 Poster: A snowHead
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I have found a cheap flight to Zurich on December 23 for 6 days.
I will be accompanied by a non skiing partner (I know...) who won't adventure herself during my time on the slopes. So I'm basically looking for a nice winter view with Christmas atmosphere and enough mileage for myself in (most of) the mornings.
The way I see it, my options are to return to St. Anton but she will be rather bored during daytime. Easy accessed by a direct train and hopefully many pistes will already be opened, I could skip skiing for a day and use it for a bus trip to Lech then an easy hike towards Oberlech and toboganning.
Or to pay much more and go CH. I have only been to Grindelwald once in summertime, it was outstanding but the piste map looks rather limited and not quite easy for her to reach Wengen/Murren.
Arosa/Lenzerheide were always on my bucket (skiing) list, but with a non skier I won't have all the time I need to tour the area from edge to edge. I also understand that I will need 3 trains in order to get there, which won't be much fun.
Zermatt is easier to get to, it will be nice to return skiing there as well but it's more expensive and the best views are from above the village, on a clear sky afternoon.
Flims/Laax perhaps?
Any idea?
TIA.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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Grindelwald has two distinct areas, "First", which is above the village and may seem limited, then the much larger area connected with Wengen, accessed from the Kleine Sheidegg railway and/or the Maennlichen cable car (apparently there are other new lifts there now). Definitely not small, and the railways link the two villages directly with Interlaken, which is certainly worth a day trip, and up to the Jungfraujoch, which is one of the most spectacular rail trips in the world.
Flims/Laax, great ski area, not so much to interest a non-skier though. Arosa/Lenzerheide likewise, although perhaps not as high or as expansive as Laax.
Other to consider might include Adelboden, lovely village, extensive ski area; Andermatt, very pretty location; Engelberg if you're into steep off-piste, the abbey church, the working Kaserei/museum and various other activities in the village; then of course a whole raft of smaller stations, many more suitable for day-trip skiing rather than a whole week.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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| drporat wrote: |
Or to pay much more and go CH. I have only been to Grindelwald once in summertime, it was outstanding but the piste map looks rather limited and not quite easy for her to reach Wengen/Murren. |
The Jungfrau region skipass covers Grindelwald, Wengen and Murren, so hardly a limited ski area. Why not stay in Wengen, as it's centrally located, and the cablecar from the centre of the village up to Männlichen or the mountain railway up to Kleine Scheidegg lets your non skiing partner easily get up the mountain to meet you for lunchtime. Also there are some long toboggan runs from both of those locations.
If you should decide to stay in Wengen I can recommend the very good value (for Switzerland) Hotel Edelweiss
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Braunwald - great little place
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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In simple terms the Jungfrau region is the "benchmark area" for non - skiers.
Tobogganing is a huge part of the winter sport scene and to that end the entire mountain area is accessible to pedestrians.
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@drporat, years ago I had one of my more memorable ski runs in Grindelwald, not because because it was challenging (it wasnt) but because of how beautiful it was. There is an isolated long run in the First area that goes down to a bus stop on the Grosse Scheidegg road. No difficulties (I think it is a blue) but it meanders through idyllic farm huts with views across to the Eiger, Monch & Jungfrau. On a beautiful sunny morning with no one else around it was simply stunning. There was plenty of skiing to keep me amused for a few days, the train system works well easy enough to get from Grindelwald to Wengen or Mürren (though Mürren is a bit of a way). Easy to go to Interlaken too. I cant imagine it is cheap though.
In Austria another option might be the Montafon villages (train to Bludenz, then either local train or transfer), plenty of skiing not too dissimilar to the Arlberg (next valley) but more traditional villages with less "party" than St Anton or less "place to be" than Lech.
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| munich_irish wrote: |
| @drporat, years ago I had one of my more memorable ski runs in Grindelwald, not because because it was challenging (it wasnt) but because of how beautiful it was. There is an isolated long run in the First area that goes down to a bus stop on the Grosse Scheidegg road. No difficulties (I think it is a blue) but it meanders through idyllic farm huts with views across to the Eiger, Monch & Jungfrau. On a beautiful sunny morning with no one else around it was simply stunning. |
That brings back memories. First time I did it I think we ended up skiing down the road a bit too, probably having cut off the official piste and missed the bus stop. But yeah, one of those runs that are just 'nice'.
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@munich_irish, "Stepfi". finishes at Wetterhorn Hotel, great spot for a pint and bus back to
Grundy!
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Grindy....
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@drporat, I'm going to second what@munich_irish, suggests about Montafon villages, it's an easy train ride from Zurich Airport and surprisingly cheap train tickets to Bludenz. The "local" land-busses will take you to Lech, but there's Sonnenkopf ski area to think about.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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Three trains to Arosa sounds much worse than it is! Simple changes at Zurich main railway station and at Chur. The last 50 minutes on the local train up the Schanfig valley is scenically sensational.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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@skimastaaah, .....and Damuls...best snow record in the Alps. Train from ZRH to Bludenz and taxi.
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Innsbruck
St Moritz
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You know it makes sense.
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All these things depend on the specifics of the partner. There is a difference between "won't adventure" as in won't undertake vast snowshoeing expeditions to won't go to the hotel wellness on her own. And then there is their expectations of the skier - are they expecting lunch and every afternoon together or perhaps riding up for lunch on the mountain then allowing the skier another couple of hours.
I really don't know how non-skiers do it. I find it maddening when I'm "off games" in a ski resort. Though I have been through injury a fair amount.
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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Many thanks for all your input.
Montafon ski area looks nice indeed but mostly blue and rather low, won't its lower altitude be a potential problem for Christmas week? It could be a good choice for a family ski trip in January though...
Dave, I think the only enjoyable way to go to a ski resort with a non-skiing significant other is to choose a smart, curious and self dependent person who will use her free hours to read, watch Netflix/YouTube subscriptions, socialise with friends and step out by herself to check the various shops then to take a bus/lift and meet on the mountain for an early lunch, hopefully to return to the hotel together for some sauna/pool quality time etc.
I have no illusions of being able to ski every day from early morning till closure of the ski area and I don't have any incentive to do that. I would rather spend my time with her, enjoying our shared vacation
then disappear for a few powerful hours on the slopes. It should be nice for an extra vacation, arriving after next PSB, and definitely not enough if this is one's only ski trip.
This is why I would rather take the train to CH to a chocolate box resort rather than part time skiing in Austria (although I was surprised to find reasonable prices for that week in Lech, compared to St. Moritz/Wengen).
It should be a very expensive week (Christmas  ) so probably my final selection will rather be based on the accommodation's price (unfortunately it has to be a hotel, when everybody is skiing then any central flat will do) and the altitude, hoping for snow at resort level and some Christmas market/winterweg action)
Wengen (1274 m) will be beautiful if the valley is covered with snow, not to mention taking the train for meeting for lunch on the mountain 
St. Moritz ski map and higher altitude (1846m) look promising for skiing and day trips.
If it wasn't the Christmas week, a good plan would be to go to Zermatt for 3 days then take the Glacier Express to St. Moritz and stay there for the rest of the week.
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Poster: A snowHead
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I would have thought areas around the Arlberg would be a better bet for pre Christmas snow than the Jungfrau region but there is always an element of chance. If you can get reasonably price accommodation then Lech is good though less non skiing activities than Wengen or St Moritz (my brief recollections of passing through was that it isnt that nice a place, too many expensive watch / handbag shops)
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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@drporat, check Cœur des Alpes in Zermatt which is great and has a spa. She can get the Sunnega lift to Findeln for several excellent lunch options with million $ views, and could get lift or walk / snowshoe up to Furi / Blatten for more.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@drporat, did you check out the prices of the Hotel Edelweiss link I gave in Wengen?
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@Alastair Pink, they had no availability on their website even when I went for the whole week, 23 to 30/12.
@BobinCH, thanks I will check it.
@munich_irish, for a non skier Lech is a bit dull I guess but I remember a local bus arriving to Oberlech, close to a nice restaurant with perfect views (Salome) and there are some winter trails in that area.
Shopping will be out of the question of course, Lech or Switzerland.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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@drporat, It has been mentioned already but maybe look at Engelberg. You can get to almost all the mountain restaurants by cable car and easily go into Luzern on the train.
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| drporat wrote: |
Wengen (1274 m) will be beautiful if the valley is covered with snow, not to mention taking the train for meeting for lunch on the mountain
St. Moritz ski map and higher altitude (1846m) look promising for skiing and day trips.
If it wasn't the Christmas week, a good plan would be to go to Zermatt for 3 days then take the Glacier Express to St. Moritz and stay there for the rest of the week. |
I have no idea on the cost and availability of lodging in Zermatt and St Moritz. But if you can swing it, that sounds like an ideal trip. Basically, a winter wonderland tour with a bit of skiing thrown in.
One word of caution, the area around St Moritz is pretty, but the town of St Moritz is not exactly "chocolate box". So if you do that trip, you may consider start at St Moritz and finish in Zermatt. Or it maybe disappointing arriving at St Moritz after Zermatt.
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Glacier Express tickets are only available for reservation 92 days before the trip and can only be booked 2 months before traveling. I might miss and then the whole hotel booking deal will be more expensive and limiting. Might give it a raincheck for a less crazy week in a different winter
So I've showed my non skiing partner all options (meaning a couple of well spent Google Earth and YouTube evenings) and now i must choose between Jungfrau area and Zermatt.
Being that early in the season (Christmas week), it seems Zermatt might be snowier (village and surroundings) due to its altitude and ski area.
But all the above mentioning of Grindelwald pistes and Wengen make me hesitate, the views should be special in the winter (only been there once in the summer). I guess that if we go for Jungfrau ski area, Grindelwald might be a better place for a non skier (bigger village, more sledding/toboganning options) but it's about 240 m lower so in theory less chances for snow on the streets.
Will Zermatt be a better choice for the Christmas week in our case, and should I leave Jungfrau for another year in January or even Feb/early March?
Thanks again.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Klosters - Just two trains from Zurich (plus airport shuttle train). Good ski area (Davos). Bars and restaurants. Lovely hotel Chesa Grischuna, very romantic.
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