 Poster: A snowHead
|
Hi all,
was hoping ye could give me a bit of advice.
I'm going to do my first snow-boarding in a couple of weeks and I've been buying gear in the sales. This evening I got the last two things: helmet and goggles. I'd been reading here and thought it was best to buy the two together.
Even though I was shopping in my second language (in Switzerland) picking the helmet went fine after trying a few on (i know the routine from buying cycling helmets). But with the goggles I was less happy. I know the shop-assistant sold me a bit dearer than I planned (which I was aware of and didn't especially mind), but the pair I ended up buying are by a company I can see little mention of: "cp eyewear" (made in Germany) and cost 150CHF==100EUR. Also, the assistant was insistent that you would need mirrored-lens goggles to be able to ski in in both bright (without snow-blindness) and dim light. At the time I simply took her advice (it's a very reputable shop), but in hindsight it sounds more than a bit suspect to me (though I am ignorant so maybe I'm wrong).
On the plus side, the goggles fit well with the helmet (I tried about 3 other pairs for fit), are double-lensed, anti-fog and look OK. Haven't yet tried them on slopes for performance though, so anti-fog is a bit theoretical at the moment.
So my question is this: on the face of it does it look like I got done?  Looking on the net it seems I could get Oakleys at this price, and even in Zurich downtown you'd get Alpina/Cebe/Uvex around this price and below, would I be better off with those and should I try and return/exchange?
Any input appreciated!
Michael
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
|
The fact that they don't spend a fortune on brand marketing doesn't make them rubbish. It could even be argued that the big names have spent all their cash on making sure you think their name looks cool and therefore have less left over to spend on quality, ergo their kit is likely to be less good. They fit with your helmet and they have all the necessary technical features - I wouldn't worry about it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
michaelc, I'm not sure CP stuff is made in Germany actually, I thought it was Swiss and a lot of it made in Italy. CP helmets and eyewear are sold in pretty much every sports store in Switzerland and used widely. Excellent kit, who cares if UK punters don't get to buy them? 
Did you get a CP helmet as well?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
michaelc, welcome to snowHeads! 
Sounds like you did fine to me, the cost doesn't look over the top. Not heard the thing about needing mirrored lenses, but I wouldn't claim any knowledge in the area.
If you're going snowboarding, get some padding for your ar$e, I didn't and I got twinges for at least 3 months!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
To the extent that the goggles are not 'worth' EUR100, yes, but no goggles are. Snowsport kit manufacturers rely on fantasically effective marketing to sell mass produced plastic bits and pieces for hundreds of pounds; CP seem to have taken this to the next stage by relying To an extent on other people's marketing to sell their own product at a riduculously inflated price. Your goggs are probably no more of a rip off than any other goggs costing EUR100.
That's the joy of snowsports!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
| richmond wrote: |
| CP seem to have taken this to the next stage by relying To an extent on other people's marketing to sell their own product at a riduculously inflated price. |
They don't rely on other peoples marketing, they just don't market in the UK that's all. They are a well known brand in Switzerland and their eyewear is used in a number of sports. They're also cheaper than the competition for any given product level.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tchibo ski/board goggles £10 , mail order.
Tchibo ski stuff is also sold sometimes in Somerfield supermarkets in the UK. I bought a couple of pairs of those goggles for £7 each recently, and they look fine.
michaelc. Welcome to snowHeads! The majority - probably at least 90% - of people only wear goggles in a white-out/bad light, or when snow is falling (mainly because it stings the eyes). It's much nicer to wear sunglasses in good light, though competitive skiers/boarders tend to wear goggles if high speed is involved, or there's a lot of jolting to the head. High wind into the eyes is upleasant.
So, when you were told that mirrored lenses are necessary, I'd strongly disagree with that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
Tchibo ski/board goggles £10 , mail order.
Tchibo ski stuff is also sold sometimes in Somerfield supermarkets in the UK. I bought a couple of pairs of those goggles for £7 each recently, and they look fine.
michaelc. Welcome to snowHeads! The majority - probably at least 90% - of people only wear goggles in a white-out/bad light, or when snow is falling (mainly because it stings the eyes). |
maybe the last time you skied, but nowadays we've got plastic boots and stuff and people wearing helmets and/or googles look set to become the majority.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
|
|
|
|
ise, I disagree with that prediction, and would put money on it. Next time you go on the slopes in good light, count the proportion of people wearing goggles and helmets.
In 5 years time the numbers of helmet wearers will have increased, but I'd be amazed if it was more than 30% on any European slope.
The proportion of goggle users in good light is highly unlikely ever to be greater than 10%, because people find them sweaty.
We can play around with the percentages, but I'd be happy to lay the bet on agreed percentages.
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
|
I've worn goggles for years now, EOSB was th eonly time in about 5 years that I've tried sunglasses for more than a few minutes - in fact in Les Arcs thie year (Jan) I forgot my glasses and didn;t even notice! All four in our group wore goggles all week long, come sun or come snow.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
|
|
|
|
I used only to wear googles when I had to, but now that I wear a helmet I find them less annoying than I used too. I still prefer sunglasses, tho'  .
Are ise and I the only ones who persistently type 'googles' when we mean 'goggles'?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
|
Most snowboarders seem to wear goggles all the time, which will push the %ages up.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
ise, I disagree with that prediction, and would put money on it. Next time you go on the slopes in good light, count the proportion of people wearing goggles and helmets.
In 5 years time the numbers of helmet wearers will have increased, but I'd be amazed if it was more than 30% on any European slope.
The proportion of goggle users in good light is highly unlikely ever to be greater than 10%, because people find them sweaty.
We can play around with the percentages, but I'd be happy to lay the bet on agreed percentages. |
Prepared to be amazed then, it's at 30% now in many places. And more than 10% of people wear goggles now.
Don't bother with bets, save your money for that once in a lifetime ski trip and find out for yourself.
Last edited by Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name: on Thu 9-02-06 11:50; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| ise wrote: |
| .....and people wearing helmets and/or goggles look set to become the majority. |
I have noticed an increase in helmet-wearers on European slopes - but to be honest, I haven't noticed if the wearers have been wearing goggles or sun-glasses in good light. I can do oblivious.
Do those who wear goggles in all conditions have different pairs of goggles for good and bad light?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
| Nick Zotov wrote: |
I have noticed an increase in helmet-wearers on European slopes - but to be honest, I haven't noticed if the wearers have been wearing goggles or sun-glasses in good light. I can do oblivious.
Do those who wear goggles in all conditions have different pairs of goggles for good and bad light? |
Most people I see wearing helmets have goggles rather than glasses.
I have interchangeable lenses with my goggles, dark or yellow depending on likely light levels that day. I could carry the alternate lens if I could be bothered to, as it slips easily into a pocket, but I don't find that selecting the "wrong" colour is too much of a problem.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
| Nick Zotov wrote: |
| ise wrote: |
| .....and people wearing helmets and/or goggles look set to become the majority. |
I have noticed an increase in helmet-wearers on European slopes - but to be honest, I haven't noticed if the wearers have been wearing goggles or sun-glasses in good light. I can do oblivious.
Do those who wear goggles in all conditions have different pairs of goggles for good and bad light? |
I do, I've some very battered o-frames for "normal" use and a pair of darker mirrored goggles I use in high light, spring for example.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| Quote: |
Prepared to be amazed then, it's at 30% now in many places. And more than 10% of people wear goggles now.
Don't bother with bets, save your money for that once in a lifetime ski trip and find out for yourself. |
Once in a lifetime? More like 42 years out of 52.
No, let's lay that bet. In the meantime, find us a photo of a typical European ski lift queue with over 30% of people wearing helmets.
Last edited by You need to Login to know who's really who. on Thu 9-02-06 11:51; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
Back to the original post  My cebe goggles info booklet states the same thing about mirror effect - that whatever it is they use allows you to ski in bad or good light with the same lenses - rather than needing a good light and a flat light pair - I can't remeber the exact phrasing but judging by my three pairs it is true. The cebe mirror effect ones are fine at all times, and great in flat light, I wear them all the time now - the two older 'normal' lenses don't cut out enough in full sunlight AND don't seem to be that great in flat light as they are a simple mig range orange/pink so never got worn much as it was a faff unless we were really whited out...However my cebe's were E60 I think so you were perhaps a little bit gouged, but not in an abnormal fashion, just your usual sking eqpmt 'prestige' markup 
I'm with cathy on the 'will goggles take over the world' topic. I never used to wear mine as I was very much a fair weather skier - if it snowed I found somewhere to hide and waited it out (easy enough when you are on piste and have markers to follow), if it was extra cold and windy I never went out, and even when I did I was travelling quite sedately. Over my last few holiday I've started to be a little more agressive, getting out in more challenging weather and I find myself more and more in goggles - on the last trip I wore them everyday all day except one afternoon, and that was less to do with practicalities and, erm, actually because my other half had the camera with him and I didn't want to be photo'd in the balaclava and goggles outfit that makes me look like a spectacularly unattractive bond villian's henchman...
As there is a constant supply of new and nervous skiers and a steady level of 'sedate' skiers I doubt one or the other eyewear fashion will win out? However I am willing to undertake a lunchtime survey of ski/board eyewear going past the restaurant when we hti la plagne in a few weeks...anyone else got a trip coming up? Shouldn't be too hard to pool the results into a reasonable sized statistical sample...
aj xx
p.s. richmond - I type goglles - which I think is worse!
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
|
Nick Zotov, I wear goggles all the time now since i started wearing a helment. Sunnies just don't sit right with a helmet on as the side of the helmet squeezes the arms. I have a pair of Von Zipper goggles that i can change the lenses. Yellow for low light/snow and darker tinted/mirror ones for brighter light. It is easy to change the lenses.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
| Quote: |
Prepared to be amazed then, it's at 30% now in many places. And more than 10% of people wear goggles now.
Don't bother with bets, save your money for that once in a lifetime ski trip and find out for yourself. |
Once in a lifetime? More like 42 years out of 52.
|
How's that work then? the first 42?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
rob@rar.org.uk, I do wonder what would happen if I skied in my "poor light" goggles for a long time in bright light. I can see fine in them, and I guess my irises contract a lot. But i do wonder if the light might be too bright for the welfare of my eyes. I have always assumed there was a good reason for using a dark lens in good light. OTOH, I do fins the goggles much better to use than my sun glasses in flat light.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
| ajhainey wrote: |
As there is a constant supply of new and nervous skiers and a steady level of 'sedate' skiers I doubt one or the other eyewear fashion will win out?
|
probably, as more and more people wear helmets they'll wear goggles as well.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
ise, I don't know why you're obsessed with undermining my ski credentials, but no:
I've been skiing from 1959 through 2005, with four gap years.
Sneering at other people, sarcasm, twisting the truth ... are not the best tools of debate!
|
|
|
|
|
|
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
snowHeads are a friendly bunch.
|
|
ise, and Dan, thanks for coming back to me on this. I'm sill not a helmet-wearer - but if falliner brings some helmets to the EOSB, I will have a go - so this information is useful.
|
|
|
|
|
|
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
And love to help out and answer questions and of course, read each other's snow reports.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I bought a fleece for £65 that turned out to be no better than a cheapy. Was I Goggled?
|
|
|
|
|
|
You know it makes sense.
|
| ise wrote: |
| ajhainey wrote: |
As there is a constant supply of new and nervous skiers and a steady level of 'sedate' skiers I doubt one or the other eyewear fashion will win out?
|
probably, as more and more people wear helmets they'll wear goggles as well. |
True, but I'm not convinced that helmets are going to win out either - after many many years there are still more people without than with bike helmets, in the states many people horse ride without one (much much more dangerous) despite knowing the stats and there is always the 'bond villian henchman' vanity argument to boot 
I interested enough to do a quick survey next time I hit the slopes though...I suspect the 'my mates' sample is too twisted to be of much use to us - but for what it is worth of the 50 or so people I know of that ski, I think only 2 have helmets - so say 5%? aj xx
|
|
|
|
|
|
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
Otherwise you'll just go on seeing the one name:
|
| Quote: |
| I bought a fleece for £65 |
That's a lot of money for a sheep. Did it have a helmet?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Poster: A snowHead
|
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
ise, I disagree with that prediction, and would put money on it. Next time you go on the slopes in good light, count the proportion of people wearing goggles and helmets.
In 5 years time the numbers of helmet wearers will have increased, but I'd be amazed if it was more than 30% on any European slope. |
Sorry, haven't read further down that David's post so apologies if I'm repeating, but where we ski in Switzerland about 50-60% of skiers and over 90% of boarders are wearing helmets. I was very surprised at how few there were in Courchevel last week.
| Quote: |
The proportion of goggle users in good light is highly unlikely ever to be greater than 10%, because people find them sweaty.
We can play around with the percentages, but I'd be happy to lay the bet on agreed percentages. |
To be honest, in terms of googles/glasses where there isn't, imo, a massive safety argument, percentages mean absolutely nothing. Go with whatever you're comfortable wearing. For instance, my eyes water in cold weather as soon as I go over walking speed so I wear goggles all the time, regardless of conditions. Some people wear no eyewear at all in a blizzard. So long as you have sufficient visbility it doesn't matter.
Michael, out of interest where did you buy your kit? Ochsner Sport in the Seedammcenter are charging 60-80ish in the sales for the very basic Uvex/Cebe etc models (or were as of 2 weeks ago), everything else is more. If you're happy with the fit and visibility of the goggles you bought, I really wouldn't worry about the odd 20 Stutz here or there
|
|
|
|
|
|
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
Obviously A snowHead isn't a real person
|
Oh look - I do it too
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see?
|
Nick Zotov,
I have two pairs which I carry all the time. A Scott pair for dull/flat light and a Spy pair for brighter light. I wear them for deep snow days when a fall in specs is a pain...well, more of a pain than googles, anyway. I wish I had a pair that coped with all conditions but I don't... If I only had to carry one pair it would be a pair for flat light..
I like the Spy's because the lenses are very clear and snow does clear away very very easily... From new I have always looked after the lenses and only use the proper wipes which seem to impregnate..? the lenses with a special coating which keeps them clean. The Scotts have seen better days and the optical effect is no where near as good, but they do work in flat light...!!
I think it is worth getting lenses - googles or specs - that have a good optical quality but that doesn't always mean you pay through the nose...
BTW I wear contacts on the slopes as well so I have a bit of a thing about optical quality...
Last edited by Well, the person's real but it's just a made up name, see? on Thu 9-02-06 13:59; edited 1 time in total
|
|
|
|
|
|
You need to Login to know who's really who.
You need to Login to know who's really who.
|
| David Goldsmith wrote: |
ise, I don't know why you're obsessed with undermining my ski credentials, but no:
|
If you're going to start make observations about what is and what isn't common on the slopes then it's perfectly reasonable to ask if you actually ever go skiing, that means to ski stations that are recognisably in operation. So, for example, if your skiing experience last season totally a couple of days in June on a glacier then we might decide your "credentials" to comment aren't really sufficient.
So, and you're under no obligation whatsoever to answer, to lend credibility to your observations about what is or isn't commonplace on the slopes, how many days were you actually on the slopes in the last couple of seasons and where?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
Anyway, snowHeads is much more fun if you do.
|
eng_ch, I got mine in Ochsner Sport, in fact, but the one on Bahnhofstrasse in ZH. I'd heard fairly good things about the shop before and I had a good experience myself buying hiking boots there.
The pair I got had a CHF20 discount even at the price I paid. I saw the Uvex/Cebe ones I think you mentioned too, but got distracted by all the brightly coloured plastic and trying to wear a helmet and talk in a foreign language at the same time.
I think the point about fit is most important. The pair I have go well with the helmet, and the helmet goes well with my head. I tried various others that didn't (and if I want to buy or exchange for another pair, I'll have to tote the helmet around while I do this!)
When I'm up on the slopes I'll keep an eye out for the proportions of helmets/goggles/glasses/inuit-snow-blindness-slitted-bones
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_blindness
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll need to Register first of course.
You'll need to Register first of course.
|
ise, I'm not listing my credentials in skiing here. They are extensive, but irrelevant to the statistical data we're discussing.
If we want to know how many people are using helmets and goggles we can count them.
Better still, let's look at some authoritative independent data. The International Society for Safety in Skiing is one source. Last week the distinguished US ski safety research Jasper Shealy quoted 28% using helmets, but I believe this was a US figure.
Anyone know any data from Europe?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
michaelc, I've just invested in helmet & goggles and plumped for mirrored lenses like you. Having just come back from Andorra, I can highly recommend them. I skied in everything from blazing sun to white out and could see clearly whatever the conditions. Just one word of warning....don't forget to pop a pair of sunnies in your pocket...you look more than a little weird sitting on the sun terrace of a restaurant wearing your goggles because it's too sunny not to! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
ise,
| Quote: |
I do, I've some very battered o-frames for "normal" use and a pair of darker mirrored goggles I use in high light, spring for example.
|
I believe that you ski in specs on occasion. How do you get on with using specs under O-frames. I use the L-frame version?
David Goldsmith, I have just returned from Switzerland and the percentage of helmet wearers, with or without goggles was discussed by us more than once as chairlift chatter. We came to a figure of 40% of adults where we were, including one of the ski schools, whose teachers had logo'd helmets. I have tried sunnies and goggles with my helmet, both work fine, my goggles are great for low light, and I have interchangeable lenses on my sunnies, including a low light yellow lens.
|
|
|
|
|
|
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
You'll get to see more forums and be part of the best ski club on the net.
|
|
Just to confuse the issue in an unhelpful way, although I prefer to wear sunglasses with my helmet (mine are comfortable, although bugg*rs to take off and put on without taking the helmet off, which is a nuisance), I also wear my goggles up on my helmet. So, do I count as a goggle wearer?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| snowbunny wrote: |
ise,
| Quote: |
I do, I've some very battered o-frames for "normal" use and a pair of darker mirrored goggles I use in high light, spring for example.
|
I believe that you ski in specs on occasion. How do you get on with using specs under O-frames. I use the L-frame version? |
sounds like you know more about it than me I think the answers yes, they're the O-frame's made for wearing over glasses. I always wear spec's.
| snowbunny wrote: |
| David Goldsmith, I have just returned from Switzerland and the percentage of helmet wearers, with or without goggles was discussed by us more than once as chairlift chatter. We came to a figure of 40% of adults where we were, including one of the ski schools, whose teachers had logo'd helmets. |
Quite, this makes it perfectly reasonable to ask David where and when skis to apparently have such a dissimilar experience to so many of us. We get all kinds of posts from David, correcting our grammar, lecturing us on politics or the environment or the finer points of journalistic ethics, discussing copyright or archiving, the list seems endless really. Yet, on a forum devoted to skiing in the best part of 10,000 postings who can recall any that were contemporaneous and current accounts of actually going skiing? It's hardly surprising someone might question this from time to time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
FAQ
) Anyway, following your comment I looked a bit more through the forums and it seems that a bit of padding on knees and behind could make the difference between relative comfort and extreme discomfort. I know which I'd prefer!
