Zipfits - have they gone bust?

A snowHead

Looking at the way the tongues in these have been done, it's a total bodge and obviously not fixable with any kind of re-stitching. There is insufficient material on the underside of the tongue.

The factory didn't spot it (zero QA) and neither did the shop.

Somebody posted that I've been waiting for him to respond. I have no idea who he might have been (not being a member of the nasty clique here) and it looks like the post has been edited or removed.

These liners are about a year old and nobody would have touched them under any warranty. Also, in case you all wonder, how could any customer have anything to do with a shop which has been so rude about the customer on social media?

I vaguely recall the previous liners I had were Sidas. I might go back to something similar. Unfortunately there are very few ski shops in the SE UK and few want to get into this stuff. One shop owner said to me he can make £500 selling a ski jacket so why spend a couple of house fitting boots and liners for the same money? That was a big shop near the A27/M27, Portsmouth area. Snow & Rock in Brighton stock basically nothing, and a shop near the A24 is not interested in custom stuff either. Might do it in a resort - far more choice usually.

Enjoy the rest of your winter, everyone, and I hope you get more people turn up which you can get your nasty teeth into Smile

A snowHead

@Peter Stevens,

the liner you had was totally fixable you just can't admit that as you didn't want to send it to me, if i couldn't have fixed it we would have changed it, but hey too late, that ship sailed the minute you took a knife to it

with the attitude you take towards ski shops and their staff and owners it will get increasingly difficult for you to find anyone to do anything to help you, good luck getting sorted in resort, they will see right through you as well, and they certainly won't be within a stones throw of your ivory tower when you are in a different resort next season

as for insulting customers on social media, you ceased to be a customer the minute you decided to slate us to the world for not finding fault with your liner, so the only person i am insulting is an internet troll

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

so, for those interested, just to show what could have been done, this tongue is leather not neoprene, but it is the same pattern, had i been doing this on the real thing i would have done a number of other things including matching the thread colour, the thread weight (tex 20 not 40 as used), stitch length and bonding the materials together to give a more even finish, but when someone says something very simple can't be done i had to show that it is possible, the neoprene would have been able to have slightly more stretch to allow a bigger margin if it were needed

inside of tongue original

outside of tongue original

spilt tongue

inside tongue after extending material, see the additional length from the second stitch line

outer of tognue extended

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@JudgeMent4l, as I said, everyone's out of step except my Johnny or, in this instance, Peter Stevens.

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@CEM, Thank you very much for sharing that.

@Peter Stevens,

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

CEM - the edge of that leather in your photos will still cause a cut, unless the person is wearing thick socks.

Perhaps the socks are one factor. You may recall that the person in your shop recommended thin socks.

Somebody asked a few posts back whether it hurts, obviously intending to say that he or she is hoping that it does. Well, it does hurt quite a lot.

It takes about 4 weeks to heal up - just in time for the next ski trip Smile

Zero QA at the Zipfit factory. Zero inspection of the product at the UK shop.

@Peter Stevens, the edge on your liner is neoprene not leather, so would have a completely different finish to that of the pictures, i just didn't have a tongue with neoprene that i could cut open to show what could be done

as i said in the past every single liner i have in stock has the same finish and you are the only person who has had this issue ... i think that says more about you than the liners

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As an aside - as I am lazy and have not googled it, where can i get some silicone for my zippers - need to put some in the tongue.

snow reports

Following on from @adithorp's question, from the photos, these are blisters and not cuts. Blisters are caused by either pressure, friction as a result of movement or a combination of both. I've had plenty of blister experience from walking boots as I have heel spurs...

Does the sock have any stitching, embroidery from a logo, funky design or a change of density? Please make sure that you ONLY wear one pair of socks and that you don't put them over any thermals/long-johns that go into the boot. From the multiple very distinct lines that are seen in different stages of healing, this looks like rubbing from a seam or a row of stitching in the sock or another item of clothing that's been put in the boot that lines up in a slightly different place every time it's put on. If the rubbing was from the tongue of the boot, surely it would be in pretty much the same place every time?

Get some plain socks and stop putting anything apart from your leg and sock into the boot liner.

Bootfitters - making a living out of your misfortune.

FFS! Stop lining the pockets and massaging the egos of these modern day snake oil salesmen.
What would possess somebody to attempt to cram their feet into uncomfortable, rock hard plastic and metal shells, and then spend the rest of their lives and money paying these charlatans to fettle them making them mildly less uncomfortable with each subsequent iteration.
If you have funky feet, consider a winter sport where you can wear comfy off-the-shelf footwear, or even another sport you can do barefoot like surfing, waterskiing, paddle-boarding, trampolining etc...

StevenPeters: You have been sold a lie, and a whole industry has built up around it.

it's a fabricated construct like the dinosaurs or the curvature of the earth.

You know it makes sense.

Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:

I once bought Lange boots that gave me the exact same type of blister on the side of my calf. It wasn't the boot fitters fault, he did olympic gold medalist's boots and hundreds of others without an issue and they fitted perfectly. It wasn't CEM. A couple of places had a look and were equally stumped at the blisters (I recommend compeed and shaving the area first). I realised that it was a simple quirk of my calf, the normal boot liner stitching and not any deep issue with the liner manufacture. It was just one of those things in life. I got Sidas injection moulds that worked perfect and have done for years. They did have one slight issue with pressure on my ankle but a quick sticky pad on the side sorted it (Thanks Ellis Brigham, I got the Sidas from them, not the boots).

Even though the liners were "custom fit" they are still mass market so I didn't expect perfection. IE I was willing to work with the shop to get a solution.

But.... hey, what do I know. I have thousands of posts so I must be a total but-hole. Happy

A snowHead

@jd_evans, good point. One other thought..... does the OP wear full length thermals. I only wear 3/4 length and a sock because of rubbing in the past.

A snowHead

@Dave of the Marmottes, you mean omnifit? I bought a couple of tubes a month or so back off a UK seller via Google: Sheffield ski shop - ski racing supplies, I think. They had loads: but just Googled and out of stock again.

Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?

I have worn all kinds of padded socks in years past. As you know there is a vast range of extensively contoured ski socks, with pads over ankles, etc. Like these
https://www.x-bionic.com/en/shop/intl/x-socks-ski-touring-silver-4-0-anthracite-melange-orange-fluo
which are widely sold in all the Italian resorts.
I never saw any advantage in any of these, preferring to get the boots adjusted (with the various local / heating adjustments) so they are right. For example one of my ankles sticks out more than it should and that boot had to be tweaked several times. Now the boots are spot on. The cuts/blisters I got a year ago were with socks like the above. So this winter I wore a thin pair of socks, only. No seams, stitched patterns, etc. No brand name otherwise I would have linked to them. They may have been bought at the Bicester shop. The result was however similar.

No other items of clothing inside the boots.

As to why the two cuts/blisters are about 2cm apart, it could be within the range of twist of the tongue, or the 2nd one could have been cause by the edge of the 3mm neoprene which I tried to use to protect the leg from being cut by the tongue edge. The neoprene was fabric-backed which is not ideal against the skin. You will still get a "burn", due to the rubbing.

The shin protectors which worked perfectly to protect from the tongue edges were
http://www.shinshields.com/
but in the end were not wide enough. They would have needed to be about 2" wider, but the company makes only the one size. Hence my try with the 3mm neoprene.

Anyway, I have a result: I emailed the contacts at the factory which I briefly corresponded with a year ago, told them this is unresolved, and they are sending me a new pair of liners. That's good - a company that stands behind its products!

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@Peter Stevens, how are you planning on getting your new liners fitted?

Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.

@sugarmoma666, ngghhhh

You'll need to Register first of course.

I predict he'll be back whining again after his next trip....

Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...

After all it is free

@Hurtle, I'm looking forward to it already

@Peter Stevens, what you doing with the now redundant zipfits?

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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.

@Peter Stevens, Does the factory want you to send back the allegedly faulty product first, before sending you out a brand new product?

snow reports

I generally lurk on here to check for the snow reports (not sure that’s a good thing this year!) but happened across this thread, knowing nothing about the main protagonists! As someone involved on designing and manufacturing injection moulded and textile products that fit onto humans I know full well that you cannot make a product that suits everyone. So if you buy a product and it’s not working don’t whinge on a public forum. Go straight to the place you bought it and ask for help. I can say most companies making specialist products do not trawl forums or social media as they deal in specialist high value equipment. I find it very odd when people spend a small fortune on a bespoke product then complain in public without reaching put to the supplier (note supplier, not the manufacturer). All kudos to CEM for even bothering. I was particularly tickled by his comment about the manufacturer changing their production processes Very Happy

I’ve been at the manufacturer end of these conversations and this is why we have specialist retailers or installers. Our business is making product for the many, not for the one outlier. The secret is to make the product adaptable, which a liner clearly is.

I also speak as a person who kept a pair of Raichle Flexon Comps for 25 years until they literally fell apart, because they fitted my weird feet with skinny heels and spurry forefoot and big calves.
But as a skier, at one time but long since lapsed instructor, and now two week a year holiday guy I know most people talk total dangly bits about this great sport, but ski boots generally make or break enjoyment. The Salomons I replaced the Raichle with lasted 3 seasons, and each season on the first 3 days I literally had to stop on a piste, remove the boot, and massage my foot back to life. The Atomic “park boot” I replaced the Salomons with, in contrast, are the best fit I’ve ever had (another 3 buckle boot like Raichle) I can wear all day, buckled up, no fiddling.

FWIW getting friction pinch marks like that are quite common with big calves and taller boots with a narrower cuff area. The liner and shell combine to pinch the skin in that area as you buckle up and you don’t notice until you either start to get pain an hour or two in or (in my case) bleed all over your boots and socks and leave a trail in the mountain restaurant! I had the same on the Salomons (not Zip liner). Maybe look at a lower boot, or a boot with more flared calf area. As we get older our bodies change. What worked when we were 20 doesn’t apply when 50 (unfortunately!).

So in summary, if you have a problem with a custom product go direct to the place you bought it. Don’t whinge in a public forum and expect a response because believe it or not, those of us making these products don’t spend every waking hour monitoring them….and if we did, we’d say “go back to your retailer” because that is the supply contract we have with them. You are their customer. He is our customer.

If that doesn’t solve the issue, then take up snowboarding…. Toofy Grin

Spot the words the forum software replaced Very Happy

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Zipfits - have they gone bust?

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