 Poster: A snowHead
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Always wanted to do a season so really looking to do this so plan this for 23/24 season. I don’t want to just bum around a resort I’d like improve my skiing on and off piste. I’ve been looking at Nonstop trips to Fernie and the Alltracks Academy can’t seem to find that much in Europe other that instructors courses. Has anyone done Alltracks or Nonstop or done anything similar. Any advice much Appreciated
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Might be worth looking at Warren Smith academy and Phil Smith Snoworks,
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Some say there is a Golden Ticket™ for all of the bashes.... Simply fill in the rest of the season with other interesting stuff..... Plenty of on and off piste instruction and guiding available with top class people.
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I wouldn't rule out the instructor gap-year courses, even if you don't actually want to be an instructor. The two mentioned by @CathyAuLait, both do a lot of instructor training, so you might contact them and ask if you can dip in and out of their courses.
We skied with Phil &co many times in the dim and distant past, and on a few occasions joined in with some of the gap-year training, like "you've booked for this sort of teaching, but conditions are poo-poo for that and we've got a group up doing gates today, would you like to join them instead?". Always ended up getting a lot out of such days.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Mrs t_m did a career break with Nonstop in Fernie. Transformed her skiing. Now works for a ski school here in Switzerland.
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If you already have a decent base you might be surprised just how much you can improve with simply time on snow and no real tuition. Providing you have the desire to learn and push yourself a bit. Even more so if you go to somewhere like Canada where there's "in bounds off piste".
The non-stop courses get pretty awesome reviews. They make for a great experience. The only downside is the costs are pretty insane, you could do a season for a fraction of what they cost. If the money is not an issue and you like such a structured trip they are definitely not a bad option.
I have to disagree with @Chaletbeauroc. While you will almost definitely improve your own skiing by doing an instructor course, it's certainly not the most efficient way, especially if you have no desire to teach in future. How many pro skiers have a coaching qualification? How many pretty poor skiers pass level 1 coaching badge? In any other sport/skill nobody would consider training to become a teacher as an optimal way to improve compared to actually training in what you want to do.
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I would do a season in Tignes. Can be done pretty cheaply if you’re not chasing flash accommodation. Then have a number of weeks over that season with Snoworks. Much cheaper than Nonstop courses with the added bonus of a more time on snow.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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I think a season with Non-stop in Fernie would make you a pretty good all -round skier BUT as boarder2020 have said before you pay heartily for the privilege (largely because you're paying for the laziness of youngsters to have everything laid on a plate for them) and I question whether that you really gain that much more than hanging with other ski bums and just doing it yourself over a season particularly in Fernie which is small enough to have a pretty tight scene and the terrain to get good fast.
Somewhere in Europe that has a seasonnaire's group programme with local ski schools would seem to me a decent bet - TDC do it in Tignes/VDI for instance
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I was just thinking that if you're booking a package, then Europe's ok, but if you're on your own, then North America works better because you can ride off piste (in bounds) safely, alone, which isn't true for Europe. And then you'd need to check the visa requirements for all of those to see how long you can stay.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Klamm Franzer wrote: |
| Some say there is a Golden Ticket™ for all of the bashes.... Simply fill in the rest of the season with other interesting stuff..... Plenty of on and off piste instruction and guiding available with top class people. |
Having completed the quest for the Golden Ticket™ and also spent a season in a French resort, Klammy's suggestion is the best. All the bashes are great and the cost icludes food, accomodation, lift passes and teaching from exceptional instructors. All you have to do is sort out your transport.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@Seahoob, not all bashes include food/lift passes. Do any at all include instruction. Even so, bashes are a good call
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@holidayloverxx, I don't think the conditions of the Golden Ticket are typical. And they are probably a deadly secret. 
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You know it makes sense.
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| philwig wrote: |
| I was just thinking that if you're booking a package, then Europe's ok, but if you're on your own, then North America works better because you can ride off piste (in bounds) safely, alone, which isn't true for Europe. |
Err, why not? Are you just thinking of the Ski Patrol sweeping the area at the end of a day? Cos although North American in-bounds areas may be patrolled there are still vast acres of terrain where you couldn't guarantee to be found if you'd fallen and hurt yourself, so it would be a mistake to think that solo off-piste is inherently safer there than in European resorts.
When I'm skiing alone in an area I know well (in PdS, for example, or before that in Engelberg where we lived for ten years) I tend to adopt a pragmatic approach to off-piste - how busy is the area I'm thinking of skiing? Is it visible from a lift or piste? Is there decent phone coverage? I'd apply the same process in North America (although I've never skied solo there for more than the odd run or two) and of course without that local knowledge I'd be equally cautious anywhere, regardless of patrolled terrain or not.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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In North America (with some exceptions) in bounds terrain is only opened once it's controlled.
I did not say this is the only risk, but it is the one a solo rider can't easily ameliorate.
It seems the most obvious thing to me, governing as it does the very way NA resorts look, and their size.
In the non-internet world, almost no one finds it necessary to be "equally cautious" when off piste in North America as in Europe,
and they're correct. Hence my point.
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Poster: A snowHead
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| philwig wrote: |
In North America (with some exceptions) in bounds terrain is only opened once it's controlled.
I did not say this is the only risk, but it is the one a solo rider can't easily ameliorate.
It seems the most obvious thing to me, governing as it does the very way NA resorts look, and their size.
In the non-internet world, almost no one finds it necessary to be "equally cautious" when off piste in North America as in Europe,
and they're correct. Hence my point. |
Well exactly - size plus the "everybody skis off piste" factor means that you are highly unlikely to be languishing alone unconscious for long unless deep in the woods or late in the day. It's not the only reason to consider N America (and frankly some of the economic headwinds make it more challenging now) but it is a major positive difference for the solo seasonnaire.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| sbooker wrote: |
| I would do a season in Tignes. Can be done pretty cheaply if you’re not chasing flash accommodation. Then have a number of weeks over that season with Snoworks. Much cheaper than Nonstop courses with the added bonus of a more time on snow. |
Also check if the local ski schools do courses (usually early season) for seasonnaires. TDC are good for this in Tignes & Val D'Isere. No doubt Steve Angus will be able to give more detail on that.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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Thanks for all the response some good ideas. I will be on my own and wouldn’t consider off piste alone. Would definitely need to meet others but I’m in my late 50’s do the older seasonnaires
Didn’t know there was such thing as a golden ticket Could be interesting
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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@Glen Charman, quite a few older seasonnaires in Verbier (or Le Chable). A couple of Warren Smith camps to sort out the technique and then get out there practicing would be my reco
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Glen Charman wrote: |
Thanks for all the response some good ideas. I will be on my own and wouldn’t consider off piste alone. Would definitely need to meet others but I’m in my late 50’s do the older seasonnaires
Didn’t know there was such thing as a golden ticket Could be interesting |
Age isn't really as much as a factor as you think (everyone looks the same under a helmet and goggles). It's more about attitude and being good company IME. You probably won't be trying to get lucky in a local bar til 2am every night (though no judgement ) so will likely be out on the hill in better shape than the youngsters often. Admittedly I've largely been skiing solo in N America where there are usually plenty of others speaking the same language and willing to take a stranger for a couple of laps
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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| Hurtle wrote: |
| @holidayloverxx, I don't think the conditions of the Golden Ticket are typical. And they are probably a deadly secret. |
Indeed, but he said "all the bashes include" not specifically saying it was part of a Golden ticket
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@Glen Charman, Mr P and I did the 4 week Perfomance course with ICE in Val D’Isere back in 2016 which runs from early January. We had a fantastic time. It ran alongside and sometimes with BASI courses, our skiing improved hugely (best tuition I’ve ever had), we made some good friends, and though we went back to the real world after 4 weeks, I reckon you’d be set up with ski buddies for the rest of the season if you stayed on. Rather than go into detail here, PM for more info (though I’d advise upgrading accommodation as your no 1 priority, unless you fancy sharing a studio apartment with 2 others!)
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@Glen Charman, If you're planning a season then your biggest expense will be your Digs. Work that out first then find somewhere with loads of varied terrain, (Tignes can get pretty boring after a couple of weeks). Maybe have a look at a Multi-area pass like the Salzburgerland Ski Pass which gives you over 2000km of piste to play with, then pick your resort(s) and fill in the gaps. There's always loads of SHs in most big areas, some of whom maybe more than happy to ski with you and stretch your ability. If you stay in one place then consider finding a really good instructor for the season. Book a private lesson once a week and practice the rest of the time.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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| Glen Charman wrote: |
| Any advice much Appreciated |
My advice this season would be not to go to Europe - you seem to be on the right track with Canada
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| red 27 wrote: |
| Glen Charman wrote: |
| Any advice much Appreciated |
My advice this season would be not to go to Europe - you seem to be on the right track with Canada |
Good point - you only get 90 days unless you have an EU passport
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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| Glen Charman wrote: |
Thanks for all the response some good ideas. I will be on my own and wouldn’t consider off piste alone. Would definitely need to meet others but I’m in my late 50’s do the older seasonnaires
Didn’t know there was such thing as a golden ticket Could be interesting |
Tignes then.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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| Glen Charman wrote: |
| ... I will be on my own and wouldn’t consider off piste alone. Would definitely need to meet others but I’m in my late 50’s .... |
If you really don't do off piste, then North America makes zero sense. You'll wonder what all the cost and fuss is all about. I'm struggling for an analogy - it'd be like going to Tignes and only riding the glacier.
Age... well it depends what you have in mind. There's always a bunch of age 50+ people at Canadian hills at least... lots of people "retire early" into that sort of thing, plus most piste control people [who I know at least] aren't kids either. Of if they are I know their parents. There's always lots of people about... although I'm talking about Canada, where people do tend to be a bit more "open" - possibly because of the language thing. Obviously "what people want" tends to be different depending on their age, so you're probably not going to want to be vomiting in the bus loop at Whistler at 03:00 every day, for example.
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| BobinCH wrote: |
| red 27 wrote: |
| Glen Charman wrote: |
| Any advice much Appreciated |
My advice this season would be not to go to Europe - you seem to be on the right track with Canada |
Good point - you only get 90 days unless you have an EU passport |
The OP wouldn't be working, so could apply for a long-term tourist visa for France.
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You know it makes sense.
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Im pretty sure Rookie Academy in NZ do a Masters Programme using great trainers from all around the world. Ask for Harry to get more info.....
You could do both seasons
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
| philwig wrote: |
| I was just thinking that if you're booking a package, then Europe's ok, but if you're on your own, then North America works better because you can ride off piste (in bounds) safely, alone, which isn't true for Europe. |
Err, why not? Are you just thinking of the Ski Patrol sweeping the area at the end of a day? Cos although North American in-bounds areas may be patrolled there are still vast acres of terrain where you couldn't guarantee to be found if you'd fallen and hurt yourself, so it would be a mistake to think that solo off-piste is inherently safer there than in European resorts. |
That could only come from someone who never really skied in North America! 
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Poster: A snowHead
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@abc, instead of being, as usual, so scornful, why don't you just argue the point?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@Hurtle, the point had been well argued by others (@philwig, @Dave of the Marmottes).
Yes, I was being scornful as this was presented as “advice” by someone who doesn’t really know much of what he’s talking about.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@abc, Thank you for that, scorn from someone who can't distinguish between "advice" (your quotes) and a question is probably not a bad thing.
As it happens my North American skiing is limited to perhaps less than fifty days in total, so yeah, not much, but more than enough to recognise that the perception of additional safety in general may be overstated, and that I would apply no less a level of caution when there than in equivalent conditions in Europe.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| Chaletbeauroc wrote: |
@abc, Thank you for that, scorn from someone who can't distinguish between "advice" (your quotes) and a question is probably not a bad thing.
As it happens my North American skiing is limited to perhaps less than fifty days in total, so yeah, not much, but more than enough to recognise that the perception of additional safety in general may be overstated, and that I would apply no less a level of caution when there than in equivalent conditions in Europe. |
Any "safety" is only as good as the individual but I do think it is a different equation. I can generally relax about avalanches and navigation in N American inbounds (though I will still ski cut before dropping in and beep on big days etc & have been in situations where patrol have said we're opening this lift but you MUST ski under a buddy system). But then because I'm doing more tree skiing I have to be more vlgilant about treewells/deadfall/impaling myself on stumps. I have no problem personally with skiing off piste solo - there wouldn't be a lot of point of being there if I was too afrit of that but of course I am cogniscent of risks while, like everyone, remaining an imperfect mitigator.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Agree that the off piste safety equation is completely different in Europe vs north america. I can feel comfortable riding solo in bounds without avy gear in North America, as inbounds avalanches are incredibly rare. As well as the increased safety aspect it also removes the hassle of having to find partners to ski with if you are travelling solo. Overall it's just a lot less faff and means I can ride off piste everyday without needing to think about anything - which is great for both improving and also from a variety point of view.
Of course that doesn't mean it's completely safe or risk free. Although I feel that a lot of the other risks are rather small and can be mitigated against, but others may disagree.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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How’s the US inbounds off piste different from Euro marked itineraries (secured but not pisted) which see a lot of traffic
Like Mont Gelé, Tortin or Vallon d’Arbi in Verbier?
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I know Steve Angus runs a seasonaire group club thing through the season and Steve's a great coach
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@BobinCH, 3 of the best there 
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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@Glen Charman, the instructor courses are very expensive at the lower levels but the training will definitely improve your skiing. Lessons from experienced teachers always will and BASI et al are good teachers. A better idea might be a package of lessons spread over a season with time to ski in between. This argument has been had on here before but learning to teach helps considerably because you begin to understand your own skiing and can analyse it much better.
The top skiiers in the word don't train to be instructors but they will almost certainly have been part of a racing program when they were younger, or some other form of coaching. Cody Townsend used to be a top freeride skiier and he talks about growing up racing. There is a reason that the instructor systems internationally require a GS race of some kind and in Europe it's the Eurotest which is very difficult.
At the end of the day it's your money.
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Did "Master the Mountain" with Nonstop in Fernie (4 weeks, tho there is a 6 week option). I'm early 50s and there were three more similar, also 2 scottish 65 year old retirees. Was great, tho the food is Very monotonous.
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FAQ
