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Ski and board? Who does both and how heinous is it?

 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
Morning all,

Bit depressing reading pretty much every other thread turns into a Brexit or CV19 discussion at the moment, so the OH and I are looking at trying to get our snow fix for this year and make the most of the situation.

So we have both been skiing for 6 years now. Picked it up fairly quickly and now we both consider ourselves pretty competent on two planks. We'd both fancy giving snowboarding a try as well. Going up to Hemel/MK domes is fun, but the novelty kinda wears off after a while just going up and down the same 150 meters...... so we thought we'd take a few boarding lessons.

Just curious to see how many people do both? Which one did you start with and why did you want to try the other side? Not that as skiers we have any gripes with boarders but there is obviously the traditional "divide" between the two camps! Did learning the other discipline help understand why boarders stop in the middle of the piste just under a crest....or why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?

Very Happy
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Quote:

Did learning the other discipline help understand why boarders stop in the middle of the piste just under a crest....or why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?


Boarders can't stop on flats as they wouldn't be able to restart. Ime both boarders and skiers stop in the middle of the piste, and both are capable of straightlining at fast speeds.

I'm probably not the person to ask as I've never had the urge to learn how to ski. I can see why snowboarders might want to switch, skiing is better for touring and icy pistes. With the modern skis I think many of the "advantages" of snowboards have been equalled by skis.

My advice for your lessons would be padded shorts and expect you will fall considerably more than you probably did learning to ski.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I started with boarding, I only go for a week every year. I much prefer boarding but have tried skiing for a couple of days on each trip, I found that it translated over quite well.

I could parallel turn on the skis almost straight away, and basically use the same mechanics as I was using on the board, digging in edges for turns.

Definitely would prefer the boarding as the equipment is a lot more comfortable, had a few mates who swapped their skis with me and whilst they weren't terrible on the board, they could not pick it up well enough to want to try it for more than an hour at a time
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Fridge03 wrote:
Did learning the other discipline help understand why boarders stop in the middle of the piste just under a crest


Not that I'm a boarder, but I have noticed that skiers are probably worse at stopping slab bang in the middle of a piste, just that they're more visible because they have to stand.
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Me. I learned to ski as a kid and then got to the point (age 19) where I thought I might try boarding for a change too. That was 25 years ago and I switched to snowboarding, as I preferred it. Once my kids started skiing, I switched back, to help them, but now they're at an age where they don't need any help from me, I've gone back to boarding. I'm a better boarder than I am at skiing, but I'm decent enough on skis, so do enjoy switching back when I've done it.

I would say that the only assistance it gave me, when I learned to board, was the ability to see a slope and know how to tackle it, rather than being a complete beginner. Technique wise I don't think it helped me greatly, but I had snow and slope sense, so that was a big help (if that makes sense).

I often see people knocking one side or the other, but to me they're both things I enjoy, they're just different.

Boarders sat down in awkward spot = Thickos who don't know any better
Skiers tanking past you = Not actually that good, but just a bit of willy waving to make them feel better about themselves
Toofy Grin snowHead
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I used to be a way better boarder than I was a skier. Then fat skis came along and that was that. Now only get to board a couple of days a year. Not that it's not great when conditions are good but hardpack, traverses and general admin are drawbacks. Need to keep it up though as a chronic injury option - I've been able to board with quad and calf strains when walking was difficult and skiing all but impossible.
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Then you can post your own questions or snow reports...
Interesting thoughts all.

The boarders and skiers comment was tongue in cheek FYI! Just the common complaints from both sides! Razz

I do love skis. And I think the way that I would like to tackle the mountain, skis will probably always be my first choice. I love carving a groomed piste but then, I've been with a boarder who was the quickest person I have ever seen on a hill carving down some runs in La Plagne.

From what I've seen and read though, boarders seem to have it made when the fresh stuff falls? But skiers can cope with harder pistes and ice somewhat better? These are obviously generalisations.
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
I started because I was working in Finland (it used to be possible...) and the slopes in Helsinki are pretty small.
I was an expert skier so those slopes got pretty boring fairly rapidly, plus snowboards had just become available with steel edges.

Motivation: Regis Roland, and small slopes.

It took me about 4 hours practice before I could ride top-to-bottom without a crash. I'd expected it to be much harder, but it turned out that board mechanics are the same as ski mechanics - stick it on edge and it turns. My buddy with whom I started wasn't quite so competent on skis; didn't get up from his crashes quite so fast; and never nailed boarding either. It's all about attitude and what your goals are.

I never put skis on again, and continued to work at my snowboarding.
I suppose it took a couple of seasons to get up to the same level on a board as on skis;
a bit longer to ride with the world's best in powder (Craig was my co-pilot too).

=> I think "lockdown" is an excellent opportunity to learn something new.

  • I could already ski powder just fine, so ease of snowboards there were never relevant.
  • The superior trick potential of skis isn't relevant to me: it's all about the turn.
  • I know how to read a slope so I don't get stuck on flats, and I take skier buddies to break trail.
  • I don't stop on resort runs and never sit down on the snow (newbie cat/heli snowboarders do that and find that they can't get up in powder unless it's really steep).


I learnt in Europe, where there wasn't any traditional "divide". I think that's more of an American thing.
My own "divide" is between those who can keep up and those I won't ride with; I don't care what you have on your feet.

Good boarders are faster in cat/heli powder, even with modern skis. On hardpack it's the other way around.
In terms of keeping up with a group it's not an issue either way: competence is more important unless you're actually in a race.
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I was a pretty good snowboarder after switching from skiing, the days of Rossignol Equipe 4s 207's, I started snow-boarding when most learnt made the switch using their ski boot and hard boot bindings, some 35yrs ago or thereabouts???

Then it was snow-boarding all the way for 25 years or so, helped along by a friend who worked at Second Level Sports, importers of Burton.

So there was a whole gang of us, some who made the switch and others who started straight out on boards, should add that most were windsurfers at the time so was a sort of peer pressure thing.

I was only talking to someone today about that learning curve, no helmets, falling and doing your coccyx then as your back hit the hardpack whiplash of your head on to the snow and nigh on concussion rolling eyes

My OH was quite adept at snow-boarding as well.

Back in 97 did our first trip to La Grave with the boards and over the years we did many of the classic runs on them, but the long traverses, both from Vallons and Chancel were still a nightmare.

As we were introduced to touring so we added to our hardware, collapsable poles, snow-shoes, approach skis / split-boards huge Swallow Tail powder boards, but eventually, as @Dave of the Marmottes, mentioned I'd see my mates who were on skis raving about the new fat skis and at the end of one week hut to hut I tried some skis and got on all-right.

Next season bought some skis and that was basically that, and at the time many of my other mates who used to be skiers inc OH also made the switch.

I don't think I've been back on the board since, but my OH sometimes does when a girlfriend of hers comes out who only boards.

So @Fridge03, the big question I'd have for you, is are you fit and agile and relatively young?

As for new activities in the snow to do I've just pulled the trigger on something that at my age I really should know better Shocked
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Fridge03 wrote:
Morning all,

....or why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?

Very Happy


I am probably guilty of this, but for good reason.
When skiing at pace my vision is a long way down the hill, if I give a boarder or skier a wide berth there is a fair chance that they will throw in an unexpected turn and bring them into my path.
If I am close in behind them if they take a random turn then it takes them away from my trajectory. If however they continue on their path I can chose my line accordingly.
So although it seems reckless it is actually safer!
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Sorry Chattonmill but there is no "good reason" to ski so close to someone. You are being reckless and selfish. You should simply slow down and make sure you keep a safe space between you and other skiers in front of you. As it is, you seem quite happy to terrify them.
Unfortunately your behaviour is all too common.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
@Chattonmill, You're a dick. Aiming to go fast close to people, wrong in all respects. Dick.
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So if you're just off somewhere snowy come back and post a snow report of your own and we'll all love you very much
@rogg, +1
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
@Chattonmill, if a skier takes a turn that you can't avoid, then you're skiing too fast for conditions
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Weathercam wrote:


So @Fridge03, the big question I'd have for you, is are you fit and agile and relatively young?

As for new activities in the snow to do I've just pulled the trigger on something that at my age I really should know better Shocked


Early 30s. Fittish. Agileish.....

I've got a couple of dodgy knees and ankles from years of suffering rugby. Am I right in thinking that snowboarding could be a bit more forgiving on the joints? With the exception of your back bottom and wrists!

What have you got planned Weathercam?
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
@SnoodlesMcFlude, Completely agree, which is why I haven't collided with anyone for 35 years!
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Fridge03 wrote:
From what I've seen and read though, boarders seem to have it made when the fresh stuff falls? But skiers can cope with harder pistes and ice somewhat better? These are obviously generalisations.

When snowboards started being used one of the main attractions was the float in powder, as was the increased ability to ride switch, do tricks, etc. But that triggered the change in ski design to be able to largely match those characteristics. Just as split boards perhaps give the benefits that independent leg movement has. Hence today there isn't such an obvious reason to go one way or the other - although my feeling is splits are still fairly niche and the ski's just about have the edge for versatility.

I've never even tried boarding even though I've been on trips with boarders occasionally. I've had skier buddies give it a go but after a couple of hours dismissed the idea. Equally I know a number of committed boarders who've never really given skiing a go. For me I love skiing, always feel I'm still learning, getting a smidgeon better each year and never wanted to start from scratch again. And as I've got older I think that feeling has increased to the point I can't really see myself doing it. However, I have two children (currently 13 and 15) who do both. They started skiing first (around 4) and then a bit later (7ish) started to board too. My son (the older) has probably got into at the most but he really is condition dependent - he wants to board when conditions are clearish and the snow softish. Daughter (youngest) I think actually has a slightly more natural talent for it but hasn't done as much. I think the point about being youngish and enthused enough maybe key. Skiing with my kids it was inevitably hard work for a while - quite physically hard and mentally getting up constantly mentally demanding. And there were frustrations at times. But last time we went - last Spring in Les Menuires - my son did quite a lot and could go almost anywhere as a group, he could keep up ski any piste or off piste which was really cool. There is still the occasional flat that is a pain (especially off piste) but that's all.
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 Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
I'd have liked to have given boarding a go a few years ago, never got around to it and when you get half decent at something like skiing it seems to be best to stick at it imo, unless you've got weeks to faff about learning per season, which I haven't.

Folks who board to a decent level ime seem to get into offpiste a lot faster than when skiing, and it comes into its own in deep powder obviously. I seriously can't see the attraction of boarding in hardpack, all the scraping and juddering about etc, however in full flow in deep powder it must be a fantastic sport. I guess you've just got to put the hard piste km's in before you get there though...
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I learned to snowboard at the same time as I was learning to ski. My ski coaching was relatively intense so boarding was a nice chance to do things my own way and be on the hill. I still enjoy boarding and love teaching it, but perhaps don't do as much as I should these days.

For back country, ski's are the answer...
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 Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
The only reason I learned to board rather than Ski was that Ski Lessons at Tamworth seemed very boring. 20 mins in a queue to snow plough 3 meters.

Boarding on the other hand is taught by a load of useless kids who just let you get on with it.

I am envious sometimes when I see Skiers going touring. Should really give it a go....
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Chattonmill wrote:
@SnoodlesMcFlude, Completely agree, which is why I haven't collided with anyone for 35 years!


but how many nervous skiers/boarders have taken a tumble because you skied to fast/close to them?
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@AndAnotherThing..,
Quote:

For back country, ski's are the answer...


Yep agree, but done properly boarding looks pretty good fun too, carving big lines in the powder. Always looks a pita though when they get stuck on a flat at the bottom......
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Quote:

but how many nervous skiers/boarders have taken a tumble because you skied to fast/close to them?

@Mr.Egg, Exactly
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Chattonmill wrote:
Fridge03 wrote:
Morning all,

....or why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?

Very Happy


I am probably guilty of this, but for good reason.
When skiing at pace my vision is a long way down the hill, if I give a boarder or skier a wide berth there is a fair chance that they will throw in an unexpected turn and bring them into my path.
If I am close in behind them if they take a random turn then it takes them away from my trajectory. If however they continue on their path I can chose my line accordingly.
So although it seems reckless it is actually safer!


I really don't understand the principles involved here
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@Fridge03, I don’t think snowboarding is more forgiving on the joints. Not when you’re learning and likely to be hitting the ground with a splatt regularly.

I learnt to snowboard after skiing for about 8 years. I was a similar age and fitness as you describe for yourself. Found the first 3 or 4 days very physically demanding. Body took a battering.

Became enjoyable after that and the following year was able to get around the easier parts of St Anton + Lech/Zurs fairly confidently.

Afterwards tended to board only on days where the snow was fresh and/or visibility limited. Boarding after a fresh snowfall is wonderful.

About 10 years later decided I was too old to enjoy the extra physical effort needed and switched almost entirely back to skis.

Glad I dabbled with snowboarding and would suggest you crack on with it soon if keen to try. Have a few lessons from the start. Don’t forget wrist guards and padded shorts.
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Markymark29 wrote:
@AndAnotherThing..,
Quote:

For back country, ski's are the answer...


Yep agree, but done properly boarding looks pretty good fun too, carving big lines in the powder. Always looks a pita though when they get stuck on a flat at the bottom......


Yep, it's more about entry and exit than fun on the down.
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 And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
Frosty the Snowman wrote:


I really don't understand the principles involved here


I've probably explained it badly, but in essence if I am following someone down the slope on the same line, if, as happens the downhill skier puts in a turn that is not expected it gives me the option to either pass safely either side rather than limiting the options.
If I have given good space on one side and the downhill skier decides that is the moment they are going to take a heavy turn to the side of the piste, then the safety corridor has vastly narrowed. For me it is about anticipating the unexpected.
I am not talking about passing people at warp speed skimming their ski tips as some seem to have assumed.
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Boarding is fabulous in powder but unforgiving on hardpack (busted shoulder victim...) and a right faff on flats and for touring.
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 You know it makes sense.
You know it makes sense.
Layne wrote:
Fridge03 wrote:
From what I've seen and read though, boarders seem to have it made when the fresh stuff falls? But skiers can cope with harder pistes and ice somewhat better? These are obviously generalisations.

When snowboards started being used one of the main attractions was the float in powder, as was the increased ability to ride switch, do tricks, etc. But that triggered the change in ski design to be able to largely match those characteristics. Just as split boards perhaps give the benefits that independent leg movement has. Hence today there isn't such an obvious reason to go one way or the other - although my feeling is splits are still fairly niche and the ski's just about have the edge for versatility.



If I could become a good skier (AND off-piste skier) to do the types of offpiste I do while snowboarding, and that surfy/floating vibe is similar, I feel like I could be tempted by the dark force and become a skier...

I'm a fairly competent off-piste snowboarder and although I love it, I find it frustrating at times in the backcountry. Every year, learning how to ski is one of my targets but conditions are just too good to waste time (I know...it's not wasted per se...) and snowboarding is so much fun!
When snowboarding, the painful bits are the long traverses where there is a need to hold a high line, or the numerous flat sections to access/exit off-piste runs, etc...Sometimes, I have to strap/unstrap 4,5 times in 20' while typically skiers in my group simply work hard by pushing on the poles with the skis on... Even when fast/technically good enough, you cannot always avoid them...

Splitboarding with foldable poles in the backpack could be a good option, but ski and ski poles seem a bit more versatile...
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 Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
I think the thread's about taking an opportunity to learn something different,
which I think equally well which ever side you approach it from.

Markymark29 wrote:
... the powder. Always looks a pita though when they get stuck on a flat at the bottom...
Actually that's easily avoided almost everywhere simply by looking where you're going. And not falling over in the wrong place. And waxing your board. And not using a park board in powder.

Chattonmill wrote:
... if I am following someone down the slope on the same line....
Then they have the right of way.
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 Poster: A snowHead
Poster: A snowHead
philwig"

[quote="Chattonmill wrote:
... if I am following someone down the slope on the same line....
Then they have the right of way.[/quote]

Absolutely which is why I do everything to pass them safely.
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 Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Used to ski, switched to boarding, started skiing again

Much prefer boarding when you have oodles of fresh snow - however, with limited lessons, my boarding is ok for pistes not so good anywhere else. As falls hurt more now at 52 I went back to skiing as I enjoy my one week a year more and can keep up with kids - one of whom boards.

Being able to ski already I think helps with learning as you know the basics of weight transfer. I'd certainly encourage anyone to give the "other" discipline a go, helps you understand what they will do on the slopes and gives you an appreciation for others
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Chattonmill wrote:
I am not talking about passing people at warp speed skimming their ski tips as some seem to have assumed.


Chattonmill wrote:
Fridge03 wrote:
Morning all,

....or why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?

Very Happy


I am probably guilty of this


Right, got it..................wait, run that by me again Laughing
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I might have missed the Gnats Hair bit Confused
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Quote:

run that by me again


It was at the speed of sound, so you’ll need to listen very carefully.
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@Chattonmill, the speed of sound bit still makes you a bit of a dick though.
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SnoodlesMcFlude wrote:
@Chattonmill, the speed of sound bit still makes you a bit of a dick though.


Now my turn to be confused, what speed of sound bit?
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 After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
After all it is free Go on u know u want to!
Fridge said "why skiers straight line within a gnats hair past you at the speed of sound?"

You replied "I am probably guilty of this"


It's a dick move to ski close to people at speed.
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Always a skier, took up boarding (at over 50) to see what it was about, and because Mr G boards and won't ski. And because I hate ski boot fitting problems!!!!! (Kind of nearly resolved now, I hope.)

Boots are much easier, lighter and overall better for boarding Very Happy
Boards are easier to carry, around town and walking up a hill. Very Happy
Boarding hurts a lot more Sad
Boards lousy on ice Skullie
Boards not drag lift friendly Evil or Very Mad

Found skiing instinctive (not that I'm a super expert), boarding slightly less so, and definitely to me more scary (but then again I'm now a mature, knee-injured wuss!) Need more boarding experience, suspect I could have a lot of fun once in deeper stuff or with the nerve to do jumps. (But the same could be true on skis.)

Enjoy both, skiing will always be my first love but board always travels to the snow too.
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For people saying about it being a pain to clip in and out on flats with the board. I got a set of flow rear entry style bindings (albeit the cheaper version, raven fastec ft270) and clipping in and out is effortless, and takes no time at all.
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