 Poster: A snowHead
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So I’ve just realised my Salomon Skis, bought in BC - the days when disposable cash was a thing, are approaching 20 years old.
I can guess the answer here probably but how good will modern hire skis be in comparison?
I’m a piste only skier reds/blacks.
After using the salomons well for a week most years they have some damage down to the core so thinking putting the repair money towards rentals?
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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I believe skis of today are better than those 20 years ago. It's time to replace your old skis, even if it were undamaged.
So yes, put the repair money towards rentals.
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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@MHskier, The bindings are probably more of an issue than the skis, as they will no longer be under indemnity.
There are far more niches for skis than there were 20 years ago, a go analogy would be coffee shops. You used to have a coffee, now you have 50 varieties. Skis aren’t quite that bad, but not far off. See if you can find somewhere to try before you buy, rather than just buying what’s cheap or what you like the look of.
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
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Only one place for 20yo planks...
Get a loan or creditcard and buy some modern lightweight skis.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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Under indemnity? Is that Warranty?
I’m thinking of renting not buying.
Just wondered what the benefits of mid range but new rented might be.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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Friend of mine had even older skis..got some new ones and he says he cant tell the difference
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Do yourself a favor: take out the garbage and get some new skis, whether rented or purchased. Honestly, your technique will be dated as well, so take a lesson to help you utilize the superior technology more quickly than you'd figure out on your own. It isn't difficult to make the transition, but you have to make it in order to reap the very definite benefits they provide.
As a piste-only skier, consider an all-mountain ski. The added beef & versatility isn't needed on perfect corduroy, but with new snow, cut-up and such, its nice to be able to blast through that stuff.
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Not sure I understand the technique point. I carve on the salomons (they’re not wooden
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Blooming mobile cut my post short...
I went on to say I appreciate I would definitely benefit from coaching but I’m interested what element Of technique would be different due to newer skis?
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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@MHskier, "indemnification" is a north american concept to avoid insurance liability suits.
What @Scooter in Seattle says is more relevant. turn initiation and control on modern (not 20 y.o.) skis is markedly different, more refined.
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And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
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Thanks for that. Definitely going to rent. Will investigate a lesson but chaperoning the family so may not have the freedom to do that.
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@MHskier, I'm not an instructor and others here are. But one thought that helped me make the transition is that old gear and technique were about getting the skis to turn by rotating about their yaw axis. Now its more about the roll axis, rolling the skis onto their edges and they basically turn themselves from there, using the more pronounced sidecut they have vs old skis (when "new school" skis first came out, they were called "shaped", and their wider tips and tails, and narrower waist bear this out). Such skis are easier to ski but their benefits are only realized when they are skied properly. Just stand there and roll your feet from side to side in unison. Then get on the snow and do the same on a gentle cat track/road, and see yourself turning by doing nothing at all other than rolling your ankles. Ramp up the speed and pitch from there.
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You know it makes sense.
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One of the restaurants in Les Contamines has quite a good array of "classic" skis on display. I notice that they have a pair of Dynastar Vertical 203 from I think 1994 unmounted and STILL IN WRAPPERS! They were the cool ski bum option at the time.
Felt like making them an offer for sentimental reasons!
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Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
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If you can carve in the old ski with little side cut, you can carve in the new skis!
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Poster: A snowHead
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I think it all depends on the skis you have, and if they are really 20 years old. Looking at skis from 2000 (Salomon X-Scream for instance), they are a long way from the straight skis we used up to the late 90s. That said, rocker tips, wider skis, and better materials will make todays skis easier to use. Has technique changed a lot in the last 20 years? Not that much, but that doesn't mean a lesson won't help. If you've used the skis a lot then they will have lost some of their spring -- which does make a difference to your skiing.
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Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
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| Scooter in Seattle wrote: |
| ... old gear and technique were about getting the skis to turn by rotating about their yaw axis. .... |
Whilst some instructors and many learners may have been confused about how to turn a ski, experts never were as far as I can tell.
In the 1980s the Brit instructor Ali Ross published books, which explain how to carve pretty well.
Obviously on old gear.
And yes, many of us can do it but choose to use better gear these days.
For what it's worth, Ross and others were also preaching against the expert-beginner "feet together" thing even then.
Does anyone have any (presumably older) skiing manuals which proselytise "yawing" the skis and feet-together?
I'm curious if that was ever expert technique.... or perhaps it was just what they taught beginners, like the snowplough?
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Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
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IIRC It was around 20 years ago that Carving Skis started becoming more mainstream, with skis like the Atomic Beta Carv 9.18 and Salomon X Screams...so the OP's skis could be either type....either way, they're better placed on the wall (or in the bin).
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Tue 28-01-20 18:54; edited 1 time in total
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You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
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| MHskier wrote: |
Blooming mobile cut my post short...
I went on to say I appreciate I would definitely benefit from coaching but I’m interested what element Of technique would be different due to newer skis? |
How much drifting and pivoting do you do? How do you blend different terrain and surface conditions?
Do you pop up for turns, or neutral or sink? How 2 footed do you ski? Do you lift the tail of your inside siki to complete the turn? Can you watch a modern competition mogul skier and understand what they are doing?
You need to get an honest appraisal of where you are at to understand how more modern ski shapes might benefit you? They almost certainly will but it's all a bit of a waste unless you get either the instruction or invest enough time in experimentation/have good self awareness to adapt.
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Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
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| Quote: |
Does anyone have any (presumably older) skiing manuals which proselytise "yawing" the skis and feet-together?
I'm curious if that was ever expert technique.... or perhaps it was just what they taught beginners, like the snowplough?
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BASI 3 (now 2) training -- 1988 included "Refined" (Feet together) and "Basic" (Feet Apart). By 1993 and Grade 2 (now 3 !) it was all feet apart. And yes we could carve on straight skis.
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You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
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I bought my current skis in 2010. They are a good ski: Volkl supersports. Last year in resort I left them in for a good service & rented a pair of Stockli Lasrs for the day.
Now I know the Stocklis are hand made & £1000, but they were a delight to ski on. Quick to edge & really agile in the turn.
I’m guessing at least part of that was down to the manufacturing technique, but I’m sure a lot of it was down to the fact that they are just a newer design.
I would suggest you rent in resort for a day or two to try something new & then decide whether to repair or not.
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"I would suggest you rent in resort for a day or two to try something new & then decide whether to repair or not."
That's the clarity of thought I was after - cheers
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@MHskier, what some of the people are hinting at is you may or may not "like" the 1st pair of new skis you hire. And that maybe because the way you work your old skis may no longer be the way new skis are expected to be used.
So, if you don't like the hire skis, try to take a lesson with a decent instructor specifically to address the differences. Then you can decide.
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You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
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Being french, my girlfriend, when I first met her, had 30 year old boots and 20 year old skis. But as she'd skied since she was a child was still far better than me. She said that up until then she wasn't embarrassed by her gear but I soon changed that  First to go were the skis for some stiff Dynastar women's advanced piste skis. After a few days she admitted that they transformed her skiing being so much more responsive. Initially she found them very tiring to ski. Next the rear entry boots were changed for some stiff K2 boots. After initial tantrums she now finds them comfortable but doesn't think they've made as much difference as the skis.
I still think she has a slightly old fashioned technique and next trip here she's going to have an MOT with a mate of mine from the ESF here.
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20, I've still got a 26 year old pair that get used a lot. My Volkl Explosiv's are still in regular early season / choppy snow use.
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snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
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I had a pair of skis that I loved, and more importantly trusted. I wasn't bothered what they looked like. The problem was that when I started taking 2 kids skiing and the airlines started charging extra baggage it just wasn't worth schlepping them out for one week and then paying to have them serviced to put them away for another year.
So for the last 20 years I've been hiring, and I have to say I have NEVER had a pair of skis I liked as much as my own, I often end up changing them after the first day or two. I agree they turn easier, but I don't think they have the same grip on steep slopes. Maybe its my technique, or maybe its that I used to get mine serviced for each holiday.
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FAQ
