these days I will be involved with or see a significant collision and get on here/FB saying that there are too many crazies about. Just seems like there is a bit of exaggeration going on to me.
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| zikomo wrote: |
| I was suggesting that some of the speeds mentioned here are almost definitely massively inflated. |
At the very top end, say 110-120kmh, I would be inclined to agree with you. It's well-known that that's often a calculated peak speed over a very short distance that may have been misinterpreted due to the way that GPS works.
But around 50mph/80kmh? No. 50mph has been referred to as a kind of "breakthrough" speed in the States for years as a differentiation point that says skiing regularly at or above that speed you probably know what you're doing on a pair of skis, assuming of course that you are skiing technically correct and not just in a straight race-tuck.
One thing I will say though, is it's much easier to be regularly skiing above 50mph on piste biased skis and that kind of ski is much less popular these days. Therefore, people skiing on fatter skis may not see those speeds very often and think they are unrealistic for everyone, when in fact they're not.
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@Raceplate, I have skied with people using these tracking devices, including in lessons. And I can tell you for a fact that none of these people were doing 50mph, and nor did they have the ability to. But they were convinced. Completely.
I have also overheard people at the lift talking about the run they have just done, and how fast they went. People I have seen hammering it down with very low level of ability. It’s a very real problem and something needs to be done about it as it is getting worse. I vote for more piste patrol and more enforcement of sensible rules, although I doubt that will happen in some parts of Europe any time soon.
I agree on the piste biased skis being an important factor. Heavy and stiff, relatively narrow skis are inherently more stable on firm pistes.
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| Quote: |
it's much easier to be regularly skiing above 50mph on piste biased skis
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You haven't been on the Argentière home run any time recently have you?
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@under a new name, neither have you, apparently
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<laughs> I just checked my Garmin. It characterises my walking to the pub as "running". I think it's trying to make fat people feel better about themselves, hence it always over-eggs pretty much everything: I can be a mega athlete by simply going to the pub a few times a week. I wonder if the Carv thing is not similar. All you'd need to do is program a slight steady "improvement" of the numbers over time into it (like grinding a game)... 
Rather more annoyingly my Garmin thinks heli-boarding is "resort skiing", and rates my max speed at 343.5 kph. It's significantly faster than the maximum speed the helicopter's capable of, but no less accurate than any other speeds posted here. I think it's maybe an intelligence test.
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FAQ
especially on a nice pair of race skis. What did you do with those Nordicas? Mine wore out 
