 Poster: A snowHead
|
@Jonny996,
| Quote: |
I can confirm that the travel insurance you get with one of those bank accounts that give you AA car cover/ mobile phone cover ect covers you for rescue, hospital, reparations, ski pass for days you & your party never used, ambulance waiting at U.K. airport, frankly everything.
|
Daughter and son-in-law have that with their bank. It was only after they had broken down over 100 miles from home that they discovered that this year, for the first time, the AA cover did not include Relay! Always read the small print, never assume cover is the same as last year.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
No idea if its been said but skicover dot com
Ive used these for several seasons, teaching, holidays etc etc
pretty good and comprehensive.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
I have annual European cover for (non winter) trips with my family, and then I buy a week's winter cover separately for myself. Insure and Go cost just over £20 last year - just got a quote and it's nearly doubled this year to £40 for one week! It covers off-piste which is why I've gone with them in the past.
Are other people seeing a huge jump in prices this year?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| Quote: |
It covers off-piste
|
Be careful. It covers off-piste "unless considered unsafe by resort management" and when I tried to clarify that (with another insurer) I was told that I would not be covered if there was an avalanche warning. My telling them there was ALWAYS an avalanche warning, if only 1, made no difference.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
| Aleutian wrote: |
| Are other people seeing a huge jump in prices this year? |
My LV policy (annual family premium) renewed recently went from £150 to £175.
As pam says the off piste criteria of any policy as to be closely checked.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| Jonny996 wrote: |
| I can confirm that the travel insurance you get with one of those bank accounts that give you AA car cover/ mobile phone cover ect covers you for rescue, hospital, reparations, ski pass for days you & your party never used, ambulance waiting at U.K. airport, frankly everything. |
But they won't necessarily cover you if you have any pre-existing conditions. And many have age limits - which the OP, at 72, may fall foul of.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You really have to be careful about telling other people that a particular insurer's policy will cover them. Apart from the fine detail of exclusions across medical conditions, ages, duration and defintions a lot of policies from the bigger insurers are individually tailored: the q&a you have with the bot or the rep is supported by a software catalogue of terms and conditions text, which is then compiled into the PDF document that you receive. Some insurers still have the generic Ts&Cs with a separate qualification but not all, hence you have to be careful about assuming your policy will look the same to someone else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Quote: |
But they won't necessarily cover you if you have any pre-existing conditions. And many have age limits - which the OP, at 72, may fall foul of.
|
Too right. I pay a very hefty premium on my Nationwide policy, to cover my age (75) and pre-existing medical conditions.
I have also found (with house insurance) that you cannot rely on what they tell you on the phone. My house is very near (few metres) the water, and I have two lodgers. It took a lot of effort, and insistence, to get it acknowledged in writing that these facts were taken into account. I had to write several letters and insist that these points were "of the essence of the contract" and unless they confirmed I'd be cancelling. If you ski off piste, in France, it's well worth buying the local Carré Neige insurance with your lift pass.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
I know that it may not be the first company that springs to mind for ski insurance, but I found the Asda Silver policy to be fantastic.
I had an unpleasant injury in Sestriere a few years ago. I did have the Italian version of Carre Neige as well thankfully. The bloodwagon chaps saw the CN cover on my lift pass and said no problem.
I was in hospital for a week and the insurance company phoned me twice a day to see how I was and to get updates from me and update me on their preparations for repatriation. The fellow Englishman who was in the other bed in the room had a complete nightmare trying to communicate with his insurance company. Seem to remember that he was with Saga.
On the journey from the hospital to my doorstep I was looked after every step of the way.My only issue was the almost complete lack of pain relief from the Italians, but obviously that's not the insurance company's fault!
All for a premium of about £10.
I was covered for off piste as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
It's worth bearing in mind that the people selling the policy may be a third party and that there may be another party administering the claims.
So in Asda's case the policies are administered by Insure & Go and the claims are handled by Charles Taylor.
Of course finding a list of insurers that use Charles Taylor for claims (assuming the above is representative) is not easy.
Whole thing is a minefield to be frank.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
| Layne wrote: |
Whole thing is a minefield to be frank. |
If you're entering a minefield it might be a good idea to have insurance...... 
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
|
|
|
|
@pam w, Hi, sorry, only just seen your reply.
" It covers off-piste "unless considered unsafe by resort management" and when I tried to clarify that (with another insurer) I was told that I would not be covered if there was an avalanche warning. My telling them there was ALWAYS an avalanche warning, if only 1, made no difference." - sorry, I'm a bit confused - is that Insure & Go who don't cover off-piste if considered unsafe? The other insurer said that they wouldn't cover you if there was an avalanche warning (and as you said, there's always a warning even if it's level 1), but how do you know Insure & Go apply the same definition of "considered unsafe" - or did they say all insurers do it on that basis? Sorry if I've misunderstood!
In the end I've booked with SkiCover. £26 for a week. A lot more than it used to be but cheaper than the others I saw. Hopefully they have a sensible definition of what's covered off-piste but I'm off to check now!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
@Aleutian, the Company I spoke to was DogTag. They were speaking for themselves.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
|
Both a winter sports travel policy and carre neige serve a purpose - carre neige gets you off the mountain easiest, if it is needed, and to the french hospital without having to provide any euros and a claim back off your insurer.... and once you're in the hospital then your own policy can settle any medical bills, re-pat etc.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| Quote: |
your own policy can settle any medical bills
|
And EHIC/GHIC comes into play then, too
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Yellow Snow wrote: |
| Both a winter sports travel policy and carre neige serve a purpose - carre neige gets you off the mountain easiest, if it is needed, and to the french hospital without having to provide any euros and a claim back off your insurer.... and once you're in the hospital then your own policy can settle any medical bills, re-pat etc. |
Ok - but if you were off-piste (and carre neige covers you for rescue off the mountain), and your travel insurance conditions for off-piste were somewhat "iffy" or vague, could there be a situation where your own policy refuses to settle any further medical bills, repatriation etc?
This is pertinent to me as we have Staysure annual insurance, which includes "off-piste but within the confines of the ski resort on recognised and authorised areas only" (but also has a separate exclusion "you are not covered in areas classified as avalanche rating 3 or above" [not specifically relating to off-piste] - this makes sense in relation to going off-piste, but would appear to also exclude skiing on-piste on open runs - as discussed elsewhere on these forums).
So, for our forthcoming 1-week holiday in the Three Valleys I was thinking of using Carre Neige to cover any off-piste skiing we might do, in addition to our Staysure annual travel insurance, as a "belt and braces" approach. Another option is to take out a separate single-trip policy (e.g. Ski Club Insurance) that definitely covers off-piste skiing and doesn't have the avalanche level general exclusion, but that would be a much more expensive option.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| Quote: |
"off-piste but within the confines of the ski resort on recognised and authorised areas only"
|
Any idea what this might mean?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| johnE wrote: |
| Quote: |
"off-piste but within the confines of the ski resort on recognised and authorised areas only"
|
Any idea what this might mean? |
No, not precisely - this is an example of the "iffy" wording in the travel insurance policy that I was referring to in my earlier post, hence my question: if you were off-piste (and carre neige covers you for rescue off the mountain), and your travel insurance conditions for off-piste were somewhat "iffy" or vague, could there be a situation where your own policy refuses to settle any further medical bills, repatriation etc?
(Carre Neige covers the off-piste accessible from the ski lifts with a pass valid on the ski area.)
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
|
@mj_tay, this point has been debated numerous times..search insurance and sit back for half a day to read them all. Synopsis...its not clear
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| holidayloverxx wrote: |
| @mj_tay, this point has been debated numerous times..search insurance and sit back for half a day to read them all. Synopsis...its not clear |
Thanks - I'm very much aware of that, and have read through lots of forum threads on this. But that wasn't the point of my post!
I was trying to ask the following question: if you were to have an accident off-piste (and Carre Neige would cover you for rescue off the mountain), and your travel insurance conditions for off-piste were somewhat "iffy" or vague, could there be a situation where your own policy refuses to settle any further medical bills, repatriation etc?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Our family has had experience of 2 recent HeliVacs in France.
One for our son who is French resident, and one for our Nephews girlfriend (UK resident).
In neither case did they ask to see any insurance proof before beginning treatment or evacuation.
Patient welfare was number 1 priority and working out how it gets paid for was not even a consideration.
In neither case did we have a Care Neige or similar. I bought my sons lift pass with a French Mastercard, and that gave free ski insurance, underwritten by AIG, and they picked up the bills ( we only paid a small excess and that was for the protracted hospital stay - broken back and being unconscious, they keep you in for a few days). With my nephews GF, my nephew only contacted the insurance company (UK based Policy) after his GF had been in hospital for 4 out of the 16 days she was there, and again they sorted everything out.
Also when my wife was stretchered off and taken to hospital with a broken leg, there were no questions asked about insurance.
Treat patients first - worry about the bills later. This has always been our experience.
What kind of f@cked up places are you guys skiing in where the emergency services lack the humanity and care that they'll only treat you if they know you're insured ????
I'd definitely ski somewhere else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don’t think that’s the case from the feedback I’ve seen. Most people report the same experience as you - that patient safety and care is the first priority. It’s just that at some point, your details are taken (a proven name and home address) and if you have it, your GHIC, and you get a bill subsequently for what’s not covered. In our case, the bills kept coming through piecemeal for a few months. If you have ski pass insurance and a GHIC then the bills will be few and trivial. If you don’t, then you’ll eventually get bills for the pisteurs, medical staff on the helicopter, the helicopter, hospital treatment and medications at a minimum.
If you have a good insurer you contact them ASAP and they’ll actually be really helpful in hospital process and lining-up the scheduled return flight logistics, like extra seats and early boarding. If they are a cheap outfit, and the cover is limited, then you won’t get much advice or help beyond the minimum. And unfortunately, whatever the insurer is like in terms of help during dealing with the accident, their claims handling section or subcontractor may take an adversarial stance about the fine detail of the claim.
Last edited by After all it is free  on Wed 1-03-23 11:38; edited 4 times in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
@LaForet, Right, but the underlying message I am getting is people are worried that without the Care Neige or local equivalent, there is a delay / difficulty in getting expensive assistance like HeliVac.
My point is that that just not chime with my 3 experiences.
IMHO : EIHC / GHIC and some form of ski insurance > Care Neige and some form of ski insurance.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
@OuatteDePhoque, I don't believe that is the question @mj_tay, is asking.
There is no question that some insurance policies do not cover off piste skiing or have restrictions, such as only with a guide. So in that case you would get taken over the mountain but billed and assuming the insurance company asks the right questions they would not pay out. So what @mj_tay, is asking, is if they take out CN (which covers getting you off the mountain) would the fact that you were skiing off piste still be picked up by the insurance company? Let's say you needed care or to be repatriated that wasn't covered by CN, would the insurance company pay out?
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
Yes, this is where @mj_tay question is germane. Because if the insurer (or more likely their outsourced subcontractor) has an aggressive claims management stance, they'll pick up on potential exclusions. One of which may be the definition of what is 'off piste' or 'outside the ski area' or similar. This has been discussed ad nauseam on various threads and the problem is that it depends on the individual policy terms and conditions, and how the insurer or their agent interprets sometimes ill-defined definitions.
And it can't usually be clarified by contacting the insurer. All you'll speak to is a sales agent, not a claims management representative. And even if you could, they're not going to engage in a long "Well, what if ... - would I be covered?" Q&A discussing different potential scenarios. You can't resolve ambiguities arising from poorly-defined conditions by any conversation in advance.
My feeling is that if you feel a policy is so poorly defined that you can imagine a rejection of an otherwise reasonable claim, then it's time to think whether it's the right policy for you. Yes, the odds are that you may be over-thinking the whole situation and that as long as you're retrieved by the usual process there's no distinction between on and off piste apparent in any documents used in your claim. So the issue won't arise. But as ever with insurance, you aren't the person handling the claim, it's the insurer, so your interpretation is subordinate (at least initially).
Last edited by snowHeads are a friendly bunch. on Wed 1-03-23 11:59; edited 4 times in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
And my answer to @mj_tay, is that I wouldn't rely on it even though I think the insurance claim handlers would struggle to ask the pertinent questions as I don't think many understand the nuance. If you are taken off by piste security they would assume you are in resort boundaries.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| mj_tay wrote: |
| holidayloverxx wrote: |
| @mj_tay, this point has been debated numerous times..search insurance and sit back for half a day to read them all. Synopsis...its not clear |
Thanks - I'm very much aware of that, and have read through lots of forum threads on this. But that wasn't the point of my post!
I was trying to ask the following question: if you were to have an accident off-piste (and Carre Neige would cover you for rescue off the mountain), and your travel insurance conditions for off-piste were somewhat "iffy" or vague, could there be a situation where your own policy refuses to settle any further medical bills, repatriation etc? |
Simple answer..yes. however carre neige covers that..doesn't it? Again debated lots on here and people often say it does
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
@Layne, I get the point, but CN is really only of use if you are have indigenous healthcare rights and NO additional insurance. So CN gets you off the hill, and your local healthcare provider pays for your care ( so popular with locals). If you are on a "foreign" ski holiday, then CN is a bit irrelevant because one hopes that you have some for of ski insurance that covers at minimum : Evac, 3rd Party liability (in France typically you don't have this as its on your home / school insurance as partie civile), repatriation and some medical fees.
Like LaForet says claims management can be w*ankers until you threaten to take them to court.
Classic case of when my son broke his back the Casino credit card insurance on which I claimed initially handed it to a French CM company.
They emailed me saying that the travel policy had exclusions for extreme environments such as dessert or remote mountains, and said that my claim was not valid.
I mailed back & suggested that to sell an insurance policy for skiing which was not valid in the mountains was not just absurd but gross mis-selling and completely illegal, and that as the policy was underwritten by AIG, I would take it up with them and the FCA (who I put in copy of the email).
Within 30 minutes a very nice, helpful person phoned me from AIG based in the south of England and could not have been more helpful.
And to return to the idea that CN is some kind of complimentary cover - well, it could be, but only if your main policy is a bit pants.
If your insurance doesn't cover you for where you wanna ski, I'd suggest that CN is still not the answer.
Get a policy that covers you for where you want to ski.
For the last couple of seasons we have used https://www.assurmix.com/ski-insurance
Because of this unambiguous statement:
Practice Extreme activities and sports competitions Off-piste Skiing, Snowpark, Free Ride, Heliski, Ski Touring. Assurski covers all these practices without the need for a guide (ski instructor or mountain guide), on marked trails and not.
Whilst this is suitable for our needs, everyone has different requirements it's probably not as good as more comprehensive specialist products aimed at tourists.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
| OuatteDePhoque wrote: |
| And to return to the idea that CN is some kind of complimentary cover - well, it could be, but only if your main policy is a bit pants. |
But it's very difficult to know if your insurance policy is pants until you actually claim so many take the view that for the price of a coffee per day they like the simplicity of CN. And afaik it covers your medical (that is not covered by local/GHIC), it even covers repatriation. What it doesn't cover is the standard travel insurance type stuff. So in a lot of cases you CN alone will do. And in a lot of cases basic travel insurance will do. The question was simply around any crossover.
Personally I do try to find a UK travel insurance policy that isn't pants and covers my needs but I understand why some take the CN option.
As ever with insurance it's complex - perhaps unnecessarily so.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| Alastair Pink wrote: |
| Last year I moved to LV for multi-trip annual insurance (after several years with MPI who at that time had temporarily stopped doing wintersports travel insurance, although they have now recently restarted). I've just got quotes from both of them for new cover from 1st February and LV looks to be better value, so I'll probably stick with them again. |
+1 for LV. Recently made a claim for missed departure due to Covid symptoms before travel. Initial email said could take up to 60 days to respond and requested further information. Sent relevant screenshots of accommodation booking / cancellation emails and relevant transport cancellations. Received a second email saying could take up to 30 days to respond
Then received a phone call saying that claim had been agreed followed by confirmation email that refund had been deposited into bank.
From start to finish the whole claim only took 2 weeks. Claim was handled by CEGA on behalf of LV, very happy with outcome
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
@OuatteDePhoque, great post that will hopefully counter the fear that medical treatment and rescue will be delayed until you've demonstrated an ability to pay (which I've always considered a myth as I've not heard any first hand reports of it actually happening).
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| mj_tay wrote: |
| Yellow Snow wrote: |
| Both a winter sports travel policy and carre neige serve a purpose - carre neige gets you off the mountain easiest, if it is needed, and to the french hospital without having to provide any euros and a claim back off your insurer.... and once you're in the hospital then your own policy can settle any medical bills, re-pat etc. |
Ok - but if you were off-piste (and carre neige covers you for rescue off the mountain), and your travel insurance conditions for off-piste were somewhat "iffy" or vague, could there be a situation where your own policy refuses to settle any further medical bills, repatriation etc?
This is pertinent to me as we have Staysure annual insurance, which includes "off-piste but within the confines of the ski resort on recognised and authorised areas only" (but also has a separate exclusion "you are not covered in areas classified as avalanche rating 3 or above" [not specifically relating to off-piste] - this makes sense in relation to going off-piste, but would appear to also exclude skiing on-piste on open runs - as discussed elsewhere on these forums).
So, for our forthcoming 1-week holiday in the Three Valleys I was thinking of using Carre Neige to cover any off-piste skiing we might do, in addition to our Staysure annual travel insurance, as a "belt and braces" approach. Another option is to take out a separate single-trip policy (e.g. Ski Club Insurance) that definitely covers off-piste skiing and doesn't have the avalanche level general exclusion, but that would be a much more expensive option. |
Just an update: I contacted Staysure for clarification and they have confirmed this wording is the decision of their underwriter. This means that if there is a significant snowfall pushing the avalanche risk level to 3, you aren't covered even on piste (despite the fact that the ski resort authorities will clear any avalanche danger before opening the pistes) - in essence, you may not be covered if you are lucky enough to have some new snow!!
I looked at Carre Neige as additional insurance, but there could still be gaps in cover in this scenario, so I looked at other off-piste insurance (as recommended here: https://henrysavalanchetalk.com/hat-advice/off-piste-ski-insurance/), and found that Snowcard offered the best value for a week's skiing as other travel insurance items such as cancellation/curtailment, baggage etc are add-ons. I'll continue to use our Staysure annual travel insurance for those items and Snowcard for the skiing. (Despite the crazy wording for winter sports, I've found Staysure to be great value and they were very helpful in handling a recent claim.)
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| Layne wrote: |
| OuatteDePhoque wrote: |
| And to return to the idea that CN is some kind of complimentary cover - well, it could be, but only if your main policy is a bit pants. |
But it's very difficult to know if your insurance policy is pants until you actually claim so many take the view that for the price of a coffee per day they like the simplicity of CN. And afaik it covers your medical (that is not covered by local/GHIC), it even covers repatriation. What it doesn't cover is the standard travel insurance type stuff. So in a lot of cases you CN alone will do. And in a lot of cases basic travel insurance will do. The question was simply around any crossover.
Personally I do try to find a UK travel insurance policy that isn't pants and covers my needs but I understand why some take the CN option.
As ever with insurance it's complex - perhaps unnecessarily so. |
I think CN works well as a hassle free option and if you are worried about cash flow for rescue stuff. I've usually only taken it myself when I had a previous injury and was worried that insurer might get funny if I retriggered it (starting a ski trip literally the day you were signed off by the orthopod for example). But now I do take Austrian Alpine Club which I consider to be a no quibble rescue policy (plus a reasonable cost for activity related injuries) in addition to my regular insurance. Note AAC probably won't cover slipping on the bar floor or appendicitis etc. I basically regard it as my helivac premium, particularly when skiing in the US where resort rescue may be free but you pay for everything once loaded like ambulances can cost $1000 for a simple taxi ride distance.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
| Dave of the Marmottes wrote: |
| Note AAC probably won't cover slipping on the bar floor . . . |
Yeah, but that would never happen . . . especially not on the way to get your lift pass from Admin.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
@mj_tay, it seems Staysure insurance really is less useful than a chocolate teapot At least I could eat a chocolate teapot. when it comes to skiing.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
